Chit happens if ya SLEEP on the job

[Mr. P]

Just heard the FAA has revoked the license of both NW pilots that missed the MSP airport by 150 miles..

Whatcha think cheezy?

[Kathianne]

Just heard the FAA has revoked the license of both NW pilots that missed the MSP airport by 150 miles..

Whatcha think cheezy?

Not surprised. There was no story that could cover that one.

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,


1. I think we will see a law suit very soon.
2. People should'nt be fired over being human.
3. Oh can I get a link, not that I don't believe you, but I like to verify that kinda crap first.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

[Mr. P]

Not surprised. There was no story that could cover that one.

Nope, not a one..especially with a cockpit voice recorder to prove the facts.


Sorry bout that,


1. I think we will see a law suit very soon.
2. People should'nt be fired over being human.
3. Oh can I get a link, not that I don't believe you, but I like to verify that kinda crap first.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

No link..as I said I just "heard" it..it was a news report on the radio. Doesn't surprise me at all though, I wouldn't expect less.

Despite what you think this is a very serious issue to those who are in "professional" aviation.

[Kathianne]

Nope, not a one..especially with a cockpit voice recorder to prove the facts.



No link..as I said I just "heard" it..it was a news report on the radio. Doesn't surprise me at all though, I wouldn't expect less.

Despite what you think this is a very serious issue to those who are in "professional" aviation.

We wouldn't want to deny Chessy his link, not that he'll read it. :laugh2:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125667787989311361.html


FAA Revokes Licenses of Northwest Pilots
By ANDY PASZTOR

Federal aviation regulators revoked the licenses of the two pilots of the Northwest jetliner that failed to respond to radio calls for more than an hour last week during a flight from San Diego to Minneapolis.

In its emergency revocation, which is effective immediately, the Federal Aviation Administration said the veteran pilots, Capt. Timothy B. Cheney and first officer Richard Cole, violated a number of regulations and operated the aircraft in a careless manner.

The FAA said it took action because the pilots failed to respond to air-traffic control instructions, and because controllers and airline officials "repeatedly tried to reach them through radio and data" transmissions without success.

The pilots have 10 days to appeal.

[Mr. P]

We wouldn't want to deny Chessy his link, not that he'll read it. :laugh2:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125667787989311361.html

Thanks for that link, K.:thumb:

[Kathianne]

Thanks for that link, K.:thumb:

No problem. Of course Chessy hasn't said thanks, though he asked and has read. ;)

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,


1. They will appeal.
2. And sue.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

[Kathianne]

Sorry bout that,


1. They will appeal.
2. And sue.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

and lose.

[sgtdmski]

Slippery slope. Under FAA regulations, a pilot is required to have X amount of hours of time between flights. If the pilots can prove they did not have the recommended minimum of hours, they can then transfer the blame to the airlines.

dmk

[Kathianne]

Slippery slope. Under FAA regulations, a pilot is required to have X amount of hours of time between flights. If the pilots can prove they did not have the recommended minimum of hours, they can then transfer the blame to the airlines.

dmk

They each had 17 hours before the flight.

[sgtdmski]

Did not hear that, sorry. If that is the case then they are clearly at fault.

dmk

[NightTrain]

The story I read today in the paper said they were both on laptops working on some sort of personnel scheduling.

But yeah, they're hosed. Mighty careless of them, even if their story is true.

[Jeff]

The story I read today in the paper said they were both on laptops working on some sort of personnel scheduling.

But yeah, they're hosed. Mighty careless of them, even if their story is true.

I saw this report also, I think it is a way to cover up pilots sleeping in the cockpits


As for having to have sleep, I would think the pilot is responsible to keep a log and be responsible for his time off

[Mr. P]

I saw this report also, I think it is a way to cover up pilots sleeping in the cockpits


As for having to have sleep, I would think the pilot is responsible to keep a log and be responsible for his time off

Actually every airline has a department the tracks crew duty time.
They are connected to/with crew scheduling and I promise NO ONE is scheduled to fly (under FAR 121, which is the airlines) that doesn't meet the FAA required rest period.

[jimnyc]

Sorry bout that,


1. They will appeal.
2. And sue.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

And they will be out a TON of money in legal expenses, and still be without licenses or jobs. First off, it was against company policy to utilize laptops in the cabins and they were declared to be in dereliction of duty by the airline. Their only recourse will be through their unions and I highly doubt they'll get very far considering they announced to the world that they broke company policy. As for their licenses - they will be laughed out of any court in the land. They have no valid reason for overshooting their destination and being out of touch with the airports. They placed the passengers in danger and put the area in a panic and almost had fighter jets airborne. They done fucked up, and revoking their licenses is the right thing to do. No court will take ANY pilot infractions such as this without the highest amount of scrutiny and passenger safety in mind.

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,





And they will be out a TON of money in legal expenses, and still be without licenses or jobs. First off, it was against company policy to utilize laptops in the cabins and they were declared to be in dereliction of duty by the airline. Their only recourse will be through their unions and I highly doubt they'll get very far considering they announced to the world that they broke company policy. As for their licenses - they will be laughed out of any court in the land. They have no valid reason for overshooting their destination and being out of touch with the airports. They placed the passengers in danger and put the area in a panic and almost had fighter jets airborne. They done fucked up, and revoking their licenses is the right thing to do. No court will take ANY pilot infractions such as this without the highest amount of scrutiny and passenger safety in mind.



1. Surely the Pilots Asso. will back them up.
2. Thats why the pilots join up, to be protected.
3. Humans aren't infalable, so unless it can be proven some one was in immediate danger, there was no harm done.
4. Sure they screwed up, I screwed up on something yesterday, more than likely, I will again today, I ain't perfect.
5. The courts shouldn't be the ones who decide if they get their liecenses back, it should be the Pilots Asso.
6. Perhaps the courts should decide if they get their jobs back, is all.
7. They made a mistake, and will promise not to do that again, thats enough for CWN.


Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

[jimnyc]

1. Surely the Pilots Asso. will back them up.
2. Thats why the pilots join up, to be protected.

They very well may back them up, but it's kind of hard to have a defense for gross insubordination when you admitted to it on camera.


3. Humans aren't infalable, so unless it can be proven some one was in immediate danger, there was no harm done.

It's a job, just like everyone else in the world has. The insubordination is enough to justify a termination. I would say that ANY screw-up while flying the plane should put their licenses under scrutiny. Completely missing an airport and ignoring the radio will make everyone think the plane is in distress, or even worse than pilot failure, in the midst of a hijacking. When it turns out to just be pilot insubordination, yank their licenses and let them re-apply a year later after they take more safety courses.


4. Sure they screwed up, I screwed up on something yesterday, more than likely, I will again today, I ain't perfect.

How many lives were directly in your hands when you screwed up? Do you have a contract outlining what screw-ups are allowed and which are forbidden? Do you get paid to be a professional and avoid such screw-ups?


5. The courts shouldn't be the ones who decide if they get their liecenses back, it should be the Pilots Asso.

I believe it should be those who oversee the licenses themselves to determine who gets them and who has them revoked. Same as a drivers license, you screw up on the road and the state will suspend or revoke your license for a set period of time.


6. Perhaps the courts should decide if they get their jobs back, is all.
7. They made a mistake, and will promise not to do that again, thats enough for CWN.

What about all the people losing their jobs around the country? Those that are fired for insubordination, should they get their jobs back if they promise not to do it again? And if not, why should the 2 be treated differently? And hell, I'll bet the overwhelming majority didn't have others lives in their hands.

[namvet]

so they plugged in the laptops to fly the plane and caught some ZZZ's :coffee: