Arizona Republicans Resign

[bullypulpit]

Turns out a number of Arizona Republicans have resigned in the wake of last Saturday's tragedy. Among those was Anthony Miller, chairman of the GOP in Arizona's 20 legislative district. He resigned, specifically citing threats to himself and his family by members of the Tea Party.

<center><a href=http://www.azcentral.com/community/ahwatukee/articles/2011/01/11/20110111gabrielle-giffords-arizona-shooting-resignations.html#ixzz1AqMYTq70>Gabrielle Giffords' Arizona shooting prompts resignations</a></center>

<center><a href=http://voices.washingtonpost.com/44/2011/01/tucson-shooting-prompts-local.html>Some Arizona Republican party officials resign after Tucson shooting</a></center>

A sad commentary on what has become of the GOP as it has sought to move the country even further to the right.

[jon_forward]

Tea party ties???? You really need more then ties to make this load full

[Kathianne]

Tea party ties???? You really need more then ties to make this load full

Bully and reality have parted company. Election 2008 seemed to have sealed that deal for him.

[bullypulpit]

Bully and reality have parted company. Election 2008 seemed to have sealed that deal for him.

No, dear lady...the right wing, and it's supporters, ran off those rails a long time ago. Oh, and your responses were sadly typical. Can't debate the message, so you attack the messenger.

[fj1200]

No, dear lady...the right wing, and it's supporters, ran off those rails a long time ago. Oh, and your responses were sadly typical. Can't debate the message, so you attack the messenger.

Just because you ignore the thread, Progressive Hate (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?30419-Progressive-Hate), doesn't mean you can ignore the evidence.

[Little-Acorn]

I must have missed the section of the articles where the guy quoted even one threat from a TEA Party member, and/or identified any TEA Party member as a source of anything that worried him.

Oddly, such identification seems to be missing from EVERY article where leftists announce that the TEA party is doing something wrong.

Just coincidence, no doubt.

[Kathianne]

No, dear lady...the right wing, and it's supporters, ran off those rails a long time ago. Oh, and your responses were sadly typical. Can't debate the message, so you attack the messenger.

Bully, it's been more than evident for awhile. The fact that you ignored my direct thread to you regarding signing statements says volumes more than your posts.

Until all want the country to succeed, meaning that they speak up when their 'side' does wrong, we'll continue our downward spiral. I guess from you, as long as a (D) leads us there, all is good.

[Psychoblues]

Try this thread and article on the same subject for size and enlightenment.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?30432-Gabrielle-Gifford-s-Arizona-Shooting-Prompts-Resignations


Bully is correct. It is the right wingers in general but the teabaggers in particular that have made many elected Republicans feel threatened for themselves and their families and subsequently resign their positions. So much for a democracy?!?!

Psychoblues

[BoogyMan]

No, dear lady...the right wing, and it's supporters, ran off those rails a long time ago. Oh, and your responses were sadly typical. Can't debate the message, so you attack the messenger.

Did you notice the article said he resigned a couple of hours after the shootings? It was a knee jerk reaction.

Gads Bully, how much does the nutjob left pay you to come here and make a fool of yourself like this?

[Psychoblues]

Did you notice the article said he resigned a couple of hours after the shootings? It was a knee jerk reaction.

Gads Bully, how much does the nutjob left pay you to come here and make a fool of yourself like this?

Knee jerk? That is hardly the case. How about "last straw" for a metaphor?

Psychoblues

[logroller]

I, for one, say good riddance. our country doesn't need officials who run when they are faced with adversity. It's no wonder terrorists think they can succeed. I imagine the signers of the declaration of independence faced similar threats but they still "... pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."

[Psychoblues]

I, for one, say good riddance. our country doesn't need officials who run when they are faced with adversity. It's no wonder terrorists think they can succeed. I imagine the signers of the declaration of independence faced similar threats but they still "... pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."

I wonder what they would have done with 280 million people and 300 million semi automatic weapons aimed at them?

Psychoblues

[Kathianne]

Try this thread and article on the same subject for size and enlightenment.

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?30432-Gabrielle-Gifford-s-Arizona-Shooting-Prompts-Resignations


Bully is correct. It is the right wingers in general but the teabaggers in particular that have made many elected Republicans feel threatened for themselves and their families and subsequently resign their positions. So much for a democracy?!?!

Psychoblues

Pb you are not just stretching, you are breaking all known bonds. Whatever. Seems you join bully in delusions.

[Psychoblues]

Pb you are not just stretching, you are breaking all known bonds. Whatever. Seems you join bully in delusions.

Are you saying that article that I link to does not charge the teabaggers with complicity? You know better than that, Kath!!!!!!!!!

Psychoblues

[fj1200]

Are you saying that article that I link to does not charge the teabaggers with complicity? You know better than that, Kath!!!!!!!!!

Psychoblues

Still ignoring the hate on the left 'eh sparky?

[Thunderknuckles]

No one has played the card on this yet. Probably because it's getting old and labeling conservatives as cold blooded assassins has a nicer ring to it :p

[Psychoblues]

Still ignoring the hate on the left 'eh sparky?

The subject concerns conservatives being hounded out of office by teabaggers and other reichwingers, fj200. Care to join in or will you sit this one out?

:laugh2::laugh2:

Psychoblues

[fj1200]

The subject concerns conservatives being hounded out of office by teabaggers and other reichwingers, fj200. Care to join in or will you sit this one out?

:laugh2::laugh2:

Psychoblues

No, I just like to focus on what you choose to ignore.

[Psychoblues]

No, I just like to focus on what you choose to ignore.

I have no idea what you are speaking of but I am certain it has nothing to do with me or this thread.

Psychoblues

[fj1200]

I have no idea what you are speaking of...

Yeah that's about right from you.

[logroller]

I wonder what they would have done with 280 million people and 300 million semi automatic weapons aimed at them?

Psychoblues

At worst -- died free men!

[fj1200]

I wonder what they would have done with 280 million people and 300 million semi automatic weapons aimed at them?

Psychoblues

I think that's your problem, those weapons were aimed WITH them not AT them.

[Psychoblues]

Yeah that's about right from you.
Complete the quote and address your own ignorance. I have not entered any conversation with you ar anyone else as to your now apparent concerns. The conversation remains as stated above. Do you care to join in or just just run your tater trap?

Psychoblues

[Psychoblues]

At worst -- died free men!

You ain't much of a history buff, are you, lr?

Psychoblues

[Psychoblues]

I think that's your problem, those weapons were aimed WITH them not AT them.

There was at least as much American political animosity and difference of opinion then as now, fj. There was and remains plenty of infighting and even death to protect what we consider rights. To each his own cup of tea.

Psychoblues

[logroller]

You ain't much of a history buff, are you, lr?

Psychoblues

learn me something...because I missed the part about renouncing your office due to fear of your life!

[BoogyMan]

Knee jerk? That is hardly the case. How about "last straw" for a metaphor?

Psychoblues

Sure sparky, the rest of us can read! :)

[Psychoblues]

learn me something...because I missed the part about renouncing your office due to fear of your life!

You said they all died free men. I don't think so. I didn't say a word about them, the founders, renouncing their offices due to anything. The records are very unclear about any of that but many conclusions can be drawn if you search them out and I welcome you to try them out. Thousands of books and thousands of PhD theses have been written on this very subject and all with little agreement.

If you are to learn anything I would suggest starting with your closest library.

Psychoblues

[logroller]

I wonder what they would have done with 280 million people and 300 million semi automatic weapons aimed at them?

Psychoblues


At worst -- died free men!

Dude I answered your hypothetical that introduced conditions which werent historical accurate so save me the reference i thought u might actually have something to add to my understanding and by the way I qualified a condition to my response as at worst not what actually happened so read what i say before u attack my understanding
sorry about the runon sentence< my shift button is stuck!

[Psychoblues]

Dude I answered your hypothetical that introduced conditions which werent historical accurate so save me the reference i thought u might actually have something to add to my understanding and by the way I qualified a condition to my response as at worst not what actually happened so read what i say before u attack my understanding
sorry about the runon sentence< my shift button is stuck!

Dude, that was no hypothetical. Do you know what a hypothetical is? Your answer, however, was a hypothetical and an inaccurate one. What's the beef? I'm not trying to attack anything, lr. Hell, I like talking to you. You make far more sense than most of these knee jerk (pun intended) right wingers on this board!!!!!

Psychoblues

[logroller]

Dude, that was no hypothetical. Do you know what a hypothetical is? Your answer, however, was a hypothetical and an inaccurate one. What's the beef? I'm not trying to attack anything, lr. Hell, I like talking to you. You make far more sense than most of these knee jerk (pun intended) right wingers on this board!!!!!

Psychoblues

I like to argue, with anyone and everyone (makes me a dick to be around) but enough about me-- how is your question not hypothetical, I assumed you were talking about the founding fathers in re: my reference to dec of independance. cause there werent semi weapons back then, and I doubt America would stand 280 million strong for anything. Wish they could, but we wouldn't have a forum here if that was possible.

[Psychoblues]

I like to argue, with anyone and everyone (makes me a dick to be around) but enough about me-- how is your question not hypothetical, I assumed you were talking about the founding fathers in re: my reference to dec of independance. cause there werent semi weapons back then, and I doubt America would stand 280 million strong for anything. Wish they could, but we wouldn't have a forum here if that was possible.

I don't have anyone much to argue with anymore except on this dadburn typing machine but like you I always enjoy a good disagreement!

You came into this conversation saying "What a coward" as if there were only one and as if you think the resignation was a result of any cowardice. Them are some mighty big and mighty wrong assumptions. I won't do elementary research for you but the answers to that can be found right here in this thread. You may have to follow a link or 2. You also made inappropriate references to the founding fathers. You don't have a clue what the founding fathers did or would do based on anything happening then and especially what is happening now. This thread pertains to particular Republican politicos that now see fit to resign their elected positions based on physical fear for the safety of their families and themselves. That's real, my friend, and no hypothetical.

Then you said, "At worst--died free men". I really wanted to ignore that one as I have to assume that you would have preferred they had died British slaves as in "At best--died British slaves". My statement refered to this century, this population and this firepower threat if the teabaggers and/or those like them can sucessfully ignite or incite a large scale revolution. I have my weapons and am well trained to use them. I will allow no threat from anyone concerning my politics, freedom such as it is and my love of the USA. And then I just pointed out that you don't know much about American history. I stand by that.

Then you wanted me to "learn you something". Don't you think that's a bit juvenile for an otherwise serious conversation? Oh, damn. I know you were joking!!!!! In any event, you seemed to want me to explain to you why you said something about someone renouncing their office. I have absolutely no freaking clue as to what you really mean by that as I believe these politicos resigned their positions without renunciation of any kind. Smart as you are, lr, the subtleties and nuances don't escape you, yes?

Then you got excited about the hypotheticals. I hope that by now we have discussed that sufficiently so I will not belabor the point any further. I also tried unsuccessfully to qualify my remarks to no avail. Maybe we're talking past each other. Let me be the first to raise my hands and say in a high pitched voice, GUILTY!!!!!!! And again, lr, I cannot envision a circumstance where I might attack you in any way. That's not a promise as I note you caught me a little off guard tonight and I don't know how serious you were about it or what you may do in the future. But one thing is for certain. I will not enter any thread that you start or are participating in and attack you. You may take my remarks personally and attack me and I reserve the right not to acquiesce. I hope you don't have a problem with that.

As far as your last post, that's why I spent some time on this one. I learned over in middle Tennessee, never fuck with the logrollers!

Psychoblues

[fj1200]

There was at least as much American political animosity and difference of opinion then as now, fj. There was and remains plenty of infighting and even death to protect what we consider rights. To each his own cup of tea.

Psychoblues

So you would have been pointing out how violent the original tea partiers were then? We'd all be speaking with British accents ;) if the country was made up of your types back then.

[Psychoblues]

So you would have been pointing out how violent the original tea partiers were then? We'd all be speaking with British accents ;) if the country was made up of your types back then.

Jesus Freaking Christ!!!!!!! You don't know shit, fj. Study up on the Boston Tea Party and get back with me. You turdheads would be anathema for them.

There were a lot more like me back then than you might realize. But, that's another thread or perhaps a few university level books. How long are you gonna keep whining? You were out of any legitimate dialogue here long ago.

Psychoblues

[fj1200]

^Testy tonight 'eh? I'm just trying to post like a lib, some crap here some BS there...

[Psychoblues]

^Testy tonight 'eh? I'm just trying to post like a lib, some crap here some BS there...

OK. The humor escaped me. Somehow conservatives have a problem with the delivery.

A belated Ha Ha Ha

Psychoblues

[logroller]

I don't have anyone much to argue with anymore except on this dadburn typing machine but like you I always enjoy a good disagreement!

You came into this conversation saying "What a coward" as if there were only one and as if you think the resignation was a result of any cowardice. Them are some mighty big and mighty wrong assumptions. I won't do elementary research for you but the answers to that can be found right here in this thread. You may have to follow a link or 2. You also made inappropriate references to the founding fathers. You don't have a clue what the founding fathers did or would do based on anything happening then and especially what is happening now. This thread pertains to particular Republican politicos that now see fit to resign their elected positions based on physical fear for the safety of their families and themselves. That's real, my friend, and no hypothetical.

Then you said, "At worst--died free men". I really wanted to ignore that one as I have to assume that you would have preferred they had died British slaves as in "At best--died British slaves". My statement refered to this century, this population and this firepower threat if the teabaggers and/or those like them can sucessfully ignite or incite a large scale revolution. I have my weapons and am well trained to use them. I will allow no threat from anyone concerning my politics, freedom such as it is and my love of the USA. And then I just pointed out that you don't know much about American history. I stand by that.

Then you wanted me to "learn you something". Don't you think that's a bit juvenile for an otherwise serious conversation? Oh, damn. I know you were joking!!!!! In any event, you seemed to want me to explain to you why you said something about someone renouncing their office. I have absolutely no freaking clue as to what you really mean by that as I believe these politicos resigned their positions without renunciation of any kind. Smart as you are, lr, the subtleties and nuances don't escape you, yes?

Then you got excited about the hypotheticals. I hope that by now we have discussed that sufficiently so I will not belabor the point any further. I also tried unsuccessfully to qualify my remarks to no avail. Maybe we're talking past each other. Let me be the first to raise my hands and say in a high pitched voice, GUILTY!!!!!!! And again, lr, I cannot envision a circumstance where I might attack you in any way. That's not a promise as I note you caught me a little off guard tonight and I don't know how serious you were about it or what you may do in the future. But one thing is for certain. I will not enter any thread that you start or are participating in and attack you. You may take my remarks personally and attack me and I reserve the right not to acquiesce. I hope you don't have a problem with that.

As far as your last post, that's why I spent some time on this one. I learned over in middle Tennessee, never fuck with the logrollers!

Psychoblues

Admittedly, I don't have the highest level of understanding regarding history, it is limited. However, though limited, it isnt defunct. In consideration of American values, as they were intended, I generally start with the first official document of our great country: The Declaration of Independance. Those words ring as loud and clear today as they did then, and upon signing this paper, the signatories sealed their own fate. As it worked out, through Divine providence or whatever twist of fate, they were America's founders, but they could have been a footnote on colonial rebellion and they didn't know that with any certainty their endeavor would be fruitful- they accepted that freedom and representation is of sufficient value to risk death or imprisonent--why shouldn't the govt representatives today be held to the same standard. that's all i meant.

[Psychoblues]

Admittedly, I don't have the highest level of understanding regarding history, it is limited. However, though limited, it isnt defunct. In consideration of American values, as they were intended, I generally start with the first official document of our great country: The Declaration of Independance. Those words ring as loud and clear today as they did then, and upon signing this paper, the signatories sealed their own fate. As it worked out, through Divine providence or whatever twist of fate, they were America's founders, but they could have been a footnote on colonial rebellion and they didn't know that with any certainty their endeavor would be fruitful- they accepted that freedom and representation is of sufficient value to risk death or imprisonent--why shouldn't the govt representatives today be held to the same standard. that's all i meant.

From whom should our present day politico's revolt? And what makes you think they would not if equivalent threats were made against them? In this case these lower level politico's had no provision for protection other than what they could provide for themselves and many of them are quite middle class and cannot afford personal protection. Our founders were EVERY one rich_white_men that could afford all the protection they wanted. In addition, they were already in immediate control of significant military resourses. We can bicker back and forth all you like in this respect but your assumptions continue to be completely wrong.

Psychoblues

[NightTrain]

Our founders were EVERY one rich_white_men that could afford all the protection they wanted.

They were all wealthy, eh? Wrong again. Here's a quick list:

John Adams
Samuel Adams
Josiah Bartlett
Carter Braxton
Charles Carroll
Samuel Chase
Abraham Clark
George Clymer
William Ellery
William Floyd
Benjamin Franklin
Elbridge Gerry
Button Gwinnett
John Hancock
Lyman Hall
Benjamin Harrison
John Hart
Joseph Hewes
Thomas Heyward, Jr.
William Hooper
Stephen Hopkins
Francis Hopkinson
Samuel Huntington
Thomas Jefferson
Francis Lightfoot Lee
Richard Henry Lee
Francis Lewis
Philip Livingston
Thomas Lynch, Jr.
Thomas McKean
Arthur Middleton
Lewis Morris
Robert Morris
John Morton
Thomas Nelson, Jr.
William Paca
Robert Treat Paine
John Penn
George Read
Caesar Rodney
George Ross
Benjamin Rush
Edward Rutledge
Roger Sherman
James Smith
Richard Stockton
Thomas Stone
George Taylor
Charles Thomson
Matthew Thornton
George Walton
William Whipple
William Williams
James Wilson
John Witherspoon
Oliver Wolcott
George Wythe
Abraham Baldwin
Richard Bassett
Gunning Bedford, Jr.
John Blair
William Blount
David Brearly
Jacob Broom
Pierce Butler
Daniel Carroll
George Clymer
Jonathan Dayton
John Dickinson
William Few
Thomas Fitzsimons
Benjamin Franklin
Nicholas Gilman
Nathaniel Gorham
Alexander Hamilton
Jared Ingersoll
William Jackson
Daniel of St. Thomas Jenifer
William Samuel Johnson
Rufus King
John Langdon
William Livingston
James Madison
James McHenry
Thomas Mifflin
Gouverneur Morris
Robert Morris
William Paterson
Charles Cotesworth Pinckney
Charles Pinckney
George Read
John Rutledge
Roger Sherman
Richard Dobbs Spaight
George Washington
Hugh Williamson
James Wilson
William Richardson Davie
Oliver Ellsworth
William Houston
William Houstoun
John Lansing, Jr.
Alexander Martin
Luther Martin
James McClurg
John Francis Mercer
William Pierce
Caleb Strong
George Wythe
Robert Yates
Elbridge Gerry
George Mason
Edmund Randolph

They were not all wealthy, want to take another shot at it, Sport?



In addition, they were already in immediate control of significant military resourses. We can bicker back and forth all you like in this respect but your assumptions continue to be completely wrong.

Psychoblues

LOL, they were, were they? What kind of significant military resources did each one of those Founding Fathers listed above command?

Your command of history and willingness to continue to assert asinine half-baked thoughts as fact is laughable. You are a fool, and demonstrate it further with every post you make.

[Psychoblues]

logroller, here is a link to information about the founders and the Declaration of Independence. I think you will find it surprising and enlightening. There are a number of links from this one but you can get the overall gist with this one. Most of the other links are simply verifying where the information comes from although sometimes the links go a long way towards additional clarification.

Check it out: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Declaration_of_Independence

Psychoblues

[fj1200]

Wow, quite the Wikipedia education today. We are all so much the smarter for it. :rolleyes:

[Psychoblues]

Wow, quite the Wikipedia education today. We are all so much the smarter for it. :rolleyes:

fj, are you trying to be cute or are you always shitting out your mouth? I often advise people with whom I am speaking to get an education, buy a few books, go to the library, etc. I now believe simply linking them to a trustworthy encyclopedic resourse that will give them fantastic information on a Cliff's Notes version and link on to hundreds more sites, articles, etc. can share much more information about the topic in a much more comprehensive way. It may also encourage additional competent conversation coming from all sides of the issue at hand or lead to another topic for which we might want to engage in gentlemanly disagreement. It beats watching you throw shit at the wall and licking your fingers.

Psychoblues

[fj1200]

fj, are you trying to be cute or are you always shitting out your mouth? I often advise people with whom I am speaking to get an education, buy a few books, go to the library, etc. I now believe simply linking them to a trustworthy encyclopedic resourse that will give them fantastic information on a Cliff's Notes version and link on to hundreds more sites, articles, etc. can share much more information about the topic in a much more comprehensive way. It may also encourage additional competent conversation coming from all sides of the issue at hand or lead to another topic for which we might want to engage in gentlemanly disagreement. It beats watching you throw shit at the wall and licking your fingers.

Psychoblues

I'm trying to come up with new ways to engage you in intelligent debate. My original way wasn't working so I'm now trying to lower myself to your level, perhaps you can raise up to mine by brushing up on the following:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socratic_method

[Psychoblues]

I'm trying to come up with new ways to engage you in intelligent debate. My original way wasn't working so I'm now trying to lower myself to your level, perhaps you can raise up to mine by brushing up on the following:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socratic_method

The Socratic Method is a wonderful way of debate in a different venue. It's pretty useless in this one as there is little actual debate here at all. Take yourself for instance. You're still chunking shit and licking your fingers. I just don't associate that with the Socratic Method.

Psychoblues

[fj1200]

The Socratic Method is a wonderful way of debate in a different venue. It's pretty useless in this one as there is little actual debate here at all. Take yourself for instance. You're still chunking shit and licking your fingers. I just don't associate that with the Socratic Method.

Psychoblues

I guess I was too subtle and nuanced for ya.

[Psychoblues]

I guess I was too subtle and nuanced for ya.

You don't have anything original to say so you repeat what I said. That's pretty much like throwing shit and licking your fingers.

Psychoblues

[fj1200]

Oh, it was original. ;)

:laugh:

[Psychoblues]

Oh, it was original. ;)

:laugh:

Nothing original about it.

Zoom Zoom Zoom. Not much into sarcasm, parodies and metaphors either, I note.

Zoom Zoom Zoom.

It would be nice to return to the subject at hand. Or maybe not.

Psychoblues

Psychoblues

[logroller]

From whom should our present day politico's revolt? And what makes you think they would not if equivalent threats were made against them? In this case these lower level politico's had no provision for protection other than what they could provide for themselves and many of them are quite middle class and cannot afford personal protection. Our founders were EVERY one rich_white_men that could afford all the protection they wanted. In addition, they were already in immediate control of significant military resourses. We can bicker back and forth all you like in this respect but your assumptions continue to be completely wrong.

Psychoblues

I certainly wouldn't SAY anything about revolting against our govt: that's treason. Any violence towards a public official with demonstrated political motovation should be considered treasonous and be punished accordingly. I'm not saying blackball the guy; just that if you don't have the courage to endure threats to your life and you quit: it gives the nutjobs a feather in their hat that threats can, and do, accomplish their intended result. We can argue over what constitutes cowardice, but the issues which plague our society run deep and generate animous in both directions; to which our representatives must be willing to endure distress if any significant gain is to be acheived -- martyrdom may it be!

If we spent more on servicing the aspirations of the people, rather than fearmongering and political posturing, such occurances would fail to garner much support. We spend millions to incarcerate drug offenses and the enterprises which utilize them, while illegal immigrants send millions back to many of the same countries which harbor such cartels-- it's ludicrous, we're fighting against an enemy we created. Perhaps all the DEA agents could lateral to representative protection, instead of penal justice? End the drug war, give immigrants a more profitable path to citizenship, quit villifying people and start celebrating them-- is this so outrageous an idea as to place my life in jeopardy? Maybe; but right or wrong, I believe standing up for what you believe in despite opposition is inherent within, as Jefferson said, "...the sentiments of America."