Cap and Trade Call to Congressmen

[red states rule]

Here is what happens when a well informed voter calls his Cngressmen's office and hits his staff with facts - he gets hung up on

Cap and Trade will help drive the economy lower, and cause massive increases on our electric bill



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[stephanie]

call call call

This is a real stinker of a bill people, as bad or worse than the little Marxist health care Bs...WE don't WANT anything this administration has to offer...

This should be called, Cap and Tax..

[red states rule]

call call call

This is a real stinker of a bill people, as bad or worse than the little Marxist health care Bs...WE don't WANT anything this administration has to offer...

This should be called, Cap and Tax..

Or it could be called "Tax and Kill"

I understanbd why Obama is doing what he is doing. He is reading books like Fareed Zakaria’s “The Post-American World.”


http://papercuts.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/05/21/what-obama-is-reading/

[stephanie]

Or it could be called "Tax and Kill"

I understanbd why Obama is doing what he is doing. He is reading books like Fareed Zakaria’s “The Post-American World.”


http://papercuts.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/05/21/what-obama-is-reading/

I truly believe the Democrats have become OUR ENEMY WITHIN..

Marcus Tullius Cicero quotes:
A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.

[Gaffer]

I truly believe the Democrats have become OUR ENEMY WITHIN..

Marcus Tullius Cicero quotes:
A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.


I agree with you completely Steph. He and his minions are the worst thing to ever happen to this country. The problem is the people we nee to call are his minions. What we have to say means nothing to them. They are getting bolder because he and they have the elections controlled. They don't have to pretend to listen anymore.

[red states rule]

I truly believe the Democrats have become OUR ENEMY WITHIN..

Marcus Tullius Cicero quotes:
A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.

You are not far off Steph

I honestly believe Dems want to tank the economy, put millions out of work - then step in a takeover as much of the private sector as possible

Then they take control of as many aspects of our lives as posssible

When their "Tax and Kill" plan causing massive increases in utiliuty bills, Obama and the Dems will step in - blame the greedy companies and say the government needs to assume control and prices would go down

[Joe Steel]

Cap and Trade is a virtually cost-free alternative to choking to death on industrial pollutants. Anyone who opposes it is an enemy of all humanity.

[red states rule]

Cap and Trade is a virtually cost-free alternative to choking to death on industrial pollutants. Anyone who opposes it is an enemy of all humanity.

The price of anything that uses fossil fuels in, production, pre-production, and/or day to day use will go up. I'm scared to think of what this will do to the price of plastics and other synthetic materials

It is the biggest tax increase in the history of thwe world. everything will go up, Gas, oil, electricty, food, clothing, furniture - you name it

This is the reason why Obama was purposely vague on the campaign trail. All he talked about is hope and change and didn't provide the specifics until he got into power. And even now, he is lying to us.

This bill will do NOTHING to curb Co2. It is nothing but a power grab by Dems

[stephanie]

Cap and Trade is a virtually cost-free alternative to choking to death on industrial pollutants. Anyone who opposes it is an enemy of all humanity.

I'd rather die by choking on pollutants, than be governed by the Communist that you support, known as the Democrat Party.

[red states rule]

I'd rather die by choking on pollutants, than be governed by the Communist that you support, known as the Democrat Party.

You could very wel die when forced to rely on Obamacare, or when you open your electric bill, or if NK launches a nuke that reached the US

All courtesy of Obama's Hope and Change World Tour

[Insein]

Cap and Trade is a virtually cost-free alternative to choking to death on industrial pollutants. Anyone who opposes it is an enemy of all humanity.

You are just a caricature of a human being.

[red states rule]

You are just a caricature of a human being.

Why is it that all the supporters of Obama and his policies sound exactly alike? They are all like auto-trons who are pre-programmed to gush meaningless rhetorical crap and talking points

[red states rule]

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[stephanie]

I just called my Rep. from Missouri in Washington, and got through..He is voting no on the cap and tax...

call call call people, NOW..... if busy keep trying...

[red states rule]

I just called my Rep. from Missouri in Washington, and got through..He is voting no on the cap and tax...

call call call people, NOW if busy keep trying...

(202) 225-3121 (Congressional Switchboard)

[Insein]

Not looking good.

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D992ETLG0&show_article=1


House Democrats win key test vote on climate bill

Jun 26 11:52 AM US/Eastern
By H. JOSEF HEBERT and DINA CAPPIELLO
Associated Press Writers

WASHINGTON (AP) - House Democrats narrowly won an important test vote Friday on groundbreaking legislation to combat global warming and usher in a new era of cleaner energy. Republican opponents said it included the largest tax increase ever.
The vote was 217-205 to send the White House-backed legislation to the full House. Thirty Democrats defected, reflecting the deep divisions over the plan. Supporters and opponents agree it mean higher energy costs, but they disagree widely on the impact on consumers.


The legislation would impose limits, for the first time, on carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gas pollution from power plants, factories and refineries. It would force a shift away from coal and other fossil fuels to renewable and more efficient forms of energy.

President Barack Obama has made the measure a top priority of his first year in office. The president, along with White House aides and House Democratic leaders scrambled for the votes to assure passage. Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., has pledged to pass the bill passed before lawmakers leave on their July 4 vacation.

In the Senate, which has yet to act, a major struggle is expected.

The bill's fate in the House depended on the decisions of a few dozen fence-sitting Democrats, mainly conservatives and moderates from contested districts who feared the political ramifications of siding with the White House and their leadership on the measure.

"The bill contains provisions to protect consumers, keep costs low, help sensitive industries transition to a clean energy economy and promote domestic emission reduction efforts," the White House in a statement of support for the legislation.

Republicans saw it differently.

[Monkeybone]

and we've seen how well it works for Cali.

[red states rule]

The Tax and Kill bill passed the House 219 to 212.

Here's how it was voted: YEA - 211 democratic and 8 republican
Nay - 44 democratic and 168 republican

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3570/3663708683_33a9332c22.jpg?v=0

[Joe Steel]

I truly believe the Democrats have become OUR ENEMY WITHIN..

Marcus Tullius Cicero quotes:
A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within.

Chin up.

The US survived Reagan, both Bushes and a host of lesser fascist conservatives. Now we're on the road to recovery.

[stephanie]

Chin up.

The US survived Reagan, both Bushes and a host of lesser fascist conservatives. Now we're on the road to recovery.

you sir are a...commie..
so of course you are rejoicing the takeover by the Democrat controlled government...

Cicero said, a nation can survive it's fools...well we might not survive the fools who voted to put a follower of the radical Black Liberation movement lead by the like of Jeremiah Wright in as our President and his Progressive(commie) administration.. Obama hates the capitalist system we have in this country because he sees it as being unfair and it is his duty to tear it down, despises white people,(he even put down his own white grandmother) who has called us Americans, selfish, ignorant, greedy bible thumpers clinging to our guns....

I guess Jeremiah Wright is right...Our chickens have come home to roost..
God Bless this once great country...we are now the USS of A....

[Gaffer]

You really didn't expect you would have a say in government anymore did you? From here on it's all about the dark lord and his minions. The days of calling your congress critter are over. The country is now in the hands of people the likes of joe steal.

[stephanie]

I wonder when we will all get our pictures of the 'Dear Leader Obama", to hang up in our house so when we wake up in the mornings we can say a little thanks for the little that we are allowed to have from the state, for taking care of us little people, for showing us how selfish and greedy we were, then going off to your peon job for THE STATE...

http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m268/alaskamomma/untitled-2.jpg

[Joe Steel]

you sir are a...commie..

Thank you.

However, in point of fact, I am not now, nor have I ever been, a member of the Communist Party.



so of course you are rejoicing the takeover by the Democrat controlled government...

Cicero said, a nation can survive it's fools...well we might not survive the fools who voted to put a follower of the radical Black Liberation movement lead by the like of Jeremiah Wright in as our President and his Progressive(commie) administration.. Obama hates the capitalist system we have in this country because he sees it as being unfair and it is his duty to tear it down, despises white people,(he even put down his own white grandmother) who has called us Americans, selfish, ignorant, greedy bible thumpers clinging to our guns....

I guess Jeremiah Wright is right...Our chickens have come home to roost..
God Bless this once great country...we are now the USS of A....


Take a breath. You're over-reacting.

Obama may have a sense of his own ethnicity but he's by no means a "radical black." Nor is he particularly progressive. He's a center-right "player" who sometimes pays lip-service to liberal ideas.

Actually, he's quite disappointment. He's shown himself far too willing to play the game according to established rules. True Progressives will have to wait longer for deliverance.

[creativeage]

Hi all - been working my tail off getting ready for extra costs from decision like this. Glad to get to a chance to pop in. I have to say, I am really on the fence with this bill - love the environment and want to do what I can to preserve our environment, but very concerned about the excessive gov't control...not a fun a place for me to be:) Perhaps I will see great arguements from both sides? :)

[stephanie]

Thank you.

However, in point of fact, I am not now, nor have I ever been, a member of the Communist Party.





Take a breath. You're over-reacting.

Obama may have a sense of his own ethnicity but he's by no means a "radical black." Nor is he particularly progressive. He's a center-right "player" who sometimes pays lip-service to liberal ideas.

Actually, he's quite disappointment. He's shown himself far too willing to play the game according to established rules. True Progressives will have to wait longer for deliverance.

Just like a Progressive to play word games to try and cover who they really are..

Why won't you admit JS, the Progressive is a pretty word for-----Communist..

Hillary Clinton admitted she is a "modern Progressive", so now you see who is in power of our country...
good job Obamabots..Now enjoy it..

[Insein]

Hi all - been working my tail off getting ready for extra costs from decision like this. Glad to get to a chance to pop in. I have to say, I am really on the fence with this bill - love the environment and want to do what I can to preserve our environment, but very concerned about the excessive gov't control...not a fun a place for me to be:) Perhaps I will see great arguements from both sides? :)

The problem with loving the environment is that this bill does nothing for that. Its window dressing meant to make environmentalists feel good but hundreds of scientists have shown that this will do nothing to help the environment. Companies are working about as efficient as they can run at the current time. All this bill does is allow the government to take more money from these industries because they won't be able to make their products any cleaner then they were before. So the environment stays the same as it was but now we have a massive bill passed onto consumers. Government gets more money and gets to say they did something to environmentalists when in fact they did nothing but help themselves.

This is a sad day for America. All we can do is hope that we have a FAIR election in 2010 and that the new elected officials repeal this travesty just like they did in New Zealand and Australia.

[Kathianne]

Dammit. Mark Kirk was one of the Republicans that voted for this. He will probably be running for Senate when Burris goes. Until this, I would have voted for him, but being IL, he may be the only choice. Arrrggg.

[Gaffer]

However, in point of fact, I am not now, nor have I ever been, a member of the Communist Party.

YOU are a communist.

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's a duck.


You may have never been a card carrying member of the communist party, but you espouse everything they stand for. You have proven yourself repeatedly to be a blind fool following the communist doctrine. Your going to get the chance to experience it first hand though.

The dark lord hasn't done everything you want because he's not a true communist like yourself. He's an islamo-communist. Much like communism, with the few running the lives of the many though a theocracy.

The only people that really benefit from communism are those at the top of the pyramid. People like yourself will never see anything but a hard life. Utopia is and will always be a fantasy.

The communist party has not run a candidate for president since 1973. why? Because the democrat party took over their platform. There was no need. And useful idiots like you have put them in power.

[creativeage]

The problem with loving the environment is that this bill does nothing for that. Its window dressing meant to make environmentalists feel good but hundreds of scientists have shown that this will do nothing to help the environment. Companies are working about as efficient as they can run at the current time. All this bill does is allow the government to take more money from these industries because they won't be able to make their products any cleaner then they were before. So the environment stays the same as it was but now we have a massive bill passed onto consumers. Government gets more money and gets to say they did something to environmentalists when in fact they did nothing but help themselves.

This is a sad day for America. All we can do is hope that we have a FAIR election in 2010 and that the new elected officials repeal this travesty just like they did in New Zealand and Australia.

Thanks! I will definitely do some more homework on this. I am just preparing for the upcoming higher cost to live in the U.S. Hmm...Australia might be interesting for a couple of years until 2010. OH crap - I would still be a US citizen and have to pay my huge self-employment taxes - probably doubling because of this bill. Choke!

[creativeage]

Obama may have a sense of his own ethnicity but he's by no means a "radical black." Nor is he particularly progressive. He's a center-right "player" who sometimes pays lip-service to liberal ideas.

Actually, he's quite disappointment. He's shown himself far too willing to play the game according to established rules. True Progressives will have to wait longer for deliverance.

Joe - glad to see you are at least objective, yes our President is disappointing me, too. I was really hoping for him to really show some muscle with regard to a lot of what kept me swaying during the election. He has such a gift - and it's really a shame that he is selling his soul like all the others. Yet another President that merely serves as a puppet. (that's the only problem I had with GW, he sold out his soul, too),

[Joe Steel]

Joe - glad to see you are at least objective, yes our President is disappointing me, too. I was really hoping for him to really show some muscle with regard to a lot of what kept me swaying during the election. He has such a gift - and it's really a shame that he is selling his soul like all the others. Yet another President that merely serves as a puppet. (that's the only problem I had with GW, he sold out his soul, too),

Progressives and those of us who have transcended Progressivism are disappointed to the point of feeling betrayed. Maybe it's our own fault because we read too much into Obama's campaigning. Maybe we just let our hopes outpace reason. In either case, Obama's compromising and triangulation have been deflating.

[stephanie]

JS is disappointed because the Progressives (commies) in control haven't completed a total coup on the country and the American citizens...

you just need patience, they are working it..

[stephanie]

The little Marxist has such a Gift..


They said that about Jim Jones too..900 people dead from drinking cyanide laced Kool-aid, a lot by force...

Didn't they say that about Hitler at first.

[Missileman]

Progressives and those of us who have transcended Progressivism are disappointed to the point of feeling betrayed. Maybe it's our own fault because we read too much into Obama's campaigning. Maybe we just let our hopes outpace reason. In either case, Obama's compromising and triangulation have been deflating.

WTF is progressive about being a leech on society?

[Joe Steel]

WTF is progressive about being a leech on society?

Nothing.

That's conservative.

[stephanie]

WTF is progressive about being a leech on society?

:clap:

[Insein]

Nothing.

That's conservative.

Care to elaborate? How is wanting to make your own way in life, on your own, without any government help being a leech on society?

[red states rule]

If this bill gets out of the Senate, the damage to the country and workers wallet is huge


CBO Grossly Underestimates Cost of Cap and Trade
by David Kreutzer, Ph.D., Karen Campbell, Ph.D. and Nicolas Loris
WebMemo #2503
Last week, the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) released their analysis of the Waxman-Markey climate change bill that had proponents of the bill claiming Americans could save the planet for just $175 per household. That was the figure CBO estimated cap and trade would cost households in 2020 alone.[1]

Both the CBO's analysis and the subsequent legislation are troubled: The analysis grossly underestimates economic costs while the legislation will have virtually no impact on climate. Overall, there are a number of basic problems with CBO's analysis:

•Their allowance cost numbers do not add up;
•They ignore economic costs such as the decrease in gross domestic product (GDP) as a result of the bill; and
•The analysis is an accounting analysis, not an economic analysis.
Problems with Costs and Distribution of Allowances

The CBO's June 19 study projected that the allowance price--the price to emit carbon dioxide--will be $28 per ton of CO2 in 2020.[2] Since there are 5.056 billion tons of CO2 equivalent in the cap that year (the amount of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases businesses are allowed to emit), this projection implies a $141 billion gross cost; however, CBO lists the cost as $91.4 billion. Although there were no changes to the bill between June 5 and June 19, the CBO projected allowance revenues of $119.7 billion, $129.7 billion, $136 billion, $145.6 billion, and $152.9 billion for the years 2015-2019. As the cap on carbon dioxide becomes more stringent, one would expect the allowance revenue to continue to climb, not dramatically decrease to $91.4 billion.[3]

The goal of a cap-and-trade program is to reduce the amount of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases in the atmosphere. In order to realize such reductions, cap-and-trade programs establish absolute limits on total emissions of greenhouse gases. Before businesses in a covered sector can emit a greenhouse gas, they need to have the ration coupons (also known as allowances) for each ton emitted.The price a firm pays for these allowances, euphemistically referred to as "climate revenue," should be considered tax revenue. CBO mistakenly assumes that the government spending and distribution of allowance revenue is the dollar-for-dollar equivalent to a direct cash rebate to energy consumers--that is, that the carbon tax is not a tax if the government spends the money, which is simply preposterous.

http://www.heritage.org/Research/EnergyandEnvironment/wm2503.cfm

[stephanie]

I'm sorry, but the Obamabots still defending this...can't be THAT stupid...can they?? unless you are a true Progressive (commie) who will support it because it is not for "climate change"...Us humans are not that special that we can control THE CLIMITE.....
it is the over taking by our Government over We the People...

good gawd people.........WAKE UP...

Call your Senators and tell them we do not ANYTHING this Progressive administration is shoving up our asses without the bills being read, the public knowing whats in them, or else those Reps. are going to be losing their jobs, that we gave to them......

[Joe Steel]

Care to elaborate? How is wanting to make your own way in life, on your own, without any government help being a leech on society?

Society is about community not "making your own way." Anyone who wants to "make his own way" yet remains in society, by definition, is a leech on society.

[stephanie]

Society is about community not "making your own way." Anyone who wants to "make his own way" yet remains in society, by definition, is a leech on society.

:lol:
that is...
Right out of the communist handbook...

[red states rule]

:lol:
that is...
Right out of the communist handbook...

Like Obama, Joe does want gas to hit $5/gal. He does want electric bills to double. He does want more people out of work

The ONLY way Dems will decrease the use of energy is if people can't afford it

Of they are not working, and it is priced out of reach - libs will get what they want. This is a job killing bill, and when it backfires - libs will try to blame oil and electric companies

[stephanie]

well lookie here, the Communist party of the United States supports Crap and Tax...


EDITORIAL: ACES is aces
>Archive - Daily Online

Author: PWW/NM Editorial Board
People's Weekly World Newspaper, 06/25/09 16:53


The U.S. House of Representatives can take the first step towards saving our planet and reviving our economy by passing the American Clean Energy and Security Act (ACES).

This bill has the broad support of labor and environmental coalitions, including the Blue-Green Alliance, SEIU, Sierra Club, League of Conservation Voters and many more.

The bill, if implemented, would do three basic things.

First, it would create an auction system for selling carbon emission credits to companies that emit the most greenhouse gases that are known to cause global warming.

Much like the successful 17-year-old auction system on acid rain-causing pollution that has reduced sulfur dioxide emissions by 50 percent, this new system would help reduce carbon emissions by an estimate 17 percent over the next decade and much more further down the road.

The auction system would generate billions in revenue designated for investment in renewable energy alternatives and green jobs. The Center for American Progress estimates that with investments in ACES and in the president’s recovery act, an estimated 1.77 million jobs in the renewable sector could be created.

With 6 million jobs lost since the Bush recession began in December 2007, these investments are needed to put Americans back to work. Many of these jobs will be in the manufacturing and mining sectors. Auto plants closed in the Midwest could be easily converted to build solar panels, wind turbines, new energy efficient batteries and the various parts for the industry. A single wind turbine, for example, has approximately 8,000 parts, much of them steel.

Third, the bill reduces U.S. dependence on oil and other fossil fuels, weakening Big Oil and Big Coal’s monopoly on energy. The investments in renewable energies will speed up the manufacture of green vehicles. With new energy efficient batteries, for example, plug-in hybrids might rapidly replace gas-guzzling cars. Wind and solar power generated electricity would reduce reliance on coal-fired electricity plants.

In the end, a diversity of energy resources reduces the threat of global warming and provides for investments in new, innovative economic activity. It would also make the United States more energy self-reliant, making the imperialist tactic of securing energy sources with military interventions overseas increasingly obsolete.


from their site...
http://pww.org/article/view/16145

[Missileman]

Society is about community not "making your own way." Anyone who wants to "make his own way" yet remains in society, by definition, is a leech on society.

What a confused idiot you truly are.

[Kathianne]

Society is about community not "making your own way." Anyone who wants to "make his own way" yet remains in society, by definition, is a leech on society.

Bullshit. The 'community' you speak of, is established by common goals and mores. Perhaps a neighborhood or small town. Mostly people work and deal with their own homes and families. However, when one is stuck in the mud or snow bank, neighbors come and help. Perhaps a child needs a bit more guidance than the parents are providing, so it is given. If that doesn't work, the constable is called upon to address child and parent.

On a larger scale, 'community' might build roads, sewer/water systems, schools, public buildings of various sorts. Each is 'taxed' for the 'common welfare.'

On a much larger scale, 'the community' might build interstate highways, monitor planes, coin money, etc. Again for the 'common welfare.'

What you are looking for is a nanny state, not community. The individual has no rights, but no responsibilities either. Just follow the rules of the Joe Steel like overlords.

[red states rule]

Society is about community not "making your own way." Anyone who wants to "make his own way" yet remains in society, by definition, is a leech on society.

Democrats know that cap and trade will help them in their cause to trigger an economic depression. Part of their game plan is to sabotage the economy which will destroy all vestiges of capitalism and usher America into the dismal and dependent Third World of nannyism.

[red states rule]

Now the liberal media are accusing those who voted against Cap and Trade of treason

During the Bush years the left said dissent was patriotic when you opposed Republicans

Now it is a form or treason when you oppose a Democrat



Betraying the Planet

By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: June 28, 2009

So the House passed the Waxman-Markey climate-change bill. In political terms, it was a remarkable achievement

But 212 representatives voted no. A handful of these no votes came from representatives who considered the bill too weak, but most rejected the bill because they rejected the whole notion that we have to do something about greenhouse gases.

And as I watched the deniers make their arguments, I couldn’t help thinking that I was watching a form of treason — treason against the planet.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/29/opinion/29krugman.html?ref=opinion