Tithing and Welfare

[Des]

What do you think about families who follow the law of tithing (giving 10 percent of your income to the church) and receive welfare, medicaid, etc, from the government?

[moderate democrat]

tithing supports spiritual welfare. I see nothing wrong with it. They obviously do without to some degree in order to tithe. That is certainly their call to make.

[Yurt]

tithing supports spiritual welfare. I see nothing wrong with it. They obviously do without to some degree in order to tithe. That is certainly their call to make.

bullshit, else define spiritual welfare...and use the bible, even those little black letters

[Mr. P]

What do you think about families who follow the law of tithing (giving 10 percent of your income to the church) and receive welfare, medicaid, etc, from the government?


tithing supports spiritual welfare. I see nothing wrong with it. They obviously do without to some degree in order to tithe. That is certainly their call to make.

I think you missed the real question..in bold.

[crin63]

Even if a person is on welfare they should tithe and give offerings when they can. In a small independent church if the members didn't tithe and give offerings the church would not survive.

[Yurt]

Even if a person is on welfare they should tithe and give offerings when they can. In a small independent church if the members didn't tithe and give offerings the church would not survive.

how can you give 10% of zero?

[crin63]

how can you give 10% of zero?

How can someone live on zero? The first 10% goes to God and whats left is what you live on.

[Hobbit]

Once the government has given money to somebody the way welfare is, it's not the government's business what they do with it. Food stamps and such are a different matter. I do, however, believe that Christians on welfare have a moral obligation to get off welfare.

[crin63]

Once the government has given money to somebody the way welfare is, it's not the government's business what they do with it. Food stamps and such are a different matter. I do, however, believe that Christians on welfare have a moral obligation to get off welfare.

I concur that Christians have an obligation to get off welfare.

[Des]

Once the government has given money to somebody the way welfare is, it's not the government's business what they do with it. Food stamps and such are a different matter. I do, however, believe that Christians on welfare have a moral obligation to get off welfare.

Now, what if this 10 percent they gave would be enough for them to get off welfare? Would it be cool in your eyes to still give to the church and receive from the government?

[Mr. P]

Even if a person is on welfare they should tithe and give offerings when they can. In a small independent church if the members didn't tithe and give offerings the church would not survive.

No worries, GOD will provide....right?

[Des]

No worries, GOD will provide....right?

Even then, though, that's not the issue. I understand people have a spiritual desire/need to belong to a church sometimes, but I don't understand why they would give ten percent of their income to that church if they couldn't even afford medical care (which, I know, is expensive), food, etc...

I never knew people even did this until I was offered more information about a friends church and that it requires members to tith (spelling?). I'm not really sure how I feel about it, because churches do often do a lot of charitable work for the communities they belong to (this church operates a food bank and secondhand store). I don't know, maybe I don't see the point in redirecting all that money. ?

[5stringJeff]

Once the government has given money to somebody the way welfare is, it's not the government's business what they do with it. Food stamps and such are a different matter. I do, however, believe that Christians on welfare have a moral obligation to get off welfare.

Could not have said it any better.

[Mr. P]

Even then, though, that's not the issue. I understand people have a spiritual desire/need to belong to a church sometimes, but I don't understand why they would give ten percent of their income to that church if they couldn't even afford medical care (which, I know, is expensive), food, etc...

I never knew people even did this until I was offered more information about a friends church and that it requires members to tith (spelling?). I'm not really sure how I feel about it, because churches do often do a lot of charitable work for the communities they belong to (this church operates a food bank and secondhand store). I don't know, maybe I don't see the point in redirecting all that money. ?

Hey, I feel the same way. Pray all ya want, give all ya want but IF you don't give to the power bill...guess what..GOD really won't provide electricity.

[Said1]

Now, what if this 10 percent they gave would be enough for them to get off welfare? Would it be cool in your eyes to still give to the church and receive from the government?
How could that be enough to get them off welfare? Even at the end of the year, that seven or eight bucks x12 probably wouldn't do much in the way of getting someone off welfare, but you never know, under the right circumstances I suppose it could happen.

[Mr. P]

How could that be enough to get them off welfare? Even at the end of the year, that seven or eight bucks x12 probably wouldn't do much in the way of getting someone off welfare, but you never know, under the right circumstances I suppose it could happen.

Good point, Said1!

[moderate democrat]

Once the government has given money to somebody the way welfare is, it's not the government's business what they do with it. Food stamps and such are a different matter. I do, however, believe that Christians on welfare have a moral obligation to get off welfare.

I agree to both points

[DragonStryk72]

Even then, though, that's not the issue. I understand people have a spiritual desire/need to belong to a church sometimes, but I don't understand why they would give ten percent of their income to that church if they couldn't even afford medical care (which, I know, is expensive), food, etc...

I never knew people even did this until I was offered more information about a friends church and that it requires members to tith (spelling?). I'm not really sure how I feel about it, because churches do often do a lot of charitable work for the communities they belong to (this church operates a food bank and secondhand store). I don't know, maybe I don't see the point in redirecting all that money. ?

"give unto Caesar that which is Caesar's, give unto God that which is God's"

They should hold onto the money, but make certain to note down the tithes they are missing on, so that later, when they are in better financial straits, they can pay off their missing tithes, while at the same time, allowing them to get off of government assistance.

[Des]

How could that be enough to get them off welfare? Even at the end of the year, that seven or eight bucks x12 probably wouldn't do much in the way of getting someone off welfare, but you never know, under the right circumstances I suppose it could happen.

It'snot seven or eight dollars, the people I know give ten percent of their entire income to the church. If they make 50,000 a year, they give 5,000 to the church every year. In many cases, that is enough to provide basic health insurance (at least, to your children...here it's enough for an entire family) and get off food stamps.

[Abbey Marie]

What's your point, Des? Are you aggravated by the fact that taxpayer dollars might (gasp!) be finding their way into the church's donation basket?

Try to imagine how it feels to know that my tax dollars are funding abortions, sacrilegious art exhibits (i.e., "Piss Christ"), the salaries of people like Ward Churchill, and all number of atrocities. A few bucks that a church is probably going to use for charity is hardly the worst offense.

[Mr. P]

It'snot seven or eight dollars, the people I know give ten percent of their entire income to the church. If they make 50,000 a year, they give 5,000 to the church every year. In many cases, that is enough to provide basic health insurance (at least, to your children...here it's enough for an entire family) and get off food stamps.

In most cases someone making 50K per yr would not qualify for welfare or food stamps.

[Said1]

It'snot seven or eight dollars, the people I know give ten percent of their entire income to the church. If they make 50,000 a year, they give 5,000 to the church every year. In many cases, that is enough to provide basic health insurance (at least, to your children...here it's enough for an entire family) and get off food stamps.

I had the impression you were talking about people on welfare giving 10% to the church. In any case, people can give what they want. If they want to give someone 5k at the end of the year so they can have health care for a time, or buy food with cash instead of food stamps, they can. If they want to give it to a church or charity of their choice, they can do that too. If they don't want to donate, they can be happy knowing that some of their hard earned money is being given to people who need it, through taxes.

[5stringJeff]

If you're getting welfare nowadays, you're likely getting a preloaded debit card for use at the store, not $20 bills. Not to mention, it's not all that much money. Even if you got striaght-up cash, you might be getting $500/month, depending on how many kids you have. So we're talking in the ballpark of $50 per month going to a church. Would you rather that $50 go to a cell phone? Or the liquor store? Or the drug dealer in the back alley?

Once the government pays out the money, it's that person's money, to do with as they please. If you don't like it, don't give the money out.

[darin]

First off, this topic hurts my head because churches should be providing for those *IN NEED. Not just physical churches, but believers around those *IN NEED. The government as a 'charity' of sorts sucks.

Another way in which this hurts my head is people harping about the 'ten percent!' rule. Setting a fixed percentage 'rule' when it comes to 'giving' is silly, in my view. It's something more-enforced by CHURCHES than by Christ.

Christ said 'If you give to the least of these, you've given to ME' - at least most folk would say He said those words. To give a tithe of one's possessions or finances to those in need is 'giving (back) to God'.

When folk *IN NEED get their welfare checks, often it means they have enough to eat - and probably consider the checks a gift from God. It stands to reason they should further the giving by opting a portion of the food they buy with it - or the money itself - back to their faith organization, or otherwise to others.




*IN NEED - Having a true requirement for assistance. Not to be confused with lazy, multi-generational welfare clans, etc.

[Des]

First off, this topic hurts my head because churches should be providing for those *IN NEED. Not just physical churches, but believers around those *IN NEED. The government as a 'charity' of sorts sucks.

Another way in which this hurts my head is people harping about the 'ten percent!' rule. Setting a fixed percentage 'rule' when it comes to 'giving' is silly, in my view. It's something more-enforced by CHURCHES than by Christ.

Christ said 'If you give to the least of these, you've given to ME' - at least most folk would say He said those words. To give a tithe of one's possessions or finances to those in need is 'giving (back) to God'.

When folk *IN NEED get their welfare checks, often it means they have enough to eat - and probably consider the checks a gift from God. It stands to reason they should further the giving by opting a portion of the food they buy with it - or the money itself - back to their faith organization, or otherwise to others.




*IN NEED - Having a true requirement for assistance. Not to be confused with lazy, multi-generational welfare clans, etc.


Referring to the last part of your post- I think that's it. I can see the benefits of a church in a local area as far as community service is concerned. This particular church, like I said, operates a food bank and goodwill-type store. A lot of people depend on it. I have just never heard of a family receiving medical government assistance and giving an entire ten percent of their income to the church, even planning another child in the process to be in that same situation. It's one of those things, for me, that I can't just sit down and say I agree with or don't agree with. It just seems like a lot of moving the money around. This church requires it for membership.

[Des]

What's your point, Des? Are you aggravated by the fact that taxpayer dollars might (gasp!) be finding their way into the church's donation basket?

Try to imagine how it feels to know that my tax dollars are funding abortions, sacrilegious art exhibits (i.e., "Piss Christ"), the salaries of people like Ward Churchill, and all number of atrocities. A few bucks that a church is probably going to use for charity is hardly the worst offense.

Well, technically, no, the taxpayer dollars are funding a family getting medical care and eating, which I don't have an issue with. I just don't see the POINT of receiving government assistance if an entire ten percent of your income is going towards a donation, especially when there are various stories in the Bible that talk about the different kinds of giving according to abilities, both financial and personal. I don't see how it goes in line with what's written down and supposedly followed. I donate to the organizations this church runs, even if I'm not religious myself, because the people are like-minded when it comes to charity. I just don't see why someone would accept that money when they are donating to belong to an organization.