Reid Threatens 'Nuclear Option' to Pass Obamacare

[red states rule]

So when Reid can't get his fellow Dems to vote for Obamcare - he says he will change the rules to force it down the throats of the voters

This should play well with the taxpayers as they see the Dems arrogrance and contempt for public opinion on display for all to see



Reid Threatens 'Nuclear Option' to Pass Health Care Reform as Panel Starts Work

The Nevada senator threatened to use a budgetary tool called reconciliation -- also known as the "nuclear option" -- which would allow Democrats to pass key parts of health care legislation with a simple majority, as opposed to the 60 votes usually needed to avoid a filibuster.



Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid threatened on Tuesday to use a procedural maneuver to steamroll opponents of health care reform, even as a Senate panel began delicate negotiations over a package that could have the best chance at passing.

The Nevada Democrat, who has issued similar threats before, spoke as the Senate Finance Committee began debate over Chairman Max Baucus' reform plan. Reid threatened to use a budgetary tool called reconciliation -- also known as the "nuclear option" -- that would allow Democrats to pass key parts of the legislation with a simple majority, as opposed to the 60 votes needed to avoid a Republican filibuster.

"If we can't work this out to do something within the committee structure, then we'll be forced to do the reconciliation," Reid said, adding that he views that as a "last resort."

"It remains to be seen as to whether we will have to do reconciliation. I am confident and hopeful we won't have to do that, but time will only tell," Reid said.

Republican Sen. Richard Burr, N.C., said reconciliation would be a "grave mistake," and that Reid underestimates the public concerns over the bill.

"I don't think it's a threat. I think that's what Harry Reid intends to do," Burr told FOX News.

But the Senate Finance Committee pushed through tense and intensive talks Tuesday to reach common ground on the Baucus plan. Senators have filed 564 amendments, and on Tuesday afternoon Baucus released a slew of changes.


http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/09/22/senate-committee-begins-work-health-care-reform/?test=latestnews

[maineman]

there will require no changing of any rules. Reconciliation is a process already in place.

[red states rule]

there will require no changing of any rules. Reconciliation is a process already in place.

Yea, whatever it takes to get the win eh Virgil?

Reid si indeed changing the rules to ram Obamacare thru. Only this time, he is giving the finger to fellow Dems who see it is a bad bill

[maineman]

Yea, whatever it takes to get the win eh Virgil?

Reid si indeed changing the rules to ram Obamacare thru. Only this time, he is giving the finger to fellow Dems who see it is a bad bill

no rule change needed. reconciliation is already a part of the senate rules.

sorry.

elections have consequences... when a party has 51 votes in the senate, they get to call the shots.

sucks to be you, I can imagine.

[red states rule]

no rule change needed. reconciliation is already a part of the senate rules.

sorry.

elections have consequences... when a party has 51 votes in the senate, they get to call the shots.

sucks to be you, I can imagine.

Way back in the Bush administration, the Republicans, with a very slim majority, threatened this option, to get an up or down vote on the floor of the Senate, for some judges. The Dems wouldn’t allow a vote. This brought us that gang-of-14, or some such number. Compromise was the word of the day and it gave us John McCain to the rescue, they compromised and the judges went without any votes.

Remember who was running to the TV and screaming to stop the entire business of Congress, if they used the option? Why it was Harry Reid and his merry band of pissed of Dems

The same Harry Reid that now wants to save Obama and destroy the nations health care. More of that change everyone wanted, don’t see too much hope now, do you?

Of course you will not see the hypocrisy since it is always party above country, as well as truth

[maineman]

you are absolutely wrong.

reconciliation is not a rule that can be used in the confirmation process. It is only applicable to the budget process.

sorry.

study civics a bit and come back when you know something.

[red states rule]

you are absolutely wrong.

reconciliation is not a rule that can be used in the confirmation process. It is only applicable to the budget process.

sorry.

study civics a bit and come back when you know something.

They are not passing a budget they are passing Obamacare. As in MA, Dems are now willing to make up the rules as they go along to get what they want

Another example that the Dem leaders in office could care less about the people. They only care about doing what they want and empowering themselves.

[maineman]

They are not passing a budget they are passing Obamacare. As in MA, Dems are now willing to make up the rules as they go along to get what they want

Another example that the Dem leaders in office could care less about the people. They only care about doing what they want and empowering themselves.
it is an appropriations bill. reconciliation is allowed.

reconciliation is NOT allowed on judicial confirmation votes.

You clearly don't have a clue what you are talking about. But I guess that Rush didn't go into a lot of detail yesterday, did he?:poke:

I suggest you do some reading and come back when you know something.

[red states rule]

it is an appropriations bill. reconciliation is allowed.

reconciliation is NOT allowed on judicial confirmation votes.

You clearly don't have a clue what you are talking about. But I guess that Rush didn't go into a lot of detail yesterday, did he?:poke:

I suggest you do some reading and come back when you know something.

You do not get it Virgil and neither does Harry

The Republicans can just sit back and watch the Dem's just fall apart. Prince Reid and Princess Pelosi do not need one Republican vote on the health care. They just cannot get their own party to commit. Which will be there failure

They can't get 60 votes from their own members, so Harry will change the rules so he needs only 51

I wonder what he will do if he can't get 50 Dems to vote for Obamacare.

[maineman]

You do not get it Virgil and neither does Harry

The Republicans can just sit back and watch the Dem's just fall apart. Prince Reid and Princess Pelosi do not need one Republican vote on the health care. They just cannot get their own party to commit. Which will be there failure

They can't get 60 votes from their own members, so Harry will change the rules so he needs only 51

I wonder what he will do if he can't get 50 Dems to vote for Obamacare.

again.... no rule change needed.

sorry you can't wrap your pea sized brain around that fact. It is getting boring having to repeat myself.

I am gonna go to work.

[red states rule]

again.... no rule change needed.

sorry you can't wrap your pea sized brain around that fact. It is getting boring having to repeat myself.

I am gonna go to work.

again, you are lying and defending your party regardless of the facts

Situation normal

Not only are you supporting screwing the voters, but your fellow Dems who do not want this bill

[Nukeman]

IF and I say if even one democratic senator opposes this ideas of reconciliation than it can be defeated. Any Senator may raise a procedural objection if the number of Sentors that vote is BELOW 60. If the number is above 60 than we are screwed. Otherwise the Byrd Rule applies..

Reconciliation was never intended for the use it is being applied to today.

[red states rule]

IF and I say if even one democratic senator opposes this ides of reconciliation than it can be defeated. Any Senator may raise a procedural objection if the number of Sentors that vote is BELOW 60. If the number is above 60 than we are screwed. Otherwise the Byrd Rule applies..

Reconciliation was never intended for the use it is being applied to today.

O would be surprised if Harry tries it. He is already behind in the polls for his re-election bid.

But I should never underestimate his arrogance

[maineman]

again, you are lying and defending your party regardless of the facts

Situation normal

Not only are you supporting screwing the voters, but your fellow Dems who do not want this bill


no lies at all. If Reid choses to use the reconciliation process to pass helath care reform, he will not have to change any rules. that's a fact.

[red states rule]

no lies at all. If Reid choses to use the reconciliation process to pass helath care reform, he will not have to change any rules. that's a fact.

Once a liar Virgil - always a liar. I no longer pity you - you are way to far gone for that

That is a fact

[maineman]

IF and I say if even one democratic senator opposes this ideas of reconciliation than it can be defeated. Any Senator may raise a procedural objection if the number of Sentors that vote is BELOW 60. If the number is above 60 than we are screwed. Otherwise the Byrd Rule applies..

Reconciliation was never intended for the use it is being applied to today.

I disagree with your interpretation of the process by which reconciliation can be used.

And I guess you have on your swami hat so that you are able to tell what the total INTENT of the rule was.... that's pretty cool.

[red states rule]

I disagree with your interpretation of the process by which reconciliation can be used.

And I guess you have on your swami hat so that you are able to tell what the total INTENT of the rule was.... that's pretty cool.

Your untent is clear. Screw the rules - whatever it takes for Dems tro win a political fight is OK with you

[maineman]

Once a liar Virgil - always a liar. I no longer pity you - you are way to far gone for that

That is a fact

tell me then, RSR... what RULE now in place will Reid have to CHANGE in order to use the reconciliation process?

I'll wait.

rather than insult me by callling me a liar, why not just grow a set of balls and answer a simple question?

[red states rule]

tell me then, RSR... what RULE now in place will Reid have to CHANGE in order to use the reconciliation process?

I'll wait.

rather than insult me by callling me a liar, why not just grow a set of balls and answer a simple question?

from the OP

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid threatened on Tuesday to use a procedural maneuver to steamroll opponents of health care reform, even as a Senate panel began delicate negotiations over a package that could have the best chance at passing.

The Nevada Democrat, who has issued similar threats before, spoke as the Senate Finance Committee began debate over Chairman Max Baucus' reform plan. Reid threatened to use a budgetary tool called reconciliation -- also known as the "nuclear option" -- that would allow Democrats to pass key parts of the legislation with a simple majority, as opposed to the 60 votes needed to avoid a Republican filibuster.

[Nukeman]

I disagree with your interpretation of the process by which reconciliation can be used.

And I guess you have on your swami hat so that you are able to tell what the total INTENT of the rule was.... that's pretty cool.


http://www.senate.gov/reference/glossary_term/reconciliation_instruction.htm

reconciliation instruction - A provision in a budget resolution directing one or more committees to report (or submit to the Budget Committee) legislation changing existing law in order to bring spending, revenues, or the debt-limit into conformity with the budget resolution. The instructions specify the committees to which they apply, indicate the appropriate dollar changes to be achieved, and usually provide a deadline by which the legislation is to be reported or submitted



reconciliation process - A process established in the Congressional Budget Act of 1974 by which Congress changes existing laws to conform tax and spending levels to the levels set in a budget resolution. Changes recommended by committees pursuant to a reconciliation instruction are incorporated into a reconciliation measure
Reconciliation was never intended to ADD to the deficit which is exaclty what this medical bill will do.... It was intended to stabilize the budget in the face of unwaranted opposition.

the opposition to this "health care reform" stems from Obama wanting to force it through without anyone actually reading the bill, I would also ask you why does it need to be passed this year if the enaction date is not until 2013??? Kind of funny that he would want the bill to take effect either after he has won a SECOND term so there would be no reprecussion on him when it tanks or, if he doesn't get a second term the mess is left foe the next president to deal with.

If this freaking bill is soo all important why the delay in implementing it I mean come on 3-3 1/2 years for someithing they want to cram down our throats in 4 months......????


Ohh take your "swami hat" snide remark and shove it up your ass!!!!!

[red states rule]

http://www.senate.gov/reference/glossary_term/reconciliation_instruction.htm


Reconciliation was never intended to ADD to the deficit which is exaclty what this medical bill will do.... It was intended to stabilize the budget in the face of unwaranted opposition.

the opposition to this "health care reform" stems from Obama wanting to force it through without anyone actually reading the bill, I would also ask you why does it need to be passed this year if the enaction date is not until 2013??? Kind of funny that he would want the bill to take effect either after he has won a SECOND term so there would be no reprecussion on him when it tanks or, if he doesn't get a second term the mess is left foe the next president to deal with.

If this freaking bill is soo all important why the delay in implementing it I mean come on 3-3 1/2 years for someithing they want to cram down our throats in 4 months......????


Ohh take yor "swami hat" snide remark and shove it up your ass!!!!!

:clap::clap::clap::salute:

[maineman]

nothing there that says that reconciliation cannot be used to bring the healthcare initiative into the government's budget.

[maineman]

from the OP

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid threatened on Tuesday to use a procedural maneuver to steamroll opponents of health care reform, even as a Senate panel began delicate negotiations over a package that could have the best chance at passing.

The Nevada Democrat, who has issued similar threats before, spoke as the Senate Finance Committee began debate over Chairman Max Baucus' reform plan. Reid threatened to use a budgetary tool called reconciliation -- also known as the "nuclear option" -- that would allow Democrats to pass key parts of the legislation with a simple majority, as opposed to the 60 votes needed to avoid a Republican filibuster.

clearly you cannot read. Let me ask you again: what RULE would have to be CHANGED in order to use the existing reconciliation process?

[red states rule]

clearly you cannot read. Let me ask you again: what RULE would have to be CHANGED in order to use the existing reconciliation process?

Nukeman tried to further explain it to you in post 20

It is lost cause with a worthless hack like you Virgil

[Nukeman]

nothing there that says that reconciliation cannot be used to bring the healthcare initiative into the government's budget.

It is to RECONCILE the budget not add to it...

reconcile  /–verb (used with object)
1. to cause (a person) to accept or be resigned to something not desired: He was reconciled to his fate.
2. to win over to friendliness; cause to become amicable: to reconcile hostile persons.
3. to compose or settle (a quarrel, dispute, etc.).
4. to bring into agreement or harmony; make compatible or consistent: to reconcile differing statements; to reconcile accounts.
5. to reconsecrate (a desecrated church, cemetery, etc.).
6. to restore (an excommunicate or penitent) to communion in a church.


If they shove this through without agreement then they are not "reconciling" anything and they are just forcing their views on every man, woman, and child in this great country!!!!!!

[maineman]

Nukeman tried to further explain it to you in post 20

It is lost cause with a worthless hack like you Virgil

no rule will need to be changed. that is a fact.

if Reid wants to use reconciliation to pass health care, he can do so without changing a single rule.

I hope he does.

[Nukeman]

no rule will need to be changed. that is a fact.

if Reid wants to use reconciliation to pass health care, he can do so without changing a single rule.

I hope he does.
Why, do you think they will cover YOUR health care in Mexico in 2011????

[red states rule]

It is to RECONCILE the budget not add to it...

reconcile  /–verb (used with object)
1. to cause (a person) to accept or be resigned to something not desired: He was reconciled to his fate.
2. to win over to friendliness; cause to become amicable: to reconcile hostile persons.
3. to compose or settle (a quarrel, dispute, etc.).
4. to bring into agreement or harmony; make compatible or consistent: to reconcile differing statements; to reconcile accounts.
5. to reconsecrate (a desecrated church, cemetery, etc.).
6. to restore (an excommunicate or penitent) to communion in a church.


If they shove this through without agreement then they are not "reconciling" anything and they are just forcing their views on every man, woman, and child in this great country!!!!!!


I almost hope the Dems do it. They will see a wave of pissed off voters voting in 2010

[maineman]

Why, do you think they will cover YOUR health care in Mexico in 2011????

of COURSE you will. Just like you cover it ALL today. TRICARE is a marvelous program and it works overseas! All a part of your saying thank you to a 25 year Navy veteran for his years of dedicated service... and I appreciate it!:dance:

[red states rule]

of COURSE you will. Just like you cover it ALL today. TRICARE is a marvelous program and it works overseas! All a part of your saying thank you to a 25 year Navy veteran for his years of dedicated service... and I appreciate it!:dance:

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh305/tainja/bullshit.jpg

[maineman]

Hey Red... have I thanked you for my free health care that you've been providing to me? If not, please accept my sarcastic appreciation. I LOVE going to see the doctor and having you pay for all of it!

[glockmail]

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh305/tainja/bullshit.jpg :lol:

[red states rule]

Glock, Virgil is a 25 year Navy veteran as I am a starting QB for the Dallas Cowboys

[glockmail]

Hey Red... have I thanked you for my free health care that you've been providing to me? If not, please accept my sarcastic appreciation. I LOVE going to see the doctor and having you pay for all of it! My Dad's a Korean War vet and he never used the VA, preferring to purchase his own insurance and let vets with more limited resources get the care that they need. Apparently he cares about America and Vets a lot more than you.

[maineman]

My Dad's a Korean War vet and he never used the VA, preferring to purchase his own insurance and let vets with more limited resources get the care that they need. Apparently he cares about America and Vets a lot more than you.

TRICARE has nothing to do with the VA. DId you dad qualify for a military retirement?

[red states rule]

TRICARE has nothing to do with the VA. DId you dad qualify for a military retirement?

"Did you dad"?

What the hell is that? :laugh2:

[maineman]

"Did you dad"?

What the hell is that?

Let me explain it to you in small words:

glockmail said that his dad was a korean war vet who never used the services of the VA and suggested that I DO. I pointed out that the VA is really for veterans and not retirees. I pointed out that my healthcare comes from a program called TRICARE. It is the healthcare program provided by DoD - and NOT the VA - to military retirees. I asked glockmail if his father had qualified for a retirement, because if he had, he too, would have used TRICARE and NOT the VA. Got it?

[glockmail]

TRICARE has nothing to do with the VA. DId you dad qualify for a military retirement?Its the same thing as far as he's concerned. Again he paid for private insurance in order to have other less financially able to use the limited resources of the military systems. I'm sure he as well as most other veterans would be disgusted at you bragging about sucking off the teat at the expense of the taxpayers, especially since your supposedly so successful in your private career while milking the Navy's retirement system.

[glockmail]

"Did you dad"?

What the hell is that? :laugh2:
Its deflection form the issue being discussed. They are both military health care plans. My understanding is that TriCare offers more benefits for career personnel, while the majority who did their stint then left for careers elsewhere can always use the VA services.

[Insein]

I almost hope the Dems do it. They will see a wave of pissed off voters voting in 2010

It will be incredibly hard to repeal if it does go through no matter how pissed off people are.

[maineman]

Its the same thing as far as he's concerned. Again he paid for private insurance in order to have other less financially able to use the limited resources of the military systems. I'm sure he as well as most other veterans would be disgusted at you bragging about sucking off the teat at the expense of the taxpayers, especially since your supposedly so successful in your private career while milking the Navy's retirement system.

are you suggesting that, if your father had served for 20 years and earned his retirement, that he would not have accepted it?

LOL

what color is the sky in your world?

[maineman]

Its deflection form the issue being discussed. They are both military health care plans. My understanding is that TriCare offers more benefits for career personnel, while the majority who did their stint then left for careers elsewhere can always use the VA services. one is administered by Department of Defense and other by the Department of Veteran's Affairs. TRICARE is more extensive than simple VA benefits which reflects the added value our grateful nation places on career military personnel.

You're welcome!:salute:

[theHawk]

TRICARE is more extensive than simple VA benefits which reflects the added value our grateful nation places on career military personnel.


So if extensive benefits are given to all Amerians (and illegals) what is the added value for our military personnel?

[maineman]

So if extensive benefits are given to all Amerians (and illegals) what is the added value for our military personnel?

I never claimed there would be.

I merely correct glock who clearly doesn't understand Tricare nor can he be honest about the validity of honorably receiving earned retirement benefits.

[glockmail]

are you suggesting that, if your father had served for 20 years and earned his retirement, that he would not have accepted it?

LOL

what color is the sky in your world? After designing missiles for the Army Air Corps he worked 45 years for his retirement, so yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. :slap:

[maineman]

After designing missiles for the Army Air Corps he worked 45 years for his retirement, so yes, that's exactly what I'm saying.

but he did not serve in uniform for 20 years, did he? therefore he was not eligible for a military retirement.

But let me get this straight... you are saying that, if your father HAD served in uniform for 20 years, that he would have turned down his military retirement pay?

[glockmail]

but he did not serve in uniform for 20 years, did he? therefore he was not eligible for a military retirement.

But let me get this straight... you are saying that, if your father HAD served in uniform for 20 years, that he would have turned down his military retirement pay? We're talking about his health benefits, which he paid for himself for the 45 years that he worked instead of the 20 that you did.

[maineman]

We're talking about his health benefits, which he paid for himself for the 45 years that he worked instead of the 20 that you did.

Are you suggesting that, had your father served for 20 plus years in the military, he would have taken his retirement pay from the military but, for some reason, turned down his Tricare health benefits?

If that is the case, it explains a great deal about why YOU are such a moron.:lol:

[glockmail]

He didn't spend 20 years in the military to milk the system. He did his stint then worked 45 years and never took a VA benefit. He'd call you an asshole for bragging to others how you milk the system.

[maineman]

He didn't spend 20 years in the military to milk the system. He did his stint then worked 45 years and never took a VA benefit. He'd call you an asshole for bragging to others how you milk the system.

and I didn't spend my 25 years in the military to milk the system either. Are you claiming that all career military men "milk the system"?

I don't brag about anything. I state the facts. You pay for my healthcare and I thank you for it. I realize that doing so is what a grateful nation DOES for its career military personnel.

[red states rule]

It will be incredibly hard to repeal if it does go through no matter how pissed off people are.

The voters do not want it. Doctores do not want it. As the cuts and higher taxes become a reality it wil be easy to get rid of it

Dems are only out for power and more control over people. They really do not give a damn about lowering the cost - only more power

[Insein]

The voters do not want it. Doctores do not want it. As the cuts and higher taxes become a reality it wil be easy to get rid of it

Dems are only out for power and more control over people. They really do not give a damn about lowering the cost - only more power

Understandable but once a law is law, it takes ridiculous amounts of time and effort to repeal. Take for example the 18th ammendment. It took 13 years before they brought back Americans right to drink alcohol. That was just as ridiculous a law as this healthcare plan but this plan has so many loopholes and convoluted verbage that it will take decades for it to be repealed and the damage done may last for generations.

The best option is to never let this pass.

[red states rule]

Understandable but once a law is law, it takes ridiculous amounts of time and effort to repeal. Take for example the 18th ammendment. It took 13 years before they brought back Americans right to drink alcohol. That was just as ridiculous a law as this healthcare plan but this plan has so many loopholes and convoluted verbage that it will take decades for it to be repealed and the damage done may last for generations.

The best option is to never let this pass.

I agree Insein, I do not want it either, and a frowing number of people do not want it either

So If Obama, Reid, and Pelosi ram this thru - I suspect they will pay a huge price in 2010. A price that will make the crushing defeat Dems took in 1994 look like a minor setback

[maineman]

I agree Insein, I do not want it either, and a frowing number of people do not want it either

So If Obama, Reid, and Pelosi ram this thru - I suspect they will pay a huge price in 2010. A price that will make the crushing defeat Dems took in 1994 look like a minor setback

is that another one of your prescient election predictions?

Like the one where Rudy Guiliani would kick Hillary's ass in 2008?:lol:

[glockmail]

and I didn't spend my 25 years in the military to milk the system either. Are you claiming that all career military men "milk the system"?

I don't brag about anything. I state the facts. You pay for my healthcare and I thank you for it. I realize that doing so is what a grateful nation DOES for its career military personnel.

Liar:


Hey Red... have I thanked you for my free health care that you've been providing to me? If not, please accept my sarcastic appreciation. I LOVE going to see the doctor and having you pay for all of it!

[red states rule]

and I didn't spend my 25 years in the military to milk the system either. Are you claiming that all career military men "milk the system"?

I don't brag about anything. I state the facts. You pay for my healthcare and I thank you for it. I realize that doing so is what a grateful nation DOES for its career military personnel.

Here is your "career" in 2:01

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/3zgeQmzV9kk&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/3zgeQmzV9kk&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

[maineman]

did Maelstrom show you that video?:poke:

[glockmail]

How's Mickey? :lol:

[red states rule]

Liar:

You now, it is not much fun when he makes it that easy :laugh2:

[glockmail]

You now, it is not much fun when he makes it that easy :laugh2:
But it still is fun to smash his ugly face with it. LOL

[red states rule]

But it still is fun to smash his ugly face with it. LOL

True. He is not much of a challenge

Virgil's brain is as good as new, it has never been used

[maineman]

Liar:

that wasn't bragging. that was merely stating the facts and thanking you all for the free health care and retirement checks.


and I mean it... thanks for the retirement bennies... I realize that they are YOUR way of saying thank you to career military personnel... and for that, I say again, you're more than welcome. I enjoyed every minute of it.

and Red... can't you find some post from Maelstrom to plagiarize that would be a better retort than your usual lame ones?