View Full Version : Calif. priest tells Obama supporters to confess
Calif. priest tells Obama supporters to confess
A Roman Catholic priest has told parishioners they should confess if they voted for Barack Obama because the president-elect supports abortion.
The Rev. Joseph Illo says his parishioners at St. Joseph's Catholic Church in Modesto shouldn't risk losing their "state of grace" by receiving communion sacrilegiously. He delivered the message in a Nov. 21 letter and during mass.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2008/11/29/state/n103207S40.DTL&tsp=1
interesting
the mans a fool, no one need confess what they feel they do not need too. Sayin that voting for Obama is a sin was just silly.
Abbey Marie
11-29-2008, 03:47 PM
This makes two, at least.
http://www.debatepolicy.com/showpost.php?p=323659&postcount=1
abortion is a sin to the catholic church, and in this person's view, a vote for a obama is a vote for abortion, hence the sin. what is the problem?
crin63
11-29-2008, 04:13 PM
abortion is a sin to the catholic church, and in this person's view, a vote for a obama is a vote for abortion, hence the sin. what is the problem?
By that interpretation a vote for a Democrat would be a sin then. Since their parties platform is pro-abortion. They call it pro-choice but its pro-abortion.
Aside from disagreeing with just about everything the Dims believe and stand for I would never vote for anyone with a (D) after their name because of the parties position on abortion. Even if I agreed with them on everything else unless it was their desire to fight their party on that issue, then I would consider them.
Kathianne
11-29-2008, 04:37 PM
From my understanding of the Catholic teachings, if the primary reason one votes for a person is their commitment to something sinful, yeah, one is sinning by voting for them. On the other hand, if one voted for Obama because of the war stance, caring for the poor, etc., abortion being secondary, no sin involved. Now if Obama were Catholic, which he isn't, he'd have a problem. Not voters though.
abortion is a sin to the catholic church, and in this person's view, a vote for a obama is a vote for abortion, hence the sin. what is the problem?
Indeed, so in this priests view you must repent for voting for Obama or be dammed to hell? I mean why else would he warn everyone that they have to confess?
Kathianne
11-29-2008, 04:44 PM
Indeed, so in this priests review you must repent for voting for Obama or be dammed to hell? I mean why else would he warn everyone that they have to confess?
The bishops disagree. Yes, Obama is 'pro-choice' in a very big way. No doubt on that one. But one might vote for him for a myriad of reasons, in spite of that, not because of that. No sin.
The bishops disagree. Yes, Obama is 'pro-choice' in a very big way. No doubt on that one. But one might vote for him for a myriad of reasons, in spite of that, not because of that. No sin.
exactly, I concur, makng the priests comments pointless.
Little-Acorn
11-29-2008, 04:56 PM
abortion is a sin to the catholic church, and in this person's view, a vote for a obama is a vote for abortion, hence the sin. what is the problem?
The poster who says that no one need confess what they feel they do not need too, says here that the priest should not say what he feels he needs to.
All clear now?
crin63
11-29-2008, 05:01 PM
My personal opinion is that I don't know how any Christian could in clear conscience vote for someone who is in favor of abortion or who's party supports abortion. It's also my opinion that anyone who knowingly votes for someone who is pro-abortion has the blood of the those aborted on their hands.
Kathianne
11-29-2008, 05:27 PM
The poster who says that no one need confess what they feel they do not need too, says here that the priest should not say what he feels he needs to.
All clear now?
The priest can say what he will, it's the US and guaranteed free speech, but in this case misrepresenting the Catholic Church teachings. It is a fine line.
Kathianne
11-29-2008, 05:29 PM
My personal opinion is that I don't know how any Christian could in clear conscience vote for someone who is in favor of abortion or who's party supports abortion. It's also my opinion that anyone who knowingly votes for someone who is pro-abortion has the blood of the those aborted on their hands.
And that is your right. However the Evangelical and Catholic teachings are very different regarding many issues, not the least of which would be intent.
Abbey Marie
11-29-2008, 06:41 PM
The bishops disagree. Yes, Obama is 'pro-choice' in a very big way. No doubt on that one. But one might vote for him for a myriad of reasons, in spite of that, not because of that. No sin.
What if one were to support Hitler for his economic policies, but not his genocide? Are they then Ok, sin-wise?
What if one were to support Hitler for his economic policies, but not his genocide? Are they then Ok, sin-wise?
If you are going to ask that then you must be happy to compare Obama and Hitler, otherwise it's just hyperbole.
Abbey Marie
11-29-2008, 07:10 PM
If you are going to ask that then you must be happy to compare Obama and Hitler, otherwise it's just hyperbole.
Nope. Kathianne said whether it is a sin or not depends on why you support Obama. That statement can be applied to any public figure. And I did.
Kathianne
11-29-2008, 07:16 PM
What if one were to support Hitler for his economic policies, but not his genocide? Are they then Ok, sin-wise?
Abbey, wouldn't you have a hard time with that? On the other hand, if it was genocide as a choice, not going there. If it were deporting, in that time and place, post WWI, who knows?
namvet
11-29-2008, 07:51 PM
so off to hell they go. best place for em anyway :laugh2:
DragonStryk72
11-29-2008, 11:09 PM
And thus the church will lose a number of their people, just the way it goes. I mean it would be terrible if a church forgave people, and made a point to not judge them, or stated that they could not know god's will, and thus not be able to determine whether someone would lose their "state of grace".
As a catholic, this was simply stupid, and a senseless waste of ways to bring people together, which, supposedly is the point of catholicism from what I remember of my 6 years of catholic school.
Abbey Marie
11-30-2008, 10:02 AM
And thus the church will lose a number of their people, just the way it goes. I mean it would be terrible if a church forgave people, and made a point to not judge them, or stated that they could not know god's will, and thus not be able to determine whether someone would lose their "state of grace".
...
If a church was this clueless about their own faith, the parishioners should all stay home anyway. What would be the point in going?
What do you see as their function? A warm place to park one's butt on a Sunday, while someone drones on about how we are probably all going to heaven no matter what we do? Should we all slap each other on the back for an hour about how great a job we are doing?
I expect my pastor/priest to have knowledge about his faith and to share these with me. I expect to be challenged. I expect to learn more about the Bible, then take it home and read it myself to ultimately decide what I believe. I look for guidance, and if it with that guidance comes some stinging judgment, then all the better for my soul.
But most of all, I expect him to not comrpomise his principles and beliefs for the pleasing of the masses (no pun intended). This is a cornerstone of secular humanism, and progressive churches have jumped on the bandwagon.
My personal opinion is that I don't know how any Christian could in clear conscience vote for someone who is in favor of abortion or who's party supports abortion. It's also my opinion that anyone who knowingly votes for someone who is pro-abortion has the blood of the those aborted on their hands.
I agree with you. Fact is though as voters we are all going to be guilty in one form or another of being complicit with these corrupt leaders we vote into offices of the people.
DragonStryk72
12-01-2008, 12:52 AM
If a church was this clueless about their own faith, the parishioners should all stay home anyway. What would be the point in going?
What do you see as their function? A warm place to park one's butt on a Sunday, while someone drones on about how we are probably all going to heaven no matter what we do? Should we all slap each other on the back for an hour about how great a job we are doing?
I expect my pastor/priest to have knowledge about his faith and to share these with me. I expect to be challenged. I expect to learn more about the Bible, then take it home and read it myself to ultimately decide what I believe. I look for guidance, and if it with that guidance comes some stinging judgment, then all the better for my soul.
But most of all, I expect him to not comrpomise his principles and beliefs for the pleasing of the masses (no pun intended). This is a cornerstone of secular humanism, and progressive churches have jumped on the bandwagon.
I expect them to "judge not, and be judged not", I expect "You Cannot Know God", I expect, "Love Your Enemy", stop me when the Jesus quotes sink in. He has no right, none at all, to ask confession of them for this choice, or to say what will occur with their "state of grace", because that belongs to God, period, not some pastor who decided he knew better. I am fairly well convinced that the pharisees were convinced they were right as well, and that turned out to be wrong.
This is the problem, pastors who come to believe that they know God, or that they know Jesus. Heck, Jesus even spelled out that you can't, and yet here we still are, 2 millenia later with people deciding left and right that they do.
bullypulpit
12-01-2008, 05:24 AM
abortion is a sin to the catholic church, and in this person's view, a vote for a obama is a vote for abortion, hence the sin. what is the problem?
Just as one man's blasphemy is another's joke, so too is one man's sin another's non-issue.
Stories like this only serve to highlight how truly subjective religion is, despite claims to the contrary by religious apologists.
bullypulpit
12-01-2008, 05:25 AM
I agree with you. Fact is though as voters we are all going to be guilty in one form or another of being complicit with these corrupt leaders we vote into offices of the people.
Like Bush and Co. ?
Kathianne
12-01-2008, 05:44 AM
Like Bush and Co. ?
More like 'Pay-to-Play':
http://www.nypost.com/seven/11302008/news/regionalnews/shady_island_house_party_141513.htm
SHADY ISLAND 'HOUSE' PARTY
POLS' TRIP TO CARIBBEAN SKIRTED RULES
Comments: 66Read CommentsLeave a Comment
By GINGER ADAMS OTIS in St. Maarten and ISABEL VINCENT in New York
Last updated: 4:01 am
November 30, 2008
Posted: 2:24 am
November 30, 2008
High-ranking members of Congress were flown to a lush Caribbean resort this month for a three-day conference planned and paid for by several of the country's most powerful corporations - a violation of federal ethics rules, critics say.
Six members of the Congressional Black Caucus attended the 13th annual Caribbean Multi-National Business Conference in sun-drenched St. Maarten, including embattled Harlem Rep. Charles Rangel and New Jersey Rep. Donald Payne.
Three New York City officials attended, including Comptroller William Thompson and Bronx Borough President Adolfo Carrion Jr., as well as Gov. Paterson, who was the keynote speaker at a luncheon on the second day of the gathering.
The politicians were seen by The Post during the Nov. 6-9 conference, walking among the palm trees on the breezy grounds of the sprawling, terra cotta Sonesta Maho Beach Resort and Casino....
Paterson's office said he'd paid for his own travel and lodging during his visit. But other legislators enjoyed free airfare, meals and hotel rooms covered by the trip's organizer - and paid for by donations from corporations such as IBM, AT&T, Verizon, Citigroup, Pfizer, Macy's and American Airlines, a Post investigation discovered.
Officials with those companies were observed at the conference - sometimes acting as featured speakers at daily seminars and freely mingling among the pols at social events. Citigroup - which just last week received a massive bailout from the federal government - was one of the conference's biggest sponsors, ponying up $100,000 to help finance the event, according to one of the lobbyists at the gathering.
A spokesman for Citigroup told The Post the company has financially supported the conference for several years, but would not reveal an amount....
This whole "pro-abortion" nonsense has me in stitches...
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.