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Little-Acorn
01-06-2010, 12:01 PM
Yes, I thought it was a joke by some overheated blogger when I first saw this claim. But the text of Obama's speech yesterday, as found on the official White House website, shows it's accurate.

What on Earth is going on here?


http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2010/01/05/urgency-getting-right

"Finally, some have suggested that the events on Christmas Day should cause us to revisit the decision to close the prison at Guantanamo Bay. So let me be clear. It was always our intent to transfer detainees to other countries only under conditions that provide assurances that our security is being protected.

"With respect to Yemen in particular, there's an ongoing security situation which we have been confronting for some time, along with our Yemeni partner. Given the unsettled situation, I've spoken to the Attorney General and we've agreed that we will not be transferring additional detainees back to Yemen at this time.

"But make no mistake: We will close Guantanamo prison, which has damaged our national security interests and become a tremendous recruiting tool for al Qaeda. In fact, that was an explicit rationale for the formation of al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula."

-Barack Obama


Let me get this straight.

Obama is saying that Al Qaeda did not exist on the Arabian Peninsula before we started putting the worst of the terrorists into Gitmo???

Remind me again, which country did most of the 9/11 hijackers come from?

And how many terrorists had we put into Gitmo before they perpetrated the 9/11 attacks?

On a hopefully-unrelated note, I see where Nancy Pelosi announced yesterday that Congress's work on the Health Care bills has been the most open and transparent process ever.

(shaking head in bewilderment)

Do these people in Washington exist in some parallel universe somewhere?

And these aren't small, irrelevant bloggers on some BBS playing with their computers. These are the TWO HIGHEST ELECTED OFFICIALS IN THE U.S. GOVERNMENT saying these things... and they are serious!

Am I the only one who finds this going far beyond "alarming"?

CSM
01-06-2010, 12:09 PM
It is obvious that this administration is not only out of touch with the citizens of this country but out of touch with reality as well.

Mr. P
01-06-2010, 12:22 PM
It is obvious that this administration is not only out of touch with the citizens of this country but out of touch with reality as well.

No kidding...to say "our Yemeni partner" is bazaar!

Monkeybone
01-06-2010, 12:41 PM
so... are we just gonna stick our heads in the sand from now on and not really go after these guys anymore? Just try and not offened them? yah.. let me know how that works out.

cat slave
01-08-2010, 02:57 AM
Could it be that the great apologizer didnt grovel enough to Americas enemies?

DragonStryk72
01-08-2010, 12:54 PM
Yes, they do live in their own world. He is right that it became a recruiting poster for Al Qaeda, that part I've been saying for some time now. You can't act like Machiavellian schemers without people deciding you're the bad guy.

However, by no means do I believe that is what formed up Al Qaeda on the Arabian Peninsula. But in the end, it is the fault of the voters in this country, because we keep giving them jobs, and we fall for the rhetoric, or we back a lame horse on basis that he's the "least shitty".

stephanie
01-08-2010, 01:01 PM
I'm afraid of what 2010 is going to look like for our Security..a lot of dry runs already, one pulled off at Fort Hood, and one undie bomber foiled by regular folks on a plane

people might want to start PREPARING..now.

red states rule
01-08-2010, 01:30 PM
Yes, they do live in their own world. He is right that it became a recruiting poster for Al Qaeda, that part I've been saying for some time now. You can't act like Machiavellian schemers without people deciding you're the bad guy.

However, by no means do I believe that is what formed up Al Qaeda on the Arabian Peninsula. But in the end, it is the fault of the voters in this country, because we keep giving them jobs, and we fall for the rhetoric, or we back a lame horse on basis that he's the "least shitty".

So how will closing GItmo, moving the terrorists to IL, and giving in to terrorist improve our stauture in the terrorist world?

Can you name ONE terrorists who was a law adiding citizen, memebr of the PTA, and typical family guy - who saw a news report on Gitmo and THEN became a terrorist?

Kathianne
01-08-2010, 01:46 PM
and guess what the victims of America's harsh treatment want?

http://blog.newsweek.com/blogs/declassified/archive/2010/01/06/guantanamo-is-not-ever-going-to-be-closed.aspx


...Already, moderate GOP Rep. Mark Kirk, the likely Republican nominee in next year's Illinois Senate race, has taken an increasingly hard line on the transfers, saying they would make Illinois "ground zero for jihadist terrorist plots."

Part of Bellinger's reluctant calculation that Gitmo will stay open is that there is little chance in the midst of the 2010 midterm election campaign that Congress will lift the rider to permit detainees to be moved into the U.S. If Republicans make big gains in the fall elections, as many analysts now predict, the odds of lifting the anti-Gitmo rider would become even steeper.

But the final irony is that many of the detainees may not even want to be transferred to Thomson and could conceivably even raise their own legal roadblocks to allow them to stay at Gitmo.

Falkoff notes that many of his clients, while they clearly want to go home, are at least being held under Geneva Convention conditions in Guantánamo. At Thomson, he notes, the plans call for them to be thrown into the equivalent of a "supermax" security prison under near-lockdown conditions.

"As far as our clients are concerned, it's probably preferable for them to remain at Guantánamo," he says.

red states rule
01-08-2010, 01:48 PM
and guess what the victims of America's harsh treatment want?

http://blog.newsweek.com/blogs/declassified/archive/2010/01/06/guantanamo-is-not-ever-going-to-be-closed.aspx

and I thought the terrorists would stop hating us since the nation elected Obama

At least that what we were told

stephanie
01-08-2010, 02:00 PM
and I thought the terrorists would stop hating us since the nation elected Obama

At least that what we were told

yeah, we were suppose to get our MORAL standing back in the world since they got rid of the cowboy Bush and elected a Messiah..

remember what P.T. Barnum said..:laugh2:

DragonStryk72
01-09-2010, 03:03 PM
So how will closing GItmo, moving the terrorists to IL, and giving in to terrorist improve our stauture in the terrorist world?

Can you name ONE terrorists who was a law adiding citizen, memebr of the PTA, and typical family guy - who saw a news report on Gitmo and THEN became a terrorist?

Would you like the number of Fox News quotes as to their Home Grown Terrorists report the other day? I'm sure I can locate it with little difficulty. Also, let's look at places in the Middle East, instead of at our own culture for a second. Here's a scenario: your brother is grabbed off the street, thrown in prison without miranda rights, or even so much as the chance to say "I didn't do it". You are not permitted to see him, know anything about his case, obtain legal representation, nothing, because he was labelled an "enemy combatant" to get around treating him as a pow, and has been listed as a terrorist. Now, assuming you love your brother, how long before you start getting militant to get him out? Whatever else they might be, these people have friends and families back home, and they're going to be biased against us. How difficult for recruiter to convince you at that point that the men who kidnapped your brother are the bad guys?

How is closing Gitmo, and holding onto our integrity "giving in"? We gave in when we built Gitmo, when we forfeited essential liberties for temporary security, when we abandoned the morales we knew were right to embrace fear.

red states rule
01-09-2010, 03:32 PM
Would you like the number of Fox News quotes as to their Home Grown Terrorists report the other day? I'm sure I can locate it with little difficulty. Also, let's look at places in the Middle East, instead of at our own culture for a second. Here's a scenario: your brother is grabbed off the street, thrown in prison without miranda rights, or even so much as the chance to say "I didn't do it". You are not permitted to see him, know anything about his case, obtain legal representation, nothing, because he was labelled an "enemy combatant" to get around treating him as a pow, and has been listed as a terrorist. Now, assuming you love your brother, how long before you start getting militant to get him out? Whatever else they might be, these people have friends and families back home, and they're going to be biased against us. How difficult for recruiter to convince you at that point that the men who kidnapped your brother are the bad guys?

How is closing Gitmo, and holding onto our integrity "giving in"? We gave in when we built Gitmo, when we forfeited essential liberties for temporary security, when we abandoned the morales we knew were right to embrace fear.

I would like names of law abiding citizens who because of Gitmo became terrorists

There have been many terrorists who have been released from Gitmo who returned to the battlefiled and MURDERED innocent civilians. Of course, according to the left, that is also Bush's fault because they were in Gitmo

Also, terrorists do not have rights under the US Constitution or the GC. You are smart enough to know that so please do not bore me with the "rights" of terrorists

Clsoing Gitmo wil not reduce the number of terrorists or stop them from wanting us dead. All it wil do is make the town in IL a target, and add cases to already crowded Federal Court system

It will also cost taxpayers more money that do not have

stephanie
01-09-2010, 03:39 PM
I wonder what Jimmah Carter and Billy Clinton did to piss off the terrorist that attacted us, the didn't have gitmo?

I swear these people can come up with any excuse to blame America first.

red states rule
01-09-2010, 03:43 PM
I wonder what Jimmah Carter and Billy Clinton did to piss off the terrorist that attacted us, the didn't have gitmo?

I swear these people can come up with any excuse to blame America first.

and Gitmo was not around on 9/11 either

I am fded up with people trying to pass the buck and make excuses for these terrorist bastards

With all due respect DragonStryk72, you will not win this war with law books, and court room trials

A bullet to the head is all the SOB's understand - and that is what will win this war and keep them from killing innocent people

DragonStryk72
01-09-2010, 04:24 PM
I would like names of law abiding citizens who because of Gitmo became terrorists

There have been many terrorists who have been released from Gitmo who returned to the battlefiled and MURDERED innocent civilians. Of course, according to the left, that is also Bush's fault because they were in Gitmo

Also, terrorists do not have rights under the US Constitution or the GC. You are smart enough to know that so please do not bore me with the "rights" of terrorists

Clsoing Gitmo wil not reduce the number of terrorists or stop them from wanting us dead. All it wil do is make the town in IL a target, and add cases to already crowded Federal Court system

It will also cost taxpayers more money that do not have

You didn't answer my question to you, so I'll take it as a win. It will remove the stain from our own honor though, which you will not address. We are better than the terrorists, so why do we need Gitmo? We can win without this kind of dishonorable methodology, so why use it? there's no good answer for it, no reason why we shouldn't close it down. If we've screwed the cases into the ground, then that's our own fault for acting like the enemy we are trying to beat.

You still sink to their level, RSR. No, we don't "have to" grant them rights, but then I've never said we did. Just as we don't "have to" put a 2nd Amendment into place, or the first or fourth for that matter. However, abandoning what we stand for, such as we did with Gitmo, can only lead to further abasement of what our Founders stood for.

And you're saying that people thrown in Gitmo seem to hate us more, and have decided we're the enemy? NO!!! I can't figure out how people imprisoned with no rights at all by the people attacking their country could possibly be seen as the enemy.

Speaking as a taxpayer, I don't give a shit if it costs more, I would rather lose the money, and keep my country's integrity, but maybe you're different than that. Let's go ahead and take down the recruiting poster for Al Qaeda, and move on to doing something that will actually work, and maintain honor

stephanie
01-09-2010, 04:35 PM
Well like they said, they don't care what it cost them to maintain their idea of what this country's "integrity" should be...
Hell it didn't seem 9/11 and 3000 American citizens was even enough for these people..

As long as THEY have that INTERGITY..

red states rule
01-09-2010, 04:36 PM
You didn't answer my question to you, so I'll take it as a win. It will remove the stain from our own honor though, which you will not address. We are better than the terrorists, so why do we need Gitmo? We can win without this kind of dishonorable methodology, so why use it? there's no good answer for it, no reason why we shouldn't close it down. If we've screwed the cases into the ground, then that's our own fault for acting like the enemy we are trying to beat.

You still sink to their level, RSR. No, we don't "have to" grant them rights, but then I've never said we did. Just as we don't "have to" put a 2nd Amendment into place, or the first or fourth for that matter. However, abandoning what we stand for, such as we did with Gitmo, can only lead to further abasement of what our Founders stood for.

And you're saying that people thrown in Gitmo seem to hate us more, and have decided we're the enemy? NO!!! I can't figure out how people imprisoned with no rights at all by the people attacking their country could possibly be seen as the enemy.

Speaking as a taxpayer, I don't give a shit if it costs more, I would rather lose the money, and keep my country's integrity, but maybe you're different than that. Let's go ahead and take down the recruiting poster for Al Qaeda, and move on to doing something that will actually work, and maintain honor

In war you do what you have to do to WIN

You think this is a game of honor. You are a very weak person who the terrorists are getting help from. You will thump your chest and play by "rules" while they kill and laugh at you. Your weakness will be exploited by them

I do not need weak people like you to tell me we need to fight a PC war - we can't win fighting by your "rules"

We have Gitmo to keep people like you from bogging down the process by making sure their "rights" are protected, by getting lawyerd up, and taking years for their trail to go throught he process

So while you fight this war with law books, the terrorists fight this war with bombs and bullets. They kill while you lecture

bullypulpit
01-10-2010, 11:47 AM
Yes, I thought it was a joke by some overheated blogger when I first saw this claim. But the text of Obama's speech yesterday, as found on the official White House website, shows it's accurate.

What on Earth is going on here?



Let me get this straight.

Obama is saying that Al Qaeda did not exist on the Arabian Peninsula before we started putting the worst of the terrorists into Gitmo???

Remind me again, which country did most of the 9/11 hijackers come from?

And how many terrorists had we put into Gitmo before they perpetrated the 9/11 attacks?

On a hopefully-unrelated note, I see where Nancy Pelosi announced yesterday that Congress's work on the Health Care bills has been the most open and transparent process ever.

(shaking head in bewilderment)

Do these people in Washington exist in some parallel universe somewhere?

And these aren't small, irrelevant bloggers on some BBS playing with their computers. These are the TWO HIGHEST ELECTED OFFICIALS IN THE U.S. GOVERNMENT saying these things... and they are serious!

Am I the only one who finds this going far beyond "alarming"?

You are, of course, entitled to your opinion on the issue...But not to your own set of facts. The facts as they are belie your opinion...

<blockquote>"...there are serving U.S. flag-rank officers who maintain that the first and second identifiable causes of U.S. combat deaths in Iraq – as judged by their effectiveness in recruiting insurgent fighters into combat – are, respectively the symbols of <b>Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo</b>" - <a href=http://armed-services.senate.gov/statemnt/2008/June/Mora%2006-17-08.pdf>Statement of Alberto Mora to the Senate Committee on Armed Services, 6/17/2008</a></blockquote>

<blockquote>"...the United States has been damaged by Guantánamo beyond any immediate security benefits. Our enemies have achieved a propaganda windfall that enables recruitment to violence, while our friends have found it more difficult to cooperate with us." - <a href=http://csis.org/files/media/csis/pubs/080905_mendelson_guantanamo_web.pdf>Center for Strategic & International Studies, Sept, 2008</a></blockquote>

<blockquote>"A McClatchy investigation found that instead of confining terrorists, Guantanamo often produced more of them by rounding up common criminals, conscripts, low-level foot soldiers and men with no allegiance to radical Islam -- thus inspiring a deep hatred of the United States in them -- and then housing them in cells next to radical Islamists." - <a href=http://www.mcclatchydc.com/world/story/38779.html>McClatchy News, 6/17/2008</a></blockquote>

It's not that hard at all...Blowing your ring wing-nut agit-pro out of the water...3 minutes on Google was all it took.

stephanie
01-10-2010, 11:53 AM
yeah, like GOOGLE has become a reliable source anymore...

it's basically become a leftist propaganda place for anything to do with politics.

red states rule
01-10-2010, 12:41 PM
yeah, like GOOGLE has become a reliable source anymore...

it's basically become a leftist propaganda place for anything to do with politics.

BP is like most liberals these days. They are shocked the terrorists still hate the US even after electing Obama as President

This from a NEWS ANCHOR

<object width="518" height="419"><param name="movie" value="http://www.eyeblast.tv/public/eyeblast.swf?v=ydprDkpr8z" /><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true" /><embed type="application/x-shockwave-flash" src="http://www.eyeblast.tv/public/eyeblast.swf?v=ydprDkpr8z" allowfullscreen="true" width="518" height="419" /></object>

stephanie
01-10-2010, 12:47 PM
BP is like most liberals these days. They are shocked the terrorists still hate the US even after electing Obama as President

I swear, Bully and the Progressive leftist are becoming more SHRILL with each passing week...I really don't understand WHY....:laugh2:

and as we see, THE STATE run media is a total Embarrassment for their cause.

red states rule
01-10-2010, 12:50 PM
I swear, Bully and the Progressive leftist are becoming more SHRILL with each passing week...I really don't understand WHY....:laugh2:

and as we see, THE STATE run media is a total Embarrassment for their cause.

Perhaps BP and his liberal buddies are reading those polls they loved to talk about during the Bush years

Obama is at 45%

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/var/plain/storage/images/media/obama_index_graphics/january_2010/obama_approval_index_january_10_2010/277451-1-eng-US/obama_approval_index_january_10_2010.jpg

stephanie
01-10-2010, 12:59 PM
Perhaps BP and his liberal buddies are reading those polls they loved to talk about during the Bush years

Obama is at 45%

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/var/plain/storage/images/media/obama_index_graphics/january_2010/obama_approval_index_january_10_2010/277451-1-eng-US/obama_approval_index_january_10_2010.jpg

yep, the leftist Progressives really believed they could just shove their Socialist- commie agenda on the people by installing the "the One, the Messiah, the Obama.."

guess they were WRONG..

bullypulpit
01-10-2010, 03:19 PM
I swear, Bully and the Progressive leftist are becoming more SHRILL with each passing week...I really don't understand WHY....:laugh2:

and as we see, THE STATE run media is a total Embarrassment for their cause.

If by "shrill", you mean I present facts and you and your fellow travelers ignore them or dismiss them absent any evidence to support your dismissal...I'll take that.

If by "shrill" you mean y'all desperately try to change the topic in the face of facts, as you did above...I'll take that too.

red states rule
01-10-2010, 04:14 PM
If by "shrill", you mean I present facts and you and your fellow travelers ignore them or dismiss them absent any evidence to support your dismissal...I'll take that.

If by "shrill" you mean y'all desperately try to change the topic in the face of facts, as you did above...I'll take that too.

What facts sonny boy? I am still waiting for anyone to tell me ONE TERRORIST who became a terrorist due to GITMO

All Obama is doing is taking terrorists from GITMO to a prison in IL - and ebvery poll I have seen Americans are opposed to the move. How will that stop terrorists from wanting to kill Americans?

So tell me son, what FACTS do you have that will answer me those questions

red states rule
01-10-2010, 04:44 PM
and BP Mark Steyn makes some great points - but I suspect you will not get them.




Not long after the Ayatollah Khomeini announced his fatwa against Salman Rushdie, the British novelist suddenly turned up on a Muslim radio station in West London late one night and told his interviewer he'd converted to Islam. Marvelous religion, couldn't be happier, Allahu Akbar and all that.

And the Ayatollah said hey, that's terrific news, glad to hear it. But we're still gonna kill you.

Well, even a leftie novelist wises up under those circumstances.

Evidently, the president of the United States takes a little longer.

Barack Obama has spent the past year doing big-time Islamoschmoozing, from his announcement of Gitmo's closure and his investigation of Bush officials, to his bow before the Saudi king and a speech in Cairo to "the Muslim world" with far too many rhetorical concessions and equivocations. And at the end of it the jihad sent America a thank-you note by way of Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab's underwear: Hey, thanks for all the outreach! But we're still gonna kill you.

According to one poll, 58 percent of Americans are in favor of waterboarding young Umar Farouk. Well, you should have thought about that before you made a community organizer president of the world's superpower. The election of Barack Obama was a fundamentally unserious act by the U.S. electorate, and you can't blame the world's mischief-makers, from Putin to Ahmadinejad to the many Gitmo recidivists now running around Yemen, from drawing the correct conclusion.

For two weeks, the government of the United States has made itself a global laughingstock. Don't worry, "the system worked," said Homeland Security Secretary Janet Incompetano. Don't worry, he was an "isolated extremist," said the president. Don't worry, we're banning bathroom breaks for the last hour of the flight, said the TSA. Don't worry, "U.S. border security officials" told the Los Angeles Times, we knew he was on the plane, and we "had decided to question him when he landed." Don't worry, Obama's counterterrorism chief, John Brennan, assured the Sunday talk shows, sure, we read him his rights, and he's lawyered up but he'll soon see that "there is advantage to talking to us in terms of plea agreements."

Oh, that's grand. Try to kill hundreds of people in an act of war, and it's the starting point for a plea deal. In his Cairo speech, the president bragged that the United States would "punish" those in America who would "deny" the "right of women and girls to wear the hijab." If he's so keen on it, maybe he should consider putting the entire federal government into full-body burkas and zipping up the eye slit so that, henceforth, every public utterance by John Brennan will be entirely inaudible. Americans should be ashamed by this all-fools' fortnight.

On Thursday, having renounced over the preceding days "the system worked," the "isolated extremist," the more obviously risible TSA responses, the Gitmo-Yemen express checkout and various other follies, the president finally spoke the words: "We are at war." As National Review's Rich Lowry noted, they were more or less dragged from the presidential gullet by Dick Cheney, who'd accused the commander in chief of failing to grasp this basic point. Again, to be fair, it isn't just Obama. Last November, the electorate voted, in effect, to repudiate the previous eight years and seemed genuinely under the delusion that wars end when one side decides it's all a bit of a bore, and they'd rather the government spend the next eight years doing to health care and the economy what they were previously doing to jihadist camps in Waziristan.

On the other hand, if we are now at war, as Obama belatedly concedes, against whom are we warring? "We are at war against al-Qaida," says the president.

Really? But what does that mean? Was the previous month's "isolated extremist," the Fort Hood killer, part of al-Qaida? When it came to spiritual advice, he turned to the same Yemeni-based American-born imam as the Pantybomber, but he didn't have a fully paid-up membership card.


http://www.ocregister.com/opinion/president-227600-obama-war.html

bullypulpit
01-10-2010, 08:39 PM
What facts sonny boy? I am still waiting for anyone to tell me ONE TERRORIST who became a terrorist due to GITMO

All Obama is doing is taking terrorists from GITMO to a prison in IL - and ebvery poll I have seen Americans are opposed to the move. How will that stop terrorists from wanting to kill Americans?

So tell me son, what FACTS do you have that will answer me those questions

Just follow the links Red. As for the latter part of your little rant...It's called the rule of law...try it sometime.

red states rule
01-11-2010, 06:29 AM
Just follow the links Red. As for the latter part of your little rant...It's called the rule of law...try it sometime.

Again BP answer my questions

Name me ONE TERRORIST who became a terrorist due to GITMO

And Obama is going to take terrorists from GITMO to a prison in IL. How will that stop terrorists from wanting to kill Americans?

I guess you will follow your normal pattern when you are boxed in like this. You will become "bored" and move on

You can call my questions a rant - like elected Dems do over Obamacare - but you are showing you do not have answers just like Obama, Reid, and Pelosi do not have answers

Only they can't hide in cyberspace and run away. They must face the voters - and they will

That is why Dems are in pamic mode right now

bullypulpit
01-11-2010, 10:28 AM
Again BP answer my questions

Name me ONE TERRORIST who became a terrorist due to GITMO

And Obama is going to take terrorists from GITMO to a prison in IL. How will that stop terrorists from wanting to kill Americans?

I guess you will follow your normal pattern when you are boxed in like this. You will become "bored" and move on

You can call my questions a rant - like elected Dems do over Obamacare - but you are showing you do not have answers just like Obama, Reid, and Pelosi do not have answers

Only they can't hide in cyberspace and run away. They must face the voters - and they will

That is why Dems are in pamic mode right now

Red...Give it up. Follow the links I posted...read the testimony, transcripts and articles to be found there, as is the "proof" you really don't want to see. Your unwillingness to do so bespeaks a measure of both intellectual laziness and dishonesty on your part. But I've come to expect nothing better from you.

And really, who's in panic mode now? Not the Democrats, but rather the GOP as evidenced by its total disarray and inability to do more than say "NO!" to everything the Obama administration is doing. Why do they hate America?

red states rule
01-11-2010, 10:36 AM
Red...Give it up. Follow the links I posted...read the testimony, transcripts and articles to be found there, as is the "proof" you really don't want to see. Your unwillingness to do so bespeaks a measure of both intellectual laziness and dishonesty on your part. But I've come to expect nothing better from you.

Still can't give ma anme of a single inamte who was not a terrorist but saw a news story on GITMO, and he left the local PTA, gave up his job - and joined AQ and set out to kill Americans

Here are the facts BP

64% oppose Gitmo inmates coming to America

53% oppose Obamacre

32% say America is on the right track

Obama is at 46% approval

The Dem run Congress is at 28%

Those are the numbers that tell me how great a job Dems are doing BP. You want to dismiss them as racists, Nazi's, and idiots

Keep ducking such simple and direct questions BP - it is what you do best

Gaffer
01-11-2010, 01:42 PM
Red...Give it up. Follow the links I posted...read the testimony, transcripts and articles to be found there, as is the "proof" you really don't want to see. Your unwillingness to do so bespeaks a measure of both intellectual laziness and dishonesty on your part. But I've come to expect nothing better from you.

And really, who's in panic mode now? Not the Democrats, but rather the GOP as evidenced by its total disarray and inability to do more than say "NO!" to everything the Obama administration is doing. Why do they hate America?

The repubs have had no say in the bills before the house and senate. The ones saying no are democrats. They are fighting among themselves over the rancid meat, each trying to gain a little extra for themselves. The repubs have been locked out from the start. To say it's all their fault is a lie.

red states rule
01-12-2010, 09:29 AM
The repubs have had no say in the bills before the house and senate. The ones saying no are democrats. They are fighting among themselves over the rancid meat, each trying to gain a little extra for themselves. The repubs have been locked out from the start. To say it's all their fault is a lie.

In fact Reid had to hand out hundreds of billions in bribes to get Dems to vote for Obamacare

BP will ignore the fact, Dems do not need a single Republican vote in the House and Senate to pass any bill

He will ignore that fact and attack and try to pass the buck for the ever growing list of Dem failures