Bill to repeal Obamacare narrowly defeated in Senate

[Little-Acorn]

Just heard on the local ABC news radio. No link yet. CNN has a headline, nothing else.

51 Senators voted against the repeal.
2 Senators "did not vote".

Hmmm... very close.

As I recall, the reason the Senate didn't get a Republican majority in the last election, was becaue 2/3 of the seats weren't up for a vote.

But another election is coming next year.

[Psychoblues]

Just heard on the local ABC news radio. No link yet. CNN has a headline, nothing else.

51 Senators voted against the repeal.
2 Senators "did not vote".

Hmmm... very close.

As I recall, the reason the Senate didn't get a Republican majority in the last election, was becaue 2/3 of the seats weren't up for a vote.

But another election is coming next year.

And as long as we have 40 Democrats we will filibuster the shit out of any attempt to interfere with reasonable and responsible healthcare options. I'm not happy with what we have right now so you can imagine how I felt about what we had before the Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act. The Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act is polling positively in the 60 percentages and going higher as mopre people begin to understand it and reject the bullshit coming from fauxnews.

PRACA isn't perfect. It just beats the hell out of anything we had before it.

Psychoblues

[Missileman]

Just heard on the local ABC news radio. No link yet. CNN has a headline, nothing else.

51 Senators voted against the repeal.
2 Senators "did not vote".

Hmmm... very close.

As I recall, the reason the Senate didn't get a Republican majority in the last election, was becaue 2/3 of the seats weren't up for a vote.

But another election is coming next year.

The Supreme Court will take care of the repeal for us...no need to worry.

[Missileman]

And as long as we have 40 Democrats we will filibuster the shit out of any attempt to interfere with reasonable and responsible healthcare options. I'm not happy with what we have right now so you can imagine how I felt about what we had before the Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act. The Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act is polling positively in the 60 percentages and going higher as mopre people begin to understand it and reject the bullshit coming from fauxnews.

PRACA isn't perfect. It just beats the hell out of anything we had before it.

Psychoblues

I don't know where you get your info, but Obamacare is polling negatively, not positively.

Among the general public, the Kaiser poll showed 68 percent supportive of a repeal of the individual mandate.

Read more: http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/tim-graham/2010/12/14/amazing-wapo-fails-publish-own-poll-obamacares-lowest-popularity-ever#ixzz1CqvHraCQ

When the mandate goes, and it will, because it's unconstitutional, the rest of the house of cards will crumble with it.

[Psychoblues]

I don't know where you get your info, but Obamacare is polling negatively, not positively.

Among the general public, the Kaiser poll showed 68 percent supportive of a repeal of the individual mandate.

Read more: http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/tim-graham/2010/12/14/amazing-wapo-fails-publish-own-poll-obamacares-lowest-popularity-ever#ixzz1CqvHraCQ

When the mandate goes, and it will, because it's unconstitutional, the rest of the house of cards will crumble with it.

FoxNews just reported last night that the Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act was polling positively at around 62%. I don't do newsbusters. Going there is like going into the monkey house. They sling a lot of shit in that place. I know nothing of anything called "Obamacare".

Healthcare improvement MUST stand. The country cannot sustain further failure in this regard.

Psychoblues

[Missileman]

FoxNews just reported last night that the Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act was polling positively at around 62%. I don't do newsbusters. Going there is like going into the monkey house. They sling a lot of shit in that place. I know nothing of anything called "Obamacare".

Healthcare improvement MUST stand. The country cannot sustain further failure in this regard.

Psychoblues

I actually watch Fox News and you're full of shit.

[jimnyc]

I know nothing of anything called "Obamacare".

This is far from the 1st time I have seen you show your displeasure with the right referring to this as "Obamacare".

How can you do so with a straight face when you've been using names like "reichwing" and other "jabs" for the years I have known you.

At least "Obamacare" is labeling a piece of legislation where your insults are generally at the individuals you are debating.

[NightTrain]

I actually watch Fox News and you're full of shit.


Of course he is, the poor little fella got his positives and negatives mixed up :



http://politics.blogs.foxnews.com/2011/01/20/fox-poll-shows-obama-s-boost-comes-left-not-center

...
Today's results on health care are instructive on this point too.

Sixty one percent of the respondents want the president's law either repealed or scaled back compared to 34 percent who want to maintain or expand it. Fifty six percent would have voted with House Republicans to repeal it and only 18 percent believe they will benefit personally from the law.

[SassyLady]

And as long as we have 40 Democrats we will filibuster the shit out of any attempt to interfere with reasonable and responsible healthcare options. I'm not happy with what we have right now so you can imagine how I felt about what we had before the Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act. The Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act is polling positively in the 60 percentages and going higher as mopre people begin to understand it and reject the bullshit coming from fauxnews.

PRACA isn't perfect. It just beats the hell out of anything we had before it.

Psychoblues

Can you tell us why so many companies are opting out and getting waivers from the Obama Administration? If this plan is so good for everyone, why isn't everyone breaking down the doors to use it?

[Missileman]

Can you tell us why so many companies are opting out and getting waivers from the Obama Administration? If this plan is so good for everyone, why isn't everyone breaking down the doors to use it?

The White House has issued 733 waivers so far...not surprisingly, 40% of them have gone to unions.

[Psychoblues]

This is far from the 1st time I have seen you show your displeasure with the right referring to this as "Obamacare".

How can you do so with a straight face when you've been using names like "reichwing" and other "jabs" for the years I have known you.

At least "Obamacare" is labeling a piece of legislation where your insults are generally at the individuals you are debating.

Well damn, jimnyc!!! At damned least!!!!!! Have you ever seen me curse or call anybody names for using that ridiculous name for the Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act? Lemme answer that for you. No. And if there were a more appropriate nickname for the law it should be Dolecare, or Republicare or something along that line as about 98% of the law came directly from Republican bills.

BTW, I haven't used the "reichwing" thing in several days now as I've had several conversations with people I respect here on that issue. I have agreed that I will refrain from that "jabbing" as you might call it and see what happens. In addition, although I have that p.o.s. I had trouble with a few weeks ago on ignore, he continues his childish shit. For whatever reason, it seems to me that you may have encouraged him. Also, I had about 1500 points just disappear in one fell swoop and I've never found out what that was all about.

Anyway, jimbo, I am trying to do better. It's not easy in this monkey house and all the shit throwing going on everywhere all the time but I am trying.

Thanks for telling the whole fuckin' world what you think of me, jerkwad!!!!

Psychoblues

[fj1200]

And as long as we have 40 Democrats we will filibuster the shit out of any attempt to interfere with reasonable and responsible healthcare options. I'm not happy with what we have right now so you can imagine how I felt about what we had before the Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act. The Patients Rights and Affordable Care Act is polling positively in the 60 percentages and going higher as mopre people begin to understand it and reject the bullshit coming from fauxnews.

PRACA isn't perfect. It just beats the hell out of anything we had before it.

Psychoblues

You should just put that in your signature, it would save you valuable internets.

[Psychoblues]

You should just put that in your signature, it would save you valuable internets.

One thing I learned in first tier politics was to be persistent on your own. I change my game up from time to time according to circumstances but the message still gets out. Internets or not.

Psychoblues


Can you tell us why so many companies are opting out and getting waivers from the Obama Administration? If this plan is so good for everyone, why isn't everyone breaking down the doors to use it?

I suppose if someone has the right and desire to opt out then that is fine with me. Do you have some spooky, ominous or scary explation for all this strange stuff happening even while,,,,,,,,,,WE TRY TO SLEEP!!!!!!!!!!

Why do rightwingers resent freedom so much?

Psychoblues


The White House has issued 733 waivers so far...not surprisingly, 40% of them have gone to unions.

Unions have had the best healthcare and insurance in the nation for decades, Mm. Why would they not seek waivers? Maybe the nation should follow the Union model and save money, get better care, experience less aggravation and live happier lives? Seems reasonable to me.

Psychoblues

[Missileman]

Unions have had the best healthcare and insurance in the nation for decades, Mm. Why would they not seek waivers? Maybe the nation should follow the Union model and save money, get better care, experience less aggravation and live happier lives? Seems reasonable to me.

Psychoblues

They're getting tax waivers on their extremely expensive "cadillac" plans. Apparently, you have no clue what the union model is all about.

[Psychoblues]

They're getting tax waivers on their extremely expensive "cadillac" plans. Apparently, you have no clue what the union model is all about.

Au contraire, Mm. I've been involved in negotiating many of them. Admittedly I haven't kept up these last 10 years or so but I do know the professionally negotiated Union policies are the best that anyone could expect from a cost/coverage perspective.

Psychoblues

[Missileman]

Au contraire, Mm. I've been involved in negotiating many of them. Admittedly I haven't kept up these last 10 years or so but I do know the professionally negotiated Union policies are the best that anyone could expect from a cost/coverage perspective.

Psychoblues

Well pull your head out of your ass ten years worth and read up on what the waiver is about for the unions.

[Psychoblues]

Well pull your head out of your ass ten years worth and read up on what the waiver is about for the unions.

It seems you intentionally ignorant folks are a helluva lot more concerned about it than me. You say "Union" like you're spitting shit between your teeth. What's an average American guy like me supposed to think about that?

Psychoblues

[Missileman]

It seems you intentionally ignorant folks are a helluva lot more concerned about it than me. You say "Union" like you're spitting shit between your teeth. What's an average American guy like me supposed to think about that?

Psychoblues

So you don't care what the waiver is for. As long as your messiah says it's okay, you're along for your drunken ride.

And yes, I think the unions are directly responsible in part for the loss of jobs here in the US. They don't add any value to a company...on the contrary, they encourage mediocrity and low production while demanding higher wages and ridiculous benefits.

[Psychoblues]

So you don't care what the waiver is for. As long as your messiah says it's okay, you're along for your drunken ride.

And yes, I think the unions are directly responsible in part for the loss of jobs here in the US. They don't add any value to a company...on the contrary, they encourage mediocrity and low production while demanding higher wages and ridiculous benefits.

I have no messiah on this Earth, Mm. Just which one have you picked out for yourself? If you keep dragging drinking into our conversations I'm gonna have to start getting more aggressive in exposing your shortfalls and such. I don't think you want us to go there much further than we already do.

Think in one hand and shit in the other, Mm. Which one is getting full? I don't think, I know that unions generally provide a more qualified, a better educated, a more motivated, a happier and thus more productive workforce than their lesser paid, dis-organized and generally miserable non-union counterparts.

Psychoblues

[Missileman]

I have no messiah on this Earth, Mm. Just which one have you picked out for yourself? If you keep dragging drinking into our conversations I'm gonna have to start getting more aggressive in exposing your shortfalls and such. I don't think you want us to go there much further than we already do.

In all honesty...if you are really on the wagon, you need to have yourself checked out by a doc...I suspect you have some serious PERMANENT brain damage.


Think in one hand and shit in the other, Mm. Which one is getting full? I don't think, I know that unions generally provide a more qualified, a better educated, a more motivated, a happier and thus more productive workforce than their lesser paid, dis-organized and generally miserable non-union counterparts.

Psychoblues

Look no further than the teacher's union for an example of what I claimed and you're denying.

[Psychoblues]

In all honesty...if you are really on the wagon, you need to have yourself checked out by a doc...I suspect you have some serious PERMANENT brain damage.



Look no further than the teacher's union for an example of what I claimed and you're denying.

And just what indicates to you that I have any brain damage any more than I might think of your ridiculous merry-go-round arguments about EVERYTHING? I keep in touch with my doc pretty close these days. I ain't no spring chicken.

The teacher's union has a good number of problems, tenure first and foremost among them. But, let's take a good honest look at where "tenure" came from. It came from the colleges, universities and other schools themselves as a way to fairly compensate and retain well qualified and experienced professors and teachers. It has morphed into something quite different but I don't fault the Union for that. The educational elites negotiated all that on their own and nobody got shot doing it.

You got more exceptions to the rule to share, Mm?

Psychoblues

[red states rule]

http://media.townhall.com/Townhall/Car/b/02-03-11overreachRGB20110203104051.jpg

[red states rule]

I know you will not put forth the effort to read this PB - but this guy is the former associate director of the OMB and he takes all of your talking points apart with - damn - facts




The Congressional Budget Office says repealing the Affordable Care Act would increase the deficit by $230 billion over the coming decade and by a modest amount in the decade after that. The CBO estimate has become the central defense by ACA advocates fighting the upcoming repeal vote in the House.

They might want to re-think their strategy. A close examination of CBO's work and other evidence undercuts this budget-busting argument about repeal and leads to the exact opposite conclusion, which is that repeal is the logical first step toward restoring fiscal sanity.

Federal finances are buckling under the weight of unaffordable entitlement programs. So what is the primary aim of the ACA? Open-ended entitlement expansion: to more people at greater expense than anytime since the 1960's. If CBO is right, 32 million people will be added to the health entitlement rolls, at a cost of $938 billion through 2019, and growing faster than the economy or revenues thereafter.

How, then, does the ACA magically convert $1 trillion in new spending into painless deficit reduction? It's all about budget gimmicks, deceptive accounting, and implausible assumptions used to create the false impression of fiscal discipline.

For starters, that $1 trillion price is a low-ball estimate, covering only six – not ten – years of subsidies that don't begin until 2014. The uninsured were clearly less of a priority than the deception of making the law look less expensive than it really is over its first decade. Over ten years of full implementation, it's more like $2.3 trillion.

Next up is the CLASS Act (for the Community Living Assistance Services and Supports Act) providing a new long-term care insurance entitlement. CLASS hitched a ride on the ACA for one reason only: premiums are collected in the first ten years, but no benefits are provided. Voila, it creates the perception of $70 billion in deficit reduction. In fact, CLASS is a bailout waiting to happen, as it will attract mainly sick enrollees. Only in Washington could the creation of a reckless entitlement program be used as "offset" to grease the way for another entitlement.

The deepest spending cuts in the ACA are in Medicare. Let us be very clear: Medicare needs real reform that generates genuine budget savings. Sadly, the ACA's cuts are illusory. Medicare's payments to health care providers would fall below those of Medicaid. The network of hospitals and physicians willing to care for Medicaid patients is notoriously constrained. About 15 percent of the nation's hospitals would have to stop seeing Medicare patients in just a few years to stem their losses. The idea that Medicare could pay less than Medicaid is such sheer folly that Congress will rapidly reverse course. What's worse, ACA's advocates are double-counting this fictional savings, claiming it can pay both for the ACA's entitlements and Medicare solvency too. The truth is, these cuts cannot be relied upon to pay for anything.

The fantasy of deficit reduction from the ACA is also built on a $410 billion tax increase over the coming decade, and a flood of revenue in the years after built on cynically replicating the flawed AMT-style revenue creep. New Medicare taxes initially apply only to individuals with incomes over $200,000 and couples with incomes above $250,000. But those income thresholds do not rise with inflation, so more and more families will pay them each year. Similarly, the new "Cadillac tax" on expensive insurance applies to premiums for family coverage above $27,500 in 2018, but that threshold will rise with general inflation, not medical costs. It's particularly noteworthy that this tax is instrumental to the claim of deficit reduction in the second decade, but it is so controversial that Barack Obama was never willing to collect it himself. Overall, CBO says the ACA's tax hikes will reach 1.2 percent of GDP in 2035, or a whopping $180 billion annually in today's terms.

So, even if CBO's analysis were flawless, the authors of the ACA guaranteed a misleading bottom line. Their legislative prescriptions were written to create deficit reduction only on paper -- not in reality.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703954004576089702354292100.html