major security leak uncovered

[namvet]

WASHINGTON -- Shocking in scope if not in content, the leak of 91,000 classified U.S. records on the Afghanistan war by the whistle-blower website Wikileaks.org is one of the largest unauthorized disclosures in military history.
WikiLeaks posted the documents Sunday. The New York Times, London's Guardian newspaper and the German weekly Der Spiegel were given early access to the records.


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/07/25/papers-leaked-documents-unreported-afghan-deaths-fears-insurgency/

Wikileaks is online. get all you want- that's they're job. leaking classifed or other important docs. no matter who's lives are at risk. the terrorist must have an unlimited subscription !!!

http://wikileaks.org/


hDcnBeY_t3c

[Kathianne]

I thought the leaks out of the CIA during the Bush administration were wrong, as are these.

[namvet]

I thought the leaks out of the CIA during the Bush administration were wrong, as are these.

those leaks were from liberals inside the Bush admin.. but here we have online leaks. complete with a website. it may have taken years to come up with 91,000. if that's the real number

[hjmick]

Firing squad or life in prison?

Discuss...

[Kathianne]

Firing squad or life in prison?

Discuss...

I'm assuming this:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704532204575397141587756232.html?m od=googlenews_wsj


JULY 29, 2010, 11:43 A.M. ET
Evidence Ties Manning to Afghan Leaks
By JULIAN E. BARNES

WASHINGTON—Investigators have found concrete evidence linking Pfc. Bradley Manning with the leak of classified Afghanistan war reports, a defense official said.

A search of the computers used by Pfc. Manning yielded evidence he had downloaded the Afghanistan war logs, which span from 2004 until 2009, the official said. It's not clear precisely what that evidence is...

An editorial also found on WSJ:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703940904575395500694117006.html?m od=googlenews_wsj


JULY 29, 2010
WikiLeaks 'Bastards'

The website has endangered the lives of Afghan informants.
Julian Assange, the editor of the WikiLeaks website that on Monday released some 92,000 classified military documents, has told the German newsweekly Der Spiegel that he "loved crushing bastards." We wonder if the "bastards" he has in mind include the dozens of Afghan civilians named in the document dump as U.S. military informants. Their lives, as well as those of their entire families, are now at terrible risk of Taliban reprisal.

The past decade has seen more than its share of debates about the government's right to secrecy, the public's right to disclosure, and where the line between them should...

[hjmick]

That'd be him.

[Kathianne]

That'd be him.

I think the reason it's being underplayed is explained in the "Bastards" piece, also why it is very dangerous:


...They reveal nothing that wasn't already widely known about Iranian and Pakistani support for the Taliban. In other words, their value in terms of the public's right to know is de minimis.

But the closer we and others have looked at the documents, it's clear that the WikiLeaks dump does reveal a great deal about the military's methods, sources, tactics and protocols of communication. Such details are of little interest to the public at large, and they are unlikely to change many minds about the conduct, or wisdom, of the war. But they are of considerable interest to America's avowed enemies and strategic competitors such as Russia and China....

[revelarts]

I agree that leaks are wrong many times but sometimes there's no other way people are going to know what the gov't is doing.
The news media has a hard time getting strait answers form politicians and the military. And when they do sometimes they don't even report it.

I've been on this site more than once quoting people that have said thing contrary to the official gov't military spin and been told that the sources are bad, etc. well here are leaks directly from the military confirming in writing that military has been killing more civilians than officially reported, the fact that our allies in Pakistani Secret service are working with the Tailiban, and more.
Many of these things have been reported in alternative or online media I've read over the years. But not so much on FOX or MSNBC.

the thing that Really stand out to me is the fact that the Pakistanis are a working with the Taliban and our military knows it.

Compare that to the head of the CiA's comments about making sure the the Taliban NEVER have a place in Afghanistan.

What wrong with this?

We pay the Pakistani's BILLIONS to be our friend. the CIA has worked with the ISI and Pakistani since before 9-11.

there more to the story here.

[namvet]

I agree that leaks are wrong many times but sometimes there's no other way people are going to know what the gov't is doing.
The news media has a hard time getting strait answers form politicians and the military. And when they do sometimes they don't even report it.

I've been on this site more than once quoting people that have said thing contrary to the official gov't military spin and been told that the sources are bad, etc. well here are leaks directly from the military confirming in writing that military has been killing more civilians than officially reported, the fact that our allies in Pakistani Secret service are working with the Tailiban, and more.
Many of these things have been reported in alternative or online media I've read over the years. But not so much on FOX or MSNBC.

the thing that Really stand out to me is the fact that the Pakistanis are a working with the Taliban and our military knows it.

Compare that to the head of the CiA's comments about making sure the the Taliban NEVER have a place in Afghanistan.

What wrong with this?

We pay the Pakistani's BILLIONS to be our friend. the CIA has worked with the ISI and Pakistani since before 9-11.

there more to the story here.


I agree that leaks are wrong many times but sometimes there's no other way people are going to know what the gov't is doing.


with lives and property at stake the media and the people should be left out. any compromise and people die.
that' one thing i liked about Cheney. he knew when to STFU !!!!

[namvet]

DEVELOPING: The Wall Street Journal is reporting that investigators have found concrete evidence linking Army Pfc. Bradley Manning with the leak of tens of thousands of classified Afghan War documents.

A defense official told the paper that a search of computers used by Manning produced evidence he downloaded sensitive reports spanning from 2004 until 2009 --files published this week by a whistle-blowing website.

Officials are also looking for evidence of who helped Manning provide the documents to WikiLeaks, the online group that released 76,000 classified documents and is said to hold another 15,000 reports from the same cache.

Investigators are still combing through Manning's computers to determine what other material he may have stolen -- and to figure out what information WikiLeaks may already possess.


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/07/26/army-whistleblower-bradley-manning-linked-afghan-war-leaks/

motive??? this is a followup from here:

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?28711-major-security-leak-uncovered

[revelarts]

with lives and property at stake the media and the people should be left out. any compromise and people die.
that' one thing i liked about Cheney. he knew when to STFU !!!!

I thought the people where suppose to run the thing?

So the Military is in charge, just trust and obey?

The way to stop guys from getting killed is uh bring them home.
There's an idea.

[namvet]

I thought the people where suppose to run the thing?

So the Military is in charge, just trust and obey?

The way to stop guys from getting killed is uh bring them home.
There's an idea.

you still don't get it. the people do NOT run military ops

military ops are classified. its called need to only. so. if you the people/media expose them your sons and daughters die. got it??? its as simple as that.

so. if i leak a doc to the media about you son involved in a secret op and he gets killed what do you think of me??? and the media if their involved???

ill wait for your answer

[revelarts]

I've answered that before. I said that, many times it's not a great thing to leak info.
But you've yet to give me a good reply to how people are suppose to find out what the heck the soldiers are doing in our name with our money if the military decides to lie and cover up? Not for thier safety but to COVER THERE A's. Remember Pat Tilman?
The people are suppose decide the general tenor, to say who to fight and when to stop. Without honest info, we can't press our reps to make those calls. There's no need for details on every troops movements or positions names and addresses.

I want to bring them home NOW the next soldier that dies over there you think about the leak that tells you that the Pakistanis are working WITH the Taliban to kill our guys and the Military brass know it but decided you didn't need to.

[Kathianne]

I've answered that before. I said that, many times it's not a great thing to leak info.
But you've yet to give me a good reply to how people are suppose to find out what the heck the soldiers are doing in our name with our money if the military decides to lie and cover up? Not for thier safety but to COVER THERE A's. Remember Pat Tilman?
The people are suppose decide the general tenor, to say who to fight and when to stop. Without honest info, we can't press our reps to make those calls. There's no need for details on every troops movements or positions names and addresses.

I want to bring them home NOW the next soldier that dies over there you think about the leak that tells you that the Pakistanis are working WITH the Taliban to kill our guys and the Military brass know it but decided you didn't need to.

Seems you are arguing something altogether different. You disagree with what the government is doing with the military. The answer to that is not to put the troops or allies in harm's way, but for YOU to work for politicians that agree with you.

The military's assignments are determined by civilian politicians.

[namvet]

I've answered that before. I said that, many times it's not a great thing to leak info.
But you've yet to give me a good reply to how people are suppose to find out what the heck the soldiers are doing in our name with our money if the military decides to lie and cover up? Not for thier safety but to COVER THERE A's. Remember Pat Tilman?
The people are suppose decide the general tenor, to say who to fight and when to stop. Without honest info, we can't press our reps to make those calls. There's no need for details on every troops movements or positions names and addresses.

I want to bring them home NOW the next soldier that dies over there you think about the leak that tells you that the Pakistanis are working WITH the Taliban to kill our guys and the Military brass know it but decided you didn't need to.


But you've yet to give me a good reply to how people are suppose to find out what the heck the soldiers are doing in our name with our money if the military decides to lie and cover up?

if you want the answers he's in the WH. he makes ALL the calls.

you seem to have trouble understanding the system.

[Gaffer]

When secret stuff is leaked people die. Maybe you know them, maybe you don't. They are not famous statesmen or politicians. They are regular joes with family and friends. They are doing dangerous jobs either as soldiers or in secret as agents. The leaking of classified info is purely for political purposes and nothing other than that. It's to make somebody look bad and there is no caring about the individual that has to suffer the consequences of the action. The leaker suffers nothing and most times isn't even prosecuted.

The military only follows the orders of the CIC. The person is elected to that position. Just another thing to think about when voting. War is the responsibility of congress. They waved their responsibility for declaring war back in the 50's. It's now up to the CIC and congress just approves the spending. which means they can approve spending on a war while mouthing about how wrong the war is and we should get out. When secrets are leaked it's not congressmen that get killed. It's regular joes again.

[Kathianne]

Haven't seen this in any US news accounts:

Bradley Manning, suspected source of Wikileaks documents, raged on his Facebook page - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/afghanistan/7918632/Bradley-Manning-suspected-source-of-Wikileaks-documents-raged-on-his-Facebook-page.html)


Bradley Manning, suspected source of Wikileaks documents, raged on his Facebook page
Bradley Manning, the prime suspect in the leaking of the Afghan war files, raged against his US Army employers and "society at large" on his Facebook page in the days before he allegedly downloaded thousands of secret memos, The Daily Telegraph has learnt.

By Heidi Blake, John Bingham and Gordon Rayner
Published: 10:00PM BST 30 Jul 2010

The US Army intelligence analyst, who is half British and went to school in Wales, appeared to sink into depression after a relationship break-up, saying he didn't "have anything left" and was "beyond frustrated".

In an apparent swipe at the army, he also wrote: "Bradley Manning is not a piece of equipment," and quoted a joke about "military intelligence" being an oxymoron...

The Pentagon, which is investigating the source of the leak, is expected to study Mr Manning’s background to ascertain if they missed any warnings when he applied to join the US Army. The postings on his Facebook page are also likely to form part of the inquiry.

Mr Manning, who is openly homosexual, began his gloomy postings on January 12, saying: "Bradley Manning didn't want this fight. Too much to lose, too fast."

...

[namvet]

if convicted he'll have a life time to think it over. at levenworth

[Kathianne]

if convicted he'll have a life time to think it over. at levenworth

If convicted. Seriously, one would think the military would do basic background checks, especially for someone with dual citizenship.

[namvet]

If convicted. Seriously, one would think the military would do basic background checks, especially for someone with dual citizenship.

they did in my war. but now the so called loyal muzzies are let in.

[revelarts]

http://www.veteransforpeace.org/

august 3, 2010
VETERANS AND MILITARY FAMILIES SAY PENTAGON STATEMENTS ON WIKILEAKS AIM TO CLOUD REAL ISSUES

Our organizations represent veterans and military families. We have personally carried the burden of the war in Afghanistan, along with wars past. We are glad that the truth about the war is getting out to the public with the recent 92,000 documents on Wikileaks. Hopefully, this will inspire a massive outcry against this war that is wreaking so much destruction to our exhausted and demoralized troops and their families while draining our national coffers.

Obama administration officials are trying to spin events in their favor. Their words must be carefully examined. On the one hand, in an effort to downplay the significance of the release, we are told the documents contain no new information.

On the other hand, some high ranking members of the U.S. military are trying to: 1) intimidate anyone else from doing the same thing and 2) turn public opinion against whoever leaked the current documents. Towards those goals, we are told that grievous harm will surely come to many Afghans and U.S. military personnel - if not now then certainly later.

A more damning statement could hardly be imagined than this one from Admiral Mullen, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, "The truth is they might already have on their hands the blood of some young soldier or that of an Afghan family."

While we certainly do not wish to see one additional person put at risk in this tragic, wrongheaded war, we must state the following as clearly as we can.

As veterans and families with members in the military, we consider statements like Admiral Mullen's to be nothing more than calculated attempts to turn public attention away from the real problem - the ongoing occupation of Afghanistan that has already caused the deaths and injuries of many thousands of innocent people all the while millions of Americans are jobless and face foreclosure or eviction.

This suffering in Afghanistan and this bleeding at home will continue as long as our troops remain in that country. Congress must stop funding this war. We must bring our troops home now, take care of them properly when they return and pay to rebuild the damage we have caused to Afghanistan.

# # #

Founded in 1985, Veterans For Peace is a national organization of men and women veterans of all eras and duty stations spanning the Spanish Civil War (1936-39), World War II, the Korean, Vietnam, Gulf and current Iraq wars as well as other conflicts cold or hot. It has chapters in nearly every state in the union and is headquartered in St. Louis, MO. Our collective experience tells us wars are easy to start and hard to stop and that those hurt are often the innocent. Thus, other means of problem solving are necessary. Veterans For Peace: Exposing the true costs of war and militarism since 1985.

Military Families Speak Out is an organization of people opposed to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan who have relatives or loved ones who are currently in the military or who have served in the military since the fall of 2002.

Iraq Veterans Against the War is a national organization comprised of active duty, guard, and reserve troops and veterans who have served since 9/11. We call for immediate withdrawal of all occupying forces from Iraq and Afghanistan, reparations to the people of those countries, and full benefits for returning service members.

[Kathianne]

Yep, Veterans for Peace also praised Howard Zinn. http://www.examiner.com/x-10438-Human-Rights-Examiner~y2010m1d29-Veterans-for-Peace-Salute-Howard-Zinn

[Gaffer]

Follow the money. Look into who finances vfp. I vaguely recall reading something on it but can't remember what just now. I'll have to look it up.

This is a group made up of liberals, wannabe's and pretenders, and I don't for minute believe they have 8000 members.

[Kathianne]

Follow the money. Look into who finances vfp. I vaguely recall reading something on it but can't remember what just now. I'll have to look it up.

This is a group made up of liberals, wannabe's and pretenders, and I don't for minute believe they have 8000 members.

Money:

http://www.bbb.org/charity-reviews/stlouis/veterans-and-military/veterans-for-peace-in-st-louis-mo-4980

scroll down, that's where you get why they don't meet the BBB standards.

Seems some ties to Soros based organization:

http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/groupProfile.asp?grpid=6244

[LuvRPgrl]

I thought the people where suppose to run the thing?

So the Military is in charge, just trust and obey?

The way to stop guys from getting killed is uh bring them home.
There's an idea.

Not such a good one.

The thousands in the twin towers were home, and they died

[LuvRPgrl]

I've answered that before. I said that, many times it's not a great thing to leak info.
But you've yet to give me a good reply to how people are suppose to find out what the heck the soldiers are doing in our name with our money if the military decides to lie and cover up? Not for thier safety but to COVER THERE A's. Remember Pat Tilman?
The people are suppose decide the general tenor, to say who to fight and when to stop. Without honest info, we can't press our reps to make those calls. There's no need for details on every troops movements or positions names and addresses.

I want to bring them home NOW the next soldier that dies over there you think about the leak that tells you that the Pakistanis are working WITH the Taliban to kill our guys and the Military brass know it but decided you didn't need to.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOO, the people are not suppose to decide the general tenor, who to fight and when to stop, thats what the Commander in Chief is for

[SassyLady]

I agree that leaks are wrong many times but sometimes there's no other way people are going to know what the gov't is doing.
The news media has a hard time getting strait answers form politicians and the military. And when they do sometimes they don't even report it.

I've been on this site more than once quoting people that have said thing contrary to the official gov't military spin and been told that the sources are bad, etc. well here are leaks directly from the military confirming in writing that military has been killing more civilians than officially reported, the fact that our allies in Pakistani Secret service are working with the Tailiban, and more.
Many of these things have been reported in alternative or online media I've read over the years. But not so much on FOX or MSNBC.

the thing that Really stand out to me is the fact that the Pakistanis are a working with the Taliban and our military knows it.

Compare that to the head of the CiA's comments about making sure the the Taliban NEVER have a place in Afghanistan.

What wrong with this?

We pay the Pakistani's BILLIONS to be our friend. the CIA has worked with the ISI and Pakistani since before 9-11.

there more to the story here.

And, now that you, John Q Public, has access to the information, what are you going to do with it?

[Gaffer]

Money:

http://www.bbb.org/charity-reviews/stlouis/veterans-and-military/veterans-for-peace-in-st-louis-mo-4980

scroll down, that's where you get why they don't meet the BBB standards.

Seems some ties to Soros based organization:

http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/groupProfile.asp?grpid=6244

Thanks Kath, I have been looking but wasn't having much luck. I do tend to remember soro's having something to do with this group along with moveon and a couple of other left wing groups including code pink.

[Insein]

Why is it leaks on how our military operates, who our agents in the field are and how we can find them and our general tactics as a whole? Why is everything leaked based on our military?

Why do we never have leaks on the secret back door deals between our congressmen on our domestic policy that steals billions more dollars from our pockets EVERYDAY than the men and women fighting on the ground defnding our freedom? Just another attack from the enemy within.