Craigslist Controversy Opens many debate topics!

[creativeage]

For the love of opening up Pandora's Box...Anyone up for debating the issues spawned from Craig's List Controversies?

Craigslist controversy reflects broader societal dilemma (http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci_12454802)
"This points to a larger truth about the Web. It brings with it a healthy dose of transparency to just about everything it touches. It makes it harder to stuff things in the corner and pretend they don't exist.
Opponents of legalized prostitution have lots of legitimate arguments about gender inequity, concerns about child prostitution and potential abuse. Those are issues that can't be ignored."

Several issues to consider debating:
1. Shouldn't Craig's List at least be held to some form of moral standards/social accountability like the other giants? Ex: creating a hidden/login required adult section that prohibits "services" like eBay does?
2. The obvious prostitution issue.
or
3. Economic impact of global internet marketplaces: Globalization vs. Localization

[crin63]

For the love of opening up Pandora's Box...Anyone up for debating the issues spawned from Craig's List Controversies?

Craigslist controversy reflects broader societal dilemma (http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci_12454802)
"This points to a larger truth about the Web. It brings with it a healthy dose of transparency to just about everything it touches. It makes it harder to stuff things in the corner and pretend they don't exist.
Opponents of legalized prostitution have lots of legitimate arguments about gender inequity, concerns about child prostitution and potential abuse. Those are issues that can't be ignored."

Several issues to consider debating:
1. Shouldn't Craig's List at least be held to some form of moral standards/social accountability like the other giants? Ex: creating a hidden/login required adult section that prohibits "services" like eBay does?
2. The obvious prostitution issue.
or
3. Economic impact of global internet marketplaces: Globalization vs. Localization

Personally I find that craigslist is policed fairly well, at least by anti-gun Liberals anyway. My ads are constantly flagged and removed for running ads to buy ammo. Then I get nasty little emails from the stupid flaggots telling to go buy ammo at a store. Thanks to Liberals there is no ammo in the stores.

[Gaffer]

I rarely get on craig's list much unless I'm looking or something to buy locally. I guess I'll have to look at it so I can respond with knowledge rather than an emotional knee jerk.

Being retired on disability, I spend my day on the internet. I don't even have my tv hooked up. I get my news there. I read constantly. Articles, essays, books, you name it. I can watch videos or even movies if I want too. Even with all day to do it I don't seem to have enough time to look at everything I want too.

I will check out the link.

[creativeage]

Personally I find that craigslist is policed fairly well, at least by anti-gun Liberals anyway. My ads are constantly flagged and removed for running ads to buy ammo. Then I get nasty little emails from the stupid flaggots telling to go buy ammo at a store. Thanks to Liberals there is no ammo in the stores.

Thanks for input. Craigslist is a "liberated" site, that's for sure, and it is policed somewhat (automated policing however, how can 19 people possibly know what is really going on all over the world on their site) I am primarily interested in debating on the bigger issues that have resulted from this intriguing innovation:) (ammo issue is a hot one, too, tho')

[crin63]

Thanks for input. Craigslist is a "liberated" site, that's for sure, and it is policed somewhat (automated policing however, how can 19 people possibly know what is really going on all over the world on their site) I am primarily interested in debating on the bigger issues that have resulted from this intriguing innovation:) (ammo issue is a hot one, too, tho')

On every craigslist page there is a button in the upper right hand corner to, "Flag" the ad as inappropriate, prohibited, miscategorized and so on. Its not just 19 people, its community policed. Read this one I just pulled up while it lasts. http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/spo/1206862746.html

[creativeage]

On every craigslist page there is a button in the upper right hand corner to, "Flag" the ad as inappropriate, prohibited, miscategorized and so on. Its not just 19 people, its community policed. Read this one I just pulled up while it lasts. http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/spo/1206862746.html

Good one! I really like how craigslist has empowered the people to free trade, it really is the digital age version of home-town neighborly business. What freaks me out is how it unveils some really twisted souls and the people with excess mental baggage and nothing else to do (ie: the "fag" that keeps flagging you!)

[crin63]

Good one! I really like how craigslist has empowered the people to free trade, it really is the digital age version of home-town neighborly business. What freaks me out is how it unveils some really twisted souls and the people with excess mental baggage and nothing else to do (ie: the "fag" that keeps flagging you!)

BTW, that wasn't my post, I only buy ammo, I don't sell it. It was just the first ad that came up under my usual searches.

[n0spam4me]

Heavy stuff!

Too many people still adhear to the "right" vs "left" fiasco.....

oh well.

however anyplace that fosters discussion, its all good!

Power To The PEOPLE!

[creativeage]

Heavy stuff!

Too many people still adhear to the "right" vs "left" fiasco.....

oh well.

however anyplace that fosters discussion, its all good!

Power To The PEOPLE!

You got it! All discussion is good. My primary mission in bringing up the Craigslist deal is not necessarily about politics, but rather point out the corporate social responsibility issue: where is the line? The site is manned by merely 18-34 people, is making sh--load of money, yet refuses to act as the public service they are. (Even newspapers have to hold to certain guidelines and standards to public service). I obviously respect that freedom, and there going to nut-cases and bad apples wherever you go, I just am concerned about how unamanageable Craigslist has become. I feel that same about private large hi-speed Internet providers now: people rely on the internet and it essentially is a public service and should be held accountable like a utility company is...anyone agree or disagree with me on that?

[n0spam4me]

Newspapers publish disclamers
saying that they don't have the time to verify every advertisment that they publish and so if somebody gets ripped-off by some crook, BUYER BEWARE!

The internet has become a favorite for crooks & scam artists. oops!
A! ya wanna build CD modulators at home?????

or? ... seriously now, I think a healthy society will have a healthy bit of caution, rather than spending their hard earned loot on just anything at all.

& Ya, it should be prosecutable offense to LIE to people to take money from suckers. But then again in this land of the TV zombies, the brain washed masses will buy almost anything, and that in and of itself is a CRIME!

[creativeage]

Newspapers publish disclamers
saying that they don't have the time to verify every advertisment that they publish and so if somebody gets ripped-off by some crook, BUYER BEWARE!

The internet has become a favorite for crooks & scam artists. oops!
A! ya wanna build CD modulators at home?????

or? ... seriously now, I think a healthy society will have a healthy bit of caution, rather than spending their hard earned loot on just anything at all.

& Ya, it should be prosecutable offense to LIE to people to take money from suckers. But then again in this land of the TV zombies, the brain washed masses will buy almost anything, and that in and of itself is a CRIME!

Totally agree! I am not looking to protect naive/stupid people at all - it is what is: life is survival of the fittest. People need to use common sense (oh gosh, I forgot...that is a rarity in this world!).

My issue with Craig's List is how unmanageable of an entity it has become (we've all heard the "too big to fail" bs). Companies that become too big without evolving to societal needs as a result of massive growth, then face negative image issues, like craiglist has. Why can't they just do the right thing, and actually try to do something productive with the power they now have: to make a difference? Utilize the extra money to hire local people in each area to watch for the horrific criminals, and actually make each area tuned into the unique local needs. Why are they not simply doing the right thing and working a program to help police locate offenders - work collaboratively to catch perpetrators of crime: it seems craigslist could really help authorities if they would just work with them, that's my main point.

I just think that when a company gets so big - there is some power there, and with that comes some social responsibility, especially when awful things are happening on the monstrous site: I personally would not be able to sleep at night wondering what child is being sold on a site I was responsible for...do you know what I mean? Just searching for a balance!

[crin63]

Personally I think the community policing of craigslist is sufficient.

You guys keep talking about it not being a right/left thing but to some extent it is.

For the most part people on the right aren't going to run around looking to censor the content thats posted on craigslist. They will just stay away from the offensive areas and do their business in the areas they see fit. On the other hand the people on the left are patrolling craigslist looking for ads to remove that they don't approve of.

There are also all kinds of warnings all over the pages of craigslist. Its a self governing, self policing community and I like it that way. Yes there are people who are going to take advantage of it but why cant people just be responsible for their actions instead of punishing everyone.

[emmett]

Personally I think the community policing of craigslist is sufficient.

You guys keep talking about it not being a right/left thing but to some extent it is.

For the most part people on the right aren't going to run around looking to censor the content thats posted on craigslist. They will just stay away from the offensive areas and do their business in the areas they see fit. On the other hand the people on the left are patrolling craigslist looking for ads to remove that they don't approve of.

There are also all kinds of warnings all over the pages of craigslist. Its a self governing, self policing community and I like it that way. Yes there are people who are going to take advantage of it but why cant people just be responsible for their actions instead of punishing everyone.


There you go again Crin. You and this Personal Responsibility thing! Man....Buy you books....send you to school.......what do you do? :laugh2:

The left will have nothing to do with this. How can you be so shallow as to think that you are capable of making better personal decisions than if government was to oversee your everyday actions. They offer this service to you gratus, don't yopu understand? Free of charge. Government is offering to protect you from yourself. What is wrong with you radical extremists who think government should not monitor your everyday activity to promote the common good. You are just another anti-government radical who refuses to conform and that is the problem in America.

[crin63]

There you go again Crin. You and this Personal Responsibility thing! Man....Buy you books....send you to school.......what do you do? :laugh2:

The left will have nothing to do with this. How can you be so shallow as to think that you are capable of making better personal decisions than if government was to oversee your everyday actions. They offer this service to you gratus, don't yopu understand? Free of charge. Government is offering to protect you from yourself. What is wrong with you radical extremists who think government should not monitor your everyday activity to promote the common good. You are just another anti-government radical who refuses to conform and that is the problem in America.


Mea Culpa!!! I guess I didn't read the California public school books. I read things like the Federalist Papers, The Constitution, part of Thomas Jefferson diary (its 28 volumes so I never got through them all), the Bible and other such subversive materials.

[emmett]

Mea Culpa!!! I guess I didn't read the California public school books. I read things like the Federalist Papers, The Constitution, part of Thomas Jefferson diary (its 28 volumes so I never got through them all), the Bible and other such subversive materials.


Well...I knew it. That explains your "out of touch" ideaology of what present day America is all about. The Constitution.....fooey...Liberals have proven there is no need for that worthless document. Oh boy...and then there are the Federalist Papers. I'm not even going there. Propaganda I tell ya! Thomas Jefferson's diary? Get out of here. What would college kids, minorities and queers need any of these things for. They are in charge now Crin and like it or not you need to change your reading material. May I suugest "Heather has two Mommies." Oh....not familiar with this literary masterpiece.....you may want to ask you kid....it was probably on their reading assigments homework last year. You might also want to spend your time more constructively by reading up on the new Government Health Care program. I hear there is a handbook being published which will help with all the red tape associated with getting a check up planned 6 months in advance.

Speaking of that, as you know there are some real innovators out there and i hear one company is selling "Do it Yourself" kits for Home Health Medical Care. It comes with some iodine, a few bandaids, some aspirin, a Hack Saw and a Cyonide pill. You might want to check that out.:laugh2:

[crin63]

Well...I knew it. That explains your "out of touch" ideaology of what present day America is all about. The Constitution.....fooey...Liberals have proven there is no need for that worthless document. Oh boy...and then there are the Federalist Papers. I'm not even going there. Propaganda I tell ya! Thomas Jefferson's diary? Get out of here. What would college kids, minorities and queers need any of these things for. They are in charge now Crin and like it or not you need to change your reading material. May I suugest "Heather has two Mommies." Oh....not familiar with this literary masterpiece.....you may want to ask you kid....it was probably on their reading assigments homework last year. You might also want to spend your time more constructively by reading up on the new Government Health Care program. I hear there is a handbook being published which will help with all the red tape associated with getting a check up planned 6 months in advance.

Speaking of that, as you know there are some real innovators out there and i hear one company is selling "Do it Yourself" kits for Home Health Medical Care. It comes with some iodine, a few bandaids, some aspirin, a Hack Saw and a Cyonide pill. You might want to check that out.:laugh2:

Sorry man, I'm even more subversive than what I let on. I sent my kids to a private Christian school. Where they actually learned about reading, writing, arithmetic, real science and how to think as well as reason. Its such a terrible education that my daughter got the Presidents Education Award for Outstanding Academic Excellence for the 2nd year in a row.

[Kathianne]

Sorry man, I'm even more subversive than what I let on. I sent my kids to a private Christian school. Where they actually learned about reading, writing, arithmetic, real science and how to think as well as reason. Its such a terrible education that my daughter got the Presidents Education Award for Outstanding Academic Excellence for the 2nd year in a row.

Yep, we only use it for 8th grade 'graduation' awards. 18 kids this year, 12 made the criteria:

http://www.ed.gov/programs/presedaward/eligibility.html


Eligibility

The purpose of this award is to recognize academic success in the classroom. To be eligible for the President's Award for Educational Excellence, students at each award level (elementary, middle, or high school) must meet the requirements in Category A and either 1 or 2 of Category C. If a school does not have letter grades, a student must meet the requirements in Category B and either 1 or 2 of Category C.

Grade Point Average: Students are to earn a grade point average of 90 on a 100 point scale, (an A on a letter scale or a 3.5 on a 4.0 scale). When computing grade point averages at the respective award level, only the years at that level are to be included through the fall semester of the exiting grade. Note: Elementary schools are not to include K-3 in their computations.

School Criteria/Standards: Standards for the award are to be established by each school that reflect a 90 percent level or higher on the traditional grading scale. This category enables school personnel to use new assessment and evaluation tools in developing award criteria at their school and apply the criteria fairly to all students. The primary indicators of excellence must be based on academic achievement. School personnel may also consider, as part of the criteria, activities in which a student demonstrates high motivation, initiative, integrity, intellectual depth, leadership qualities and/or exceptional judgment. They may also require student essays and outstanding attendance, but these activities must bear some relationship to the academic performance of a student.

In addition to A or B, schools are to include one or more of the following criteria to determine their selected students:

State Tests and Nationally-Normed Achievement Tests: High achievement in reading or math on state tests or nationally-normed tests. The school may consider college admissions examinations for seniors, for example the SAT or ACT.

— OR — We do not use the 'or' option


Recommendations from a Teacher Plus One Other Staff Member: One recommendation is to reflect outstanding achievement such as English, mathematics, science, history, geography, art, foreign language, and any other courses that reflect a school's core curriculum. This judgment is to be supported by tangible evidence that is comprised of either results on teacher-made tests, portfolio assessment, or special projects. The second recommendation from a school staff member may address, for example: involvement in community service or co-curricular activities including tutoring other students and/or demonstration of creativity and achievement in the visual and performing arts. The school principal has final authority to determine which students receive this award.

Note, our grading scale is not the 90, 80, ect. A low C in public schools is a D- at ours:


GRADING SCALE:
A+=100%
A=96-99
A-=93-95
B+=91-92
B=88-90
B-=85-87
C+=83-84
C=79-82
C-=77-78
D+=75-76
D=72-74
D-=70-71
F=0-69

[crin63]

Yep, we only use it for 8th grade 'graduation' awards. 18 kids this year, 12 made the criteria:

http://www.ed.gov/programs/presedaward/eligibility.html



Note, our grading scale is not the 90, 80, ect. A low C in public schools is a D- at ours:

In our High School level, below 80% is failure.
In our lower levels, below 90% is failure.

Children in our school simply have to master the material.

[Kathianne]

In our High School level, below 80% is failure.
In our lower levels, below 90% is failure.

Children in our school simply have to master the material.

So the school only accepts those with superior IQ's? If the criteria is set according to standards, there is no way 100's of the students can pass at 90% level or else the criteria is set too low.

We do accept students with 'learning disabilities', however, they are required to meet the grading scale following their IEP's. We have students with IQ's in the 80's. They go onto high school and graduate, oftentimes without further modifications.

[crin63]

So the school only accepts those with superior IQ's? If the criteria is set according to standards, there is no way 100's of the students can pass at 90% level or else the criteria is set too low.

We do accept students with 'learning disabilities', however, they are required to meet the grading scale following their IEP's. We have students with IQ's in the 80's. They go onto high school and graduate, oftentimes without further modifications.


No high IQ's necessary, we accept students with learning disabilities and they are able to succeed. They work at their own pace and they master the material. If they do not pass the first or even the 2nd time they keep doing the same work until they have mastered it. No student advances until they pass the work.
My wife taught a 12 year old boy who could not speak actual words, to be able to read and speak clearly within 1 year. She taught a Russian speaking student to speak and read English within a year also. The kids with learning disabilities take longer but they can and do achieve. Its usually the parents who get impatient and pull their kids out of our school because it was inconvenient for them or bruised their pride that their child is working with younger kids. 99% of our students graduate with a 3.5 gpa or higher and go onto college or university.

[Kathianne]

No high IQ's necessary, we accept students with learning disabilities and they are able to succeed. They work at their own pace and they master the material. If they do not pass the first or even the 2nd time they keep doing the same work until they have mastered it. No student advances until they pass the work.
My wife taught a 12 year old boy who could not speak actual words, to be able to read and speak clearly within 1 year. She taught a Russian speaking student to speak and read English within a year also. The kids with learning disabilities take longer but they can and do achieve. Its usually the parents who get impatient and pull their kids out of our school because it was inconvenient for them or bruised their pride that their child is working with younger kids. 99% of our students graduate with a 3.5 gpa or higher and go onto college or university.

Right. So how do they pass at 90% level? When they are 23? Hello?

[crin63]

Right. So how do they pass at 90% level? When they are 23? Hello?

The longest any student has stayed is 2 extra years. The parents know the criteria when they enroll their kids and they are free to go somewhere else if they want too. That's the beauty of liberty.
Most of the time the kids that lag behind are just lazy and don't have parents who properly encourage them to work hard and achieve. Most of the kids with learning disabilities that we have had, the parents just wanted a safe inexpensive babysitter for 8-10 hours. We keep our tuition quite low so parents can afford our school.

[Kathianne]

The longest any student has stayed is 2 extra years. The parents know the criteria when they enroll their kids and they are free to go somewhere else if they want too. That's the beauty of liberty.
Most of the time the kids that lag behind are just lazy and don't have parents who properly encourage them to work hard and achieve. Most of the kids with learning disabilities that we have had, the parents just wanted a safe inexpensive babysitter for 8-10 hours. We keep our tuition quite low so parents can afford our school.

got it. A 'gifted school' with the name. I'm all for it, do not get me wrong. On the other hand, don't work at comparisons with public or other private schools who's agendas are educating the greater number.

I applaud your school for keeping down tuition, which is one of the criteria that should be sited regarding public schools. When 'special needs' are isolated, the other components of schooling can be provided at higher level, for lower cost.

[crin63]

got it. A 'gifted school' with the name. I'm all for it, do not get me wrong. On the other hand, don't work at comparisons with public or other private schools who's agendas are educating the greater number.

I applaud your school for keeping down tuition, which is one of the criteria that should be sited regarding public schools. When 'special needs' are isolated, the other components of schooling can be provided at higher level, for lower cost.

Its not a gifted school, we just have kids that work exceptionally hard. Were willing to take almost any kids but many parents don't want to meet the criteria, its to inconvenient for them. They just want to drop their kids off at school and forget about them until they graduate. We don't work that way.

If the parents aren't actively involved the kids wont succeed.

[emmett]

Both of you have made very good points I think.