Obama voters won't get communion...

[bullypulpit]

<blockquote>COLUMBIA, S.C. - A South Carolina Roman Catholic priest has told his parishioners that they should refrain from receiving Holy Communion if they voted for Barack Obama because the Democratic president-elect supports abortion, and supporting him "constitutes material cooperation with intrinsic evil." - <a href=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27705755/>MSNBC</a></blockquote>

Hmmm...Sounds like someone needs to loose their tax-exempt status.

[stephanie]

well well, the hammer of the little Marxist cult is striking already...

and he hasen't even been sworn in yet...

[bullypulpit]

well well, the hammer of the little Marxist cult is striking already...

and he hasen't even been sworn in yet...

One of the conditions for maintaining their tax-exempt status is that priests, pastors and ministers do not engage in politics from the pulpit.

Now, dearie, where's your proof of Marxism?

[stephanie]

One of the conditions for maintaining their tax-exempt status is that priests, pastors and ministers do not engage in politics from the pulpit.

Now, dearie, where's your proof of Marxism?

did you call for all those black churches to lose their tax-exempt when the Clintons and the little Marxist was politicking from them??

didn't think so..

if you didn't have double standard, you wouldn't have any at all..like most liberals..

Scratch a Liberal-find a fascist

[Immanuel]

<blockquote>COLUMBIA, S.C. - A South Carolina Roman Catholic priest has told his parishioners that they should refrain from receiving Holy Communion if they voted for Barack Obama because the Democratic president-elect supports abortion, and supporting him "constitutes material cooperation with intrinsic evil." - <a href=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27705755/>MSNBC</a></blockquote>

Hmmm...Sounds like someone needs to loose their tax-exempt status.

As far as I see it, communion should only be witheld when the communicant is an unrepentant sinner involved in a public sin. I do not see this as warranting the witholding of communion.

I believe this priest should be reprimanded by the church. Communion is a sacrament. It is NOT a political tool and quite frankly, I think this priest is cheapening the sacrament.

The fact that the Democratic President Elect supports abortion is something he has to deal with on his own. Those who support him politically might not even agree with him on that one issue.

Immie

[Abbey Marie]

One of the conditions for maintaining their tax-exempt status is that priests, pastors and ministers do not engage in politics from the pulpit.

Now, dearie, where's your proof of Marxism?

He's not telling them who to vote for. He is suggesting they search their hearts before taking Communion. Since Communion is a holy sacrament in the Catholic church, I don't think it uncommon or wrong to suggest not partaking for serious reasons. Supporting the murder of the unborn being one of them. I applaud the Catholics for taking a stand against the violation of the Commandment against murder. For being consistent as well.

What is highly questionable, is when a church like Obama's preaches the politics of hate straight from the pulpit on a regular basis.

[Immanuel]

As far as I see it, communion should only be witheld when the communicant is an unrepentant sinner involved in a public sin. I do not see this as warranting the witholding of communion.

I believe this priest should be reprimanded by the church. Communion is a sacrament. It is NOT a political tool and quite frankly, I think this priest is cheapening the sacrament.

The fact that the Democratic President Elect supports abortion is something he has to deal with on his own. Those who support him politically might not even agree with him on that one issue.

Immie


He's not telling them who to vote for. He is suggesting they search their hearts before taking communion. Since communion is a holy scarament in the Catholic church, I don't think it uncommon or wrong to suggest not partaking for serious reasons. Supporting the murder of the unborn being one of them. I applaud the Catholics for taking a stand against the violation of the Commandment against murder. For being consistent as well.

What is highly questionable, is when a church like Obama's preaches the politics of hate straight from the pulpit on a regular basis.

It is funny how two Christians can look at something so differently, yet still be Christians. And the Libs say we're all sheep. :coffee:

Immie

[Abbey Marie]

It is funny how two Christians can look at something so differently, yet still be Christians. And the Libs say we're all sheep. :coffee:

Immie

Immie, this is where you and I totally disagree:
Your quote:

The fact that the Democratic President Elect supports abortion is something he has to deal with on his own. Those who support him politically might not even agree with him on that one issue.

I don't think anyone pro-life should support a proponent of abortion rights. Let alone support Obama, as you are then indirectly supporting even partial birth abortion, and his fighting of the born-alive bill.

Suppose supporters of Hitler were to say, "Well, I don't agree with his exterminating the Jews, but other than that, I like his policies"? (I used that example specifically because I believe abortion is another form of holocaust).

They are not against a candidate or party per se, they are against murder of the innocents. If our churches won't take a stand, then who will?

[darin]

I personally can't see why anyone who isn't a Catholic gives a rat's behind what the Catholic Church does.

Mit Romney said it best:

Moderator: Governor Romney, what do you say to Roman Catholic bishops who would deny Communion to elected officials who support abortion rights?

Romney: I don't say anything to Roman Catholic bishops. They can do whatever the heck they want.

(Laughter)

Romney: Roman Catholic bishops are in a private institution, a religion. And they can do whatever they want in a religion. America doesn't...

Moderator: Do you see that as interference in public life?

Romney: Well, I can't imagine a government telling a church who can have Communion in their church. We have a separation of church and state. It's served us well in this country.

[Immanuel]

Immie, this is where you and I totally disagree:
Your quote:


I don't think anyone pro-life should support a proponent of abortion rights. Let alone support Obama, as you are then indirectly supporting even partial birth abortion, and his fighting of the born-alive bill.

Suppose supporters of Hitler were to say, "Well, I don't agree with his exterminating of the Jews, but other than that, I like his policies"? (I used that example specifically because I believe abortion is another form of holocaust).

They are not against a candidate or party per se, they are against murder of the innocents. If our churches won't take a stand, then who will?

I don't quite agree with you in this post.

It seems to me that where we disagree is whether or not the church should withold communion for people who support Barack Obama. Personally, I cannot understand how a Christian can support him, but, it is not my decision. Maybe they were voting based on skin color. How a Christian can support abortion in any form is beyond me, but I will leave that judgement up to God.

In this case, I see it that the priest is using the Sacrament as political blackmail and I believe that to be wrong.

Immie

[Immanuel]

I personally can't see why anyone who isn't a Catholic gives a rat's behind what the Catholic Church does.

Mit Romney said it best:

Moderator: Governor Romney, what do you say to Roman Catholic bishops who would deny Communion to elected officials who support abortion rights?

Romney: I don't say anything to Roman Catholic bishops. They can do whatever the heck they want.

(Laughter)

Romney: Roman Catholic bishops are in a private institution, a religion. And they can do whatever they want in a religion. America doesn't...

Moderator: Do you see that as interference in public life?

Romney: Well, I can't imagine a government telling a church who can have Communion in their church. We have a separation of church and state. It's served us well in this country.

Romney is Mormon, not Christian.

That statement is going to get me in trouble, but, Mormon's are not Christians. They do not believe in Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. They do not believe in the Trinity. They are not Christian.

Catholics are Christian. Denominational walls are not barriers between Christians. The Church is universal and is not bound by denominational walls.

I believe this priest is wrong in using the sacrament as a political tool. I'm sure he can attempt to justify his position scripturally. I simply do not think the sacrament should be used in this way.

Immie

[Abbey Marie]

I don't quite agree with you in this post.

It seems to me that where we disagree is whether or not the church should withold communion for people who support Barack Obama. Personally, I cannot understand how a Christian can support him, but, it is not my decision. Maybe they were voting based on skin color. How a Christian can support abortion in any form is beyond me, but I will leave that judgement up to God.

In this case, I see it that the priest is using the Sacrament as political blackmail and I believe that to be wrong.

Immie

Immie, you are putting the cart before the horse. The priest is not saying you can't vote for Obama or anyone or else. The votes are already done. He is saying that Communion is a holy sacrament, and not to be taken unless you have asked forgiveness of your sins. In Catholic parlance- "do penance". Last time I checked, supporting murder is considered sinful in any Christian church. Do you presume to tell the Church how to distribute their holiest sacrament?

Btw, I really like the sentiment in Darin's post. Whose business is it whether they give someone Communion or not?

[Mr. P]

<blockquote>COLUMBIA, S.C. - A South Carolina Roman Catholic priest has told his parishioners that they should refrain from receiving Holy Communion if they voted for Barack Obama because the Democratic president-elect supports abortion, and supporting him "constitutes material cooperation with intrinsic evil." - <a href=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27705755/>MSNBC</a></blockquote>

Hmmm...Sounds like someone needs to loose their tax-exempt status.

Hmmmm sounds like someone wants to inject the state into religion. Either practice your religion the way we think you should or lose your tax exempt status, huh?

[retiredman]

As far as I see it, communion should only be witheld when the communicant is an unrepentant sinner involved in a public sin. I do not see this as warranting the witholding of communion.

I believe this priest should be reprimanded by the church. Communion is a sacrament. It is NOT a political tool and quite frankly, I think this priest is cheapening the sacrament.

The fact that the Democratic President Elect supports abortion is something he has to deal with on his own. Those who support him politically might not even agree with him on that one issue.

Immie

well said, Immie

[Immanuel]

Immie, you are putting the cart before the horse. The priest is not saying you can't vote for Obama or anyone or else. The votes are already done. He is saying that Communion is a holy sacrament, and not to be taken unless you have asked forgiveness of your sins. In Catholic parlance- "do penance". Last time I checked, supporting murder is considered sinful in any Christian church. Do you presume to tell the Church how to distribute their holiest sacrament?

Btw, I really like the sentiment in Darin's post. Whose business is it whether they give someone Communion or not?

We are all to examine ourselves before participating in the sacrament. I would assume that a Catholic who has examined him/her self would understand that he/she is a sinner and before partaking of the sacrament would seek forgiveness of all sins. In my church we seek forgiveness of sins both known and unknown and I am pretty certain that Catholics do the same.

Yes, I presume to tell the Catholic Church that they are wrong when they are wrong... I am after all LUTHERAN! :) If Martin Luther had not stood up and said no, we'd still be buying indulgences for forgiveness of sins.

:laugh2:

Immie

[Abbey Marie]

We are all to examine ourselves before participating in the sacrament. I would assume that a Catholic who has examined him/her self would understand that he/she is a sinner and before partaking of the sacrament would seek forgiveness of all sins. In my church we seek forgiveness of sins both known and unknown and I am pretty certain that Catholics do the same.
Yes, I presume to tell the Catholic Church that they are wrong when they are wrong... I am after all LUTHERAN! :) If Martin Luther had not stood up and said no, we'd still be buying indulgences for forgiveness of sins.

:laugh2:

Immie


And it is precisely the role of our priests and ministers to guide us in our path to righteousness. Do you deny them that role? Why bother going to listen to them, if they have nothing to add to our self-examinations?

[bullypulpit]

did you call for all those black churches to lose their tax-exempt when the Clintons and the little Marxist was politicking from them??

didn't think so..

if you didn't have double standard, you wouldn't have any at all..like most liberals..

Scratch a Liberal-find a fascist

It the pastors of the churches were voicing support for one candidate or the other from the pulpit, then yes, they should lose their tax exempt status. If the candidates were simply using the church as a venue for a speech, then no. Kinda like religious groups having prayer meetings in a public school conference room.

And you should probably look up the definition of "fascist". It's what the Bush administration has been trying to do for the last 8 years.

[bullypulpit]

As far as I see it, communion should only be witheld when the communicant is an unrepentant sinner involved in a public sin. I do not see this as warranting the witholding of communion.

I believe this priest should be reprimanded by the church. Communion is a sacrament. It is NOT a political tool and quite frankly, I think this priest is cheapening the sacrament.

The fact that the Democratic President Elect supports abortion is something he has to deal with on his own. Those who support him politically might not even agree with him on that one issue.

Immie

Well said, Immie.

[darin]

Romney is Mormon, not Christian.


Irrelevant. What he said stands on it's own. I'd argue anyone having to 'receive' communion from a priest isn't doing anything Christ-like nor particularly Christian anyway.

IF Communion like this is worth a crap, I'd note It's impossible to be a Christian (thus, one's heart is jacked up) as a supporter (political or otherwise) of UNchristian ideals. Abortion on demand. Massive Welfare. etc


Hmmmm sounds like someone wants to inject the state into religion. Either practice your religion the way we think you should or lose your tax exempt status, huh?

Spot On.

http://www.d-mphotos.com/images/applause.gif

[Immanuel]

And it is precisely the role of our priests and ministers to guide us in our path to righteousness. Do you deny them that role? Why bother going to listen to them, if they have nothing to add to our self-examinations?

I'm nor so sure I agree with you on this point. As 1 Peter 5 says overseers (church leaders filling the same role as priests), are not to lord their roles over the flock which seems to be the case here.

Church discipline should be exercised only in cases where the soul of the person being disciplined is in jeopardy and then ONLY with the intent of restoring that person to faith. There is no evidence that a person who voted for Obama (for whatever reason) has lost faith. I can not myself answer the question as to why a Christian would support someone who openly supports abortion, but I am certain there are a myriad of reasons, some stemming from the immorality of John McCain himself.

Maybe the priest should instruct anyone who voted for either candidate to abstain from participating in the sacrament until they repent? If he had done so, then maybe I could understand, but as it is, he is playing politics with the sacrament.


Irrelevant. What he said stands on it's own. I'd argue anyone having to 'receive' communion from a priest isn't doing anything Christ-like nor particularly Christian anyway.

IF Communion like this is worth a crap, I'd note It's impossible to be a Christian (thus, one's heart is jacked up) as a supporter (political or otherwise) of UNchristian ideals. Abortion on demand. Massive Welfare. etc


I'm sorry, but I am missing something here, because this does not make any sense to me. We do not receive communion from a priest. The priest administers the sacrament, but it comes from God.

The only thing I see from Romney here is that he refuses to discuss the sacrament, which is not Holy to Mormons. He is also an elected official. Some would say that means he has no business discussing anyone's faith. I, however, would not agree with that.

As for Catholic priests doing whatever the heck they want, I completely disagree with that statement. They are bound by Catholic doctrine. They are bound by their faith to God. They are also human beings who make mistakes and when a mistake is made Christians should speak out and let them know that they are wrong. Martin Luther spoke up when the Pope was selling indulgences among other things.

People of faith should most definitely speak out and let these priests know that the sacrament is not a political tool. The priest should be counseling individuals rather than condemning those whom they don't even know.

Especially, since they don't know why Joe Blow voted for Obama or what spiritual seeking they have done about the issue.

Immie

[darin]

Yeah - you missed it. Romney stated it's not the Gov't Job to tell a Priest who they should give communion too. It's silly. Gov't need to stay out of it.

Sacrament isn't holy anyway, to all non-catholics. No works are.

People of faith - LEADERS of faith owe it to their parishiners to do things and say things like the priest in the OP. It's his DUTY...IF he values the things he says.

No spiritual seeking can make obama's (liberal) lies into truth - no matter how sincere the seeker.

[Immanuel]

Yeah - you missed it. Romney stated it's not the Gov't Job to tell a Priest who they should give communion too. It's silly. Gov't need to stay out of it.

Sacrament isn't holy anyway, to all non-catholics. No works are.

People of faith - LEADERS of faith owe it to their parishiners to do things and say things like the priest in the OP. It's his DUTY...IF he values the things he says.

No spiritual seeking can make obama's (liberal) lies into truth - no matter how sincere the seeker.

It is not the government's role to get involved in religious events, but it is the role of other Christians.

You don't know you sacraments very well do you? They come from God, not humans and they are Holy.

You people that think you know everyone's thoughts are funny. How can you possibly know why someone voted for Obama? I didn't and I can not in anyway understand how a Christian could support the man, but I am sure there are Christian socialists. Don't ask me how they justify that.

Immie

[retiredman]

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/11/14/catholic-priest-pummeling-obama-voters/

it would seem this guy is a loose cannon

[avatar4321]

One of the conditions for maintaining their tax-exempt status is that priests, pastors and ministers do not engage in politics from the pulpit.

Now, dearie, where's your proof of Marxism?

The government shouldnt have power to threaten Churches with taxes for speaking out. We have a free exercise clause for a reason.

However, in this case you are wrong. They were asked not to take communion. No one is going to follow-up on if they actually refrain or not. After all how is anyone going to know who you voted for?

[stephanie]

[QUOTE=bully pulpit;323745]It the pastors of the churches were voicing support for one candidate or the other from the pulpit, then yes, they should lose their tax exempt status. QUOTE]
well that's good you feel this way..

you can start by calling for yanking the tax-exempt from the little Marxists church he attended for 20 yrs....

I'll wait..

[darin]

It is not the government's role to get involved in religious events, but it is the role of other Christians.

You don't know you sacraments very well do you? They come from God, not humans and they are Holy.

You people that think you know everyone's thoughts are funny. How can you possibly know why someone voted for Obama? I didn't and I can not in anyway understand how a Christian could support the man, but I am sure there are Christian socialists. Don't ask me how they justify that.

Immie


No - sacraments are man's attempt at holiness via deed or ritual. God never demanded nor commanded such ritual and tradition (shrug).

Did you read the article? He's saying "If you believe in the same things Obama professes, your heart is likely jacked up. Get that straight."

[crin63]

Personally I'm more interested in pastors preaching against sin and naming names rather than worrying about a tax exemption. If my church loses its tax exemption we will just keep going. I'm more worried about preaching against specific sins becoming considered hate crimes.

The priest didn't deny the people communion he just told them shouldn't participate because they helped to further abortion by supporting Obama.

Communion is a time of remembrance for believers. We practice closed communion at my church. We have it an hour before our evening service once a month and its only for members.

[darin]

Very VERY well-said.

[retiredman]

Personally I'm more interested in pastors preaching against sin and naming names rather than worrying about a tax exemption. If my church loses its tax exemption we will just keep going. I'm more worried about preaching against specific sins becoming considered hate crimes.

The priest didn't deny the people communion he just told them shouldn't participate because they helped to further abortion by supporting Obama.

Communion is a time of remembrance for believers. We practice closed communion at my church. We have it an hour before our evening service once a month and its only for members.


in my church, as in every UCC church, there are no railings around God's table. Anyone who can profess on their lips or in the hearts or in their minds that Christ is Lord can partake of the eucharist.

[Immanuel]

No - sacraments are man's attempt at holiness via deed or ritual. God never demanded nor commanded such ritual and tradition (shrug).

Did you read the article? He's saying "If you believe in the same things Obama professes, your heart is likely jacked up. Get that straight."

My friend you should study up on what the term Sacrament means, before you start preaching.

http://bookofconcord.org/defense_12_sacraments.php


3] If we call Sacraments rites which have the command of God, and to which the promise of grace has been added, it is easy to decide what are properly Sacraments. For rites instituted by men will not in this way be Sacraments properly so called. For it does not belong to human authority to promise grace. Therefore signs instituted without God's command are not sure signs of grace, even though they perhaps instruct the rude [children or the uncultivated], or admonish as to something [as a painted cross]. 4] Therefore Baptism, the Lord's Supper, and Absolution, which is the Sacrament of Repentance, are truly Sacraments. For these rites have God's command and the promise of grace, which is peculiar to the New Testament. For when we are baptized, when we eat the Lord's body, when we are absolved, our hearts must be firmly assured that God truly forgives us 5] for Christ's sake. And God, at the same time, by the Word and by the rite, moves hearts to believe and conceive faith, just as Paul says, Rom. 10, 17: Faith cometh by hearing. But just as the Word enters the ear in order to strike our heart, so the rite itself strikes the eye, in order to move the heart. The effect of the Word and of the rite is the same, as it has been well said by Augustine that a Sacrament is a visible word, because the rite is received by the eyes, and is, as it were, a picture of the Word, signifying the same thing as the Word. Therefore the effect of both is the same

You don't seem to understand what the word Sacrament means.


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< sacralize sacramental >

sac·ra·ment audio (skr-mnt) KEY

NOUN:

1. Christianity A rite believed to be a means of or visible form of grace, especially:
1. In the Eastern, Roman Catholic, and some other Western Christian churches, any of the traditional seven rites that were instituted by Jesus and recorded in the New Testament and that confer sanctifying grace.
2. In most other Western Christian churches, the two rites, Baptism and the Eucharist, that were instituted by Jesus to confer sanctifying grace.
2. A religious rite similar to a Christian sacrament, as in character or meaning.
3. often Sacrament
1. The Eucharist.
2. The consecrated elements of the Eucharist, especially the bread or host.

Grace can only come from God. It does not come from the priest, it comes solely through God.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/13295a.htm



Sacraments are outward signs of inward grace, instituted by Christ for our sanctification

And here is a very good set of definitions of what Sacrament means for many different Theological points of view. Please note: Sacraments are the works of God, not man.

http://www.stjohnadulted.org/The_08.htm#What%20is%20a%20Sacrament

Immie

[darin]

I can't imagine why somebody would believe Jesus would put his stamp of approval on 'activities' such as that. Jesus was against Rites as far as I remember reading. He was more for personal relationships and a sincere heart than rituals.



Nothing we can do will atone for our sin. (note the period). Thus, God sent Christ as a substitution atonement for our Sin. The moment our heart responds to His spirit, and we believe IN him...that's when it happens. No baptism nor Communion nor other rite or ritual will do anything but maybe give us 'warm fuzzies' now and again.

[darin]

in my church, as in every UCC church, there are no railings around God's table. Anyone who can profess on their lips or in the hearts or in their minds that Christ is Lord can partake of the eucharist.

Those who professes Christ and buy into most liberal theology and morality is a liar.

[retiredman]

Those who professes Christ and buy into most liberal theology and morality is a liar.

that sentence is so grammatically fucked up, I am not sure what you really are trying to say. Go get a english comp textbook, and try again.

[stephanie]

that sentence is so grammatically fucked up, I am not sure what you really are trying to say. Go get a english comp textbook, and try again.

if you can't read it or understand it..then why the hell don't you just shut the hell up and move along with your petty self...

[retiredman]

if you can't read it or understand it..then why the hell don't you just shut the hell up and move along with your petty self...

shut the fuck up...bitch.

I really have no intention of EVER taking your suggestions on ways to behave.

mmmkay?

[Immanuel]

I can't imagine why somebody would believe Jesus would put his stamp of approval on 'activities' such as that. Jesus was against Rites as far as I remember reading. He was more for personal relationships and a sincere heart than rituals.



Nothing we can do will atone for our sin. (note the period). Thus, God sent Christ as a substitution atonement for our Sin. The moment our heart responds to His spirit, and we believe IN him...that's when it happens. No baptism nor Communion nor other rite or ritual will do anything but maybe give us 'warm fuzzies' now and again.

Nothing we do atones for our sins. God provides atonement through the Blood of Christ and nothing else. The Sacraments, Baptism and Holy Communion, bring God's grace through his word in visible signs.

Maybe you should study a little about Christian doctrine and teachings, because you obviously haven't been listening and by your very words:
and we believe IN him you step into the realm of Works Righteousness. If I have to believe in him first, then that takes the power away from the Blood of Christ and puts it in my hands.

Romans 10:17



17Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of Christ

The Word of God is combined with the waters of Baptism to bring faith to the person being Baptized. It is not me choosing to be baptized that brings me to faith. It is God choosing to Baptize me.

Jesus instituted Holy Communion on Maundy Thursday when he said "This is my body given for you" and "This is my Blood shed for you". Then he commanded them to do "this" in remembrance of him.

Also, see John 6:51, John 6:53 and John 6:56

I really don't think you should be condemning something you obviously know absolutely nothing about.

Immie

[Yurt]

One of the conditions for maintaining their tax-exempt status is that priests, pastors and ministers do not engage in politics from the pulpit.

Now, dearie, where's your proof of Marxism?

it is not engaging in politics, it is their belief abortion is against their religious precepts, they can deny communion to whomever they want. they did not campaign against obama...

[Yurt]

shut the fuck up...bitch.

I really have no intention of EVER taking your suggestions on ways to behave.

mmmkay?

oh look, mfm is warming up for his sermon again

boring

[retiredman]

oh look, mfm is warming up for his sermon again

boring

If I am so boring to you, you obsessive stalking little creep, why do you feel compelled to reply to my posts?

faggot.

[Yurt]

i'm stalking you yet you keep replying to me :laugh2:

not my fault at all you have been outed...but let's not allow mfm to derail yet another thread...

Mary had a virgin birth, Christ left heaven and miraculously entered mary's womb. i find it difficult to believe that the entire time Christ was in mary's womb that he was not "alive". i find it hard to understand how christians can support the ""right"" to abortion, would the same christians then say that Christ did not exist until he left mary's womb? would they also support mary's right to abort Christ?

[retiredman]

i'm stalking you yet you keep replying to me :laugh2:

not my fault at all you have been outed...but let's not allow mfm to derail yet another thread...

Mary had a virgin birth, Christ left heaven and miraculously entered mary's womb. i find it difficult to believe that the entire time Christ was in mary's womb that he was not "alive". i find it hard to understand how christians can support the ""right"" to abortion, would the same christians then say that Christ did not exist until he left mary's womb? would they also support mary's right to abort Christ?


I haven't taken one minute of time to find out which tiny office space you are renting in San Luis Opisbo to service your dozen or so clients that you have garnered by chasing ambulances. If I had, then I would be stalking you...but in fact, the reverse is true and you have, indeed stalked me, and passed my personal information along to your even creepier butt buddies. Like I said earlier, we both better hope he is not as crazy as I think he is.

[Yurt]

I haven't taken one minute of time to find out which tiny office space you are renting in San Luis Opisbo to service your dozen or so clients that you have garnered by chasing ambulances. If I had, then I would be stalking you...but in fact, the reverse is true and you have, indeed stalked me, and passed my personal information along to your even creepier butt buddies. Like I said earlier, we both better hope he is not as crazy as I think he is.

that is a lie and i am sure the mod in question informed you of such. stop lying and stick to the thread. btw, your info was given to me, not the other way around. but alas, all your fears are unfounded as i could care less, i only wanted to see an actual sermon (after you claimed you were a better christian etc...), after that, you are meaningless, just wanted to see you walk the walk, which you don't, you live a lie.

now kindly address the point of the thread and stop derailing and stop wishing i was stalking you. i will not discuss this again in this thread. got it, good.

now:

Mary had a virgin birth, Christ left heaven and miraculously entered mary's womb. i find it difficult to believe that the entire time Christ was in mary's womb that he was not "alive". i find it hard to understand how christians can support the ""right"" to abortion, would the same christians then say that Christ did not exist until he left mary's womb? would they also support mary's right to abort Christ?

[stephanie]

shut the fuck up...bitch.

I really have no intention of EVER taking your suggestions on ways to behave.

mmmkay?

you are a phony

[retiredman]

that is a lie and i am sure the mod in question informed you of such. stop lying and stick to the thread. btw, your info was given to me, not the other way around. but alas, all your fears are unfounded as i could care less, i only wanted to see an actual sermon (after you claimed you were a better christian etc...), after that, you are meaningless, just wanted to see you walk the walk, which you don't, you live a lie.

now kindly address the point of the thread and stop derailing and stop wishing i was stalking you. i will not discuss this again in this thread. got it, good.

now:

Mary had a virgin birth, Christ left heaven and miraculously entered mary's womb. i find it difficult to believe that the entire time Christ was in mary's womb that he was not "alive". i find it hard to understand how christians can support the ""right"" to abortion, would the same christians then say that Christ did not exist until he left mary's womb? would they also support mary's right to abort Christ?


you would agree that Christ's entry into Mary's womb is atypical of most pregnancies?

[Yurt]

you would agree that Christ's entry into Mary's womb is atypical of most pregnancies?

yes

[retiredman]

yes
so why then compare Christ's conception to others?

apples and oranges

[Yurt]

so why then compare Christ's conception to others?

apples and oranges

i am not sure

unless you are saying that christ, in the womb, was not like you and i. the conception of course is different, do you believe that in the womb, that somehow christ was different? if so, how then is christ both human and divine?

[retiredman]

i am not sure

unless you are saying that christ, in the womb, was not like you and i. the conception of course is different, do you believe that in the womb, that somehow christ was different? if so, how then is christ both human and divine?
Christ is both human and divine. we are merely human. Is that not different?

[Yurt]

Christ is both human and divine. we are merely human. Is that not different?

what then was christ in the womb? are you saying christ is the only person born of a woman that was alive the entire time in the womb?

[retiredman]

what then was christ in the womb? are you saying christ is the only person born of a woman that was alive the entire time in the womb?

I am saying that Christ in the womb was different than anyone else in the womb. Do you disagree?

[Yurt]

I am saying that Christ in the womb was different than anyone else in the womb. Do you disagree?

kindly answer the question

what then was christ in the womb? are you saying christ is the only person born of a woman that was alive the entire time in the womb?

[manu1959]

I am saying that Christ in the womb was different than anyone else in the womb. Do you disagree?

yes

[retiredman]

yes
then we'll just have to agree to disagree

[Yurt]

kindly answer the question

what then was christ in the womb? are you saying christ is the only person born of a woman that was alive the entire time in the womb?

appears missed as you answered manu's post that was after this

[retiredman]

kindly answer the question

what then was christ in the womb? are you saying christ is the only person born of a woman that was alive the entire time in the womb?

Christ is the only person born of woman that was divine the entire time in the womb. As to any other distinction, I do not pretend to know... nor should you.

[Yurt]

Christ is the only person born of woman that was divine the entire time in the womb. As to any other distinction, I do not pretend to know... nor should you.

again

in your opinion, was christ, in the womb, alive or not

or did god play funny after christ was in the womb

it is real simple, your unwillingness to answer is telling

[crin63]

Mary had a virgin birth, Christ left heaven and miraculously entered mary's womb. i find it difficult to believe that the entire time Christ was in mary's womb that he was not "alive". i find it hard to understand how christians can support the ""right"" to abortion, would the same christians then say that Christ did not exist until he left mary's womb? would they also support mary's right to abort Christ?

You make an interesting argument here that I haven't heard before. As I ponder this a couple thoughts come to mind.

Mary had a full term pregnancy (the days were accomplished that she should be delivered.). Yes, Jesus is God but how does that make a difference as to the biological time line of his incarnation. I realize that the supposed Christians, the ones that support abortion will have to find and argument because they have to maintain their worldview.

Why would a Christian argue in favor of abortion anyway, I don't get that. The only thing I can figure is that they have a worldview to maintain so they twist and warp the Bible the same way they twist and warp the Constitution to suit their endgame.

[No1tovote4]

You do know that per the church rules the Priest has to abide by, he cannot of his own accord deny any of his parishioners communion because of this, right?

[No1tovote4]

I can't imagine why somebody would believe Jesus would put his stamp of approval on 'activities' such as that. Jesus was against Rites as far as I remember reading. He was more for personal relationships and a sincere heart than rituals.



Nothing we can do will atone for our sin. (note the period). Thus, God sent Christ as a substitution atonement for our Sin. The moment our heart responds to His spirit, and we believe IN him...that's when it happens. No baptism nor Communion nor other rite or ritual will do anything but maybe give us 'warm fuzzies' now and again.
I thought he told his followers to "Do this often in remembrance of Me..."

[Yurt]

=crin63;324024]You make an interesting argument here that I haven't heard before.

not to toot my own horn, but i thought it a good point to, and i wondered why i never thought of it before.


As I ponder this a couple thoughts come to mind.

Mary had a full term pregnancy (the days were accomplished that she should be delivered.). Yes, Jesus is God but how does that make a difference as to the biological time line of his incarnation. I realize that the supposed Christians, the ones that support abortion will have to find and argument because they have to maintain their worldview.

exactly. while there is immaculate "conception", there is nothing about immaculate gestation.



Why would a Christian argue in favor of abortion anyway, I don't get that. The only thing I can figure is that they have a worldview to maintain so they twist and warp the Bible the same way they twist and warp the Constitution to suit their endgame.

a christian may argue in favor because we do not know when life begins, according to science and the law. so i can understand that and that is what made me think, it has to be more than science and the law. as much as i don't care for mfm, i don't think (or hope) his world view about abortion is not simply to meet his endgame. so from a christian standpoint, shouldn't we begin with the immaculate conception and go forth.

for non christians, we are back with science and the law....imo, a never ending argument

[crin63]

I thought he told his followers to "Do this often in remembrance of Me..."

I think it was, ' This do in remembrance of Me". I dont recall the often part.

[Kathianne]

i am not sure

unless you are saying that christ, in the womb, was not like you and i. the conception of course is different, do you believe that in the womb, that somehow christ was different? if so, how then is christ both human and divine?

I just came across this, seemed appropriate:


…Many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh; such is the deceitful one and the antichrist. Look to yourselves that you do not lose what we worked for but may receive a full recompense. Anyone who is so “progressive” as not to remain in the teaching of the Christ does not have God; whoever remains in the teaching has the Father and the Son.
— Second letter of John

[5stringJeff]

I can't imagine why somebody would believe Jesus would put his stamp of approval on 'activities' such as that. Jesus was against Rites as far as I remember reading. He was more for personal relationships and a sincere heart than rituals.



Nothing we can do will atone for our sin. (note the period). Thus, God sent Christ as a substitution atonement for our Sin. The moment our heart responds to His spirit, and we believe IN him...that's when it happens. No baptism nor Communion nor other rite or ritual will do anything but maybe give us 'warm fuzzies' now and again.


Nothing we do atones for our sins. God provides atonement through the Blood of Christ and nothing else. The Sacraments, Baptism and Holy Communion, bring God's grace through his word in visible signs.

Maybe you should study a little about Christian doctrine and teachings, because you obviously haven't been listening and by your very words: you step into the realm of Works Righteousness. If I have to believe in him first, then that takes the power away from the Blood of Christ and puts it in my hands.

Romans 10:17

The Word of God is combined with the waters of Baptism to bring faith to the person being Baptized. It is not me choosing to be baptized that brings me to faith. It is God choosing to Baptize me.

Jesus instituted Holy Communion on Maundy Thursday when he said "This is my body given for you" and "This is my Blood shed for you". Then he commanded them to do "this" in remembrance of him.

Also, see John 6:51, John 6:53 and John 6:56

I really don't think you should be condemning something you obviously know absolutely nothing about.

Immie

I think Immie nailed this. Jesus instituted two sacraments for all Christians to follow: baptism and communion. We are instructed to be baptized (and to baptize others) and to take communion, with other Christians, in remembrance of Jesus' death.
Now, the Catholic Church recognizes seven sacraments. The other five were not established by God, but by the Catholic Church, and therefore Christians are not bound to follow them, just like Christians aren't bound to attend midnight services on Christmas Eve (although many choose to).
Baptism and takig communion certainly don't save us, but we are commanded by Christ to partake in these two things. In my mind, a follower of Christ ought to partake in them, and show himself obedient.

[retiredman]

again

in your opinion, was christ, in the womb, alive or not

or did god play funny after christ was in the womb

it is real simple, your unwillingness to answer is telling


Christ, in the womb, was both human and divine. That is my opinion. The exact timing of all that is a mystery known only to God. I would not presume to know otherwise.

[Yurt]

Christ, in the womb, was both human and divine. That is my opinion. The exact timing of all that is a mystery known only to God. I would not presume to know otherwise.

so it is your opinion that, you do not know whether christ was alive in the womb or not as only god knows that? and that only god knows the "mixture" of human and divine such that we cannot say that christ in the womb can be compared to you or i in the womb? do i understand you right?

would you support mary's right to get an abortion?

[retiredman]

so it is your opinion that, you do not know whether christ was alive in the womb or not as only god knows that? and that only god knows the "mixture" of human and divine such that we cannot say that christ in the womb can be compared to you or i in the womb? do i understand you right?

would you support mary's right to get an abortion?

no. you don't understand me right.

I would leave what Mary did with her body up to Mary and her God.

[Yurt]

no. you don't understand me right.

I would leave what Mary did with her body up to Mary and her God.

because to even contemplate the truth of the answer would destroy your stance so you tap dance your way stage left

got it

[retiredman]

because to even contemplate the truth of the answer would destroy your stance so you tap dance your way stage left

got it


no. you purposely misconstrued my words, as you always do, and after doing so, you asked if you had understood me right. I answered you. And I answered your question about Mary and abortion.

got anything else?

[Kathianne]

because to even contemplate the truth of the answer would destroy your stance so you tap dance your way stage left

got it

Seems to me that some have a different God than Mary?

[bullypulpit]

You see, this is the problem with theology. People look at the exact same book and come to entirely different conclusions...Conclusions rooted in their own subjective experience. But such is the nature of human experience and religion...subjectivity.

[avatar4321]

Christ, in the womb, was both human and divine. That is my opinion. The exact timing of all that is a mystery known only to God. I would not presume to know otherwise.

Wouldnt the prudent choice then to be to err on the side of protecting human life? That way, no matter which way the mystery turns out, youve covered your ground.

[avatar4321]

You see, this is the problem with theology. People look at the exact same book and come to entirely different conclusions...Conclusions rooted in their own subjective experience. But such is the nature of human experience and religion...subjectivity.

Reaching different conclusions doesnt mean they are those conclusions are correct.

[Yurt]

no. you purposely misconstrued my words, as you always do, and after doing so, you asked if you had understood me right. I answered you. And I answered your question about Mary and abortion.

got anything else?

genius, how did i purposefully misconstrue your words? i point blank asked if my understanding of your words was correct? i never asserted that is what you meant, therefore, i never misconstrued your words einstein. :poke:

and no, you never answered, you tap danced stage left

as avi points out, you shoudl err on the side of life

[Immanuel]

You see, this is the problem with theology. People look at the exact same book and come to entirely different conclusions...Conclusions rooted in their own subjective experience. But such is the nature of human experience and religion...subjectivity.

How is that different than any other writings.

For instance, we look at something on the net about Barack Obama's "Flood the Basement" economic plans and you and Joe Steel think, "Praise God finally someone in the Oval Office that knows what he is doing", and everyone else says, "Holy Shit! We've just elected a socialist into the Oval Office".

Immie

[Yurt]

You see, this is the problem with theology. People look at the exact same book and come to entirely different conclusions...Conclusions rooted in their own subjective experience. But such is the nature of human experience and religion...subjectivity.

you think is "problem" is only found with theology?

[avatar4321]

How is that different than any other writings.

For instance, we look at something on the net about Barack Obama's "Flood the Basement" economic plans and you and Joe Steel think, "Praise God finally someone in the Oval Office that knows what he is doing", and everyone else says, "Holy Shit! We've just elected a socialist into the Oval Office".

Immie

This is why is important to seek out and learn the truth.

[5stringJeff]

You see, this is the problem with theology. People look at the exact same book and come to entirely different conclusions...Conclusions rooted in their own subjective experience. But such is the nature of human experience and religion...subjectivity.

Disagreement about theological concepts surrounding Christianity does not make Christianity false.

[Abbey Marie]

You make an interesting argument here that I haven't heard before. As I ponder this a couple thoughts come to mind.

Mary had a full term pregnancy (the days were accomplished that she should be delivered.). Yes, Jesus is God but how does that make a difference as to the biological time line of his incarnation. I realize that the supposed Christians, the ones that support abortion will have to find and argument because they have to maintain their worldview.

Why would a Christian argue in favor of abortion anyway, I don't get that. The only thing I can figure is that they have a worldview to maintain so they twist and warp the Bible the same way they twist and warp the Constitution to suit their endgame.

You said a mouthful there, Crin. I often picture liberal Christians putting their fingers in their ears, or hands over their eyes, frantically chanting, "No, no, I don't want to know" whenever the truth is in front of them.

[crin63]

You said a mouthful there, Crin. I often picture liberal Christians putting their fingers in their ears, or hands over their eyes, frantically chanting, "No, no, I don't want to know" whenever the truth is in front of them.

It seems that they cut and paste bits and pieces of the Bible to fit their warped minds instead of accepting the whole counsel of God.

[Immanuel]

You make an interesting argument here that I haven't heard before. As I ponder this a couple thoughts come to mind.

Mary had a full term pregnancy (the days were accomplished that she should be delivered.). Yes, Jesus is God but how does that make a difference as to the biological time line of his incarnation. I realize that the supposed Christians, the ones that support abortion will have to find and argument because they have to maintain their worldview.

Why would a Christian argue in favor of abortion anyway, I don't get that. The only thing I can figure is that they have a worldview to maintain so they twist and warp the Bible the same way they twist and warp the Constitution to suit their endgame.


You said a mouthful there, Crin. I often picture liberal Christians putting their fingers in their ears, or hands over their eyes, frantically chanting, "No, no, I don't want to know" whenever the truth is in front of them.


It seems that they cut and paste bits and pieces of the Bible to fit their warped minds instead of accepting the whole counsel of God.

I'd have to disagree with you on one small point, crin.

That point is that most "pro-choicers" don't justify abortion. They justify the right to choose. They claim that they do not support abortion, but they believe that a woman should have the right to choose. Hypothetically when they get to the Pearly Gates and St. Peter asks them why they supported abortion for all these years, they will tell St. Peter that they never supported abortion but that they supported a woman's right to choose. When asked what the difference is they will say, "well, I would never choose to have one myself, but a woman is entitled to her own opinions and to make her own decisions. The government does not control my body."

See! There is justification for being a Christian and supporting abortion... er the right to choose. They don't support abortion. They only support the right to choose and only pig headed men like us don't understand.

Except... when we get to those gates, that won't be the question that St. Peter asks us.

Immie

[Kathianne]

I'd have to disagree with you on one small point, crin.

That point is that most "pro-choicers" don't justify abortion. They justify the right to choose. They claim that they do not support abortion, but they believe that a woman should have the right to choose. Hypothetically when they get to the Pearly Gates and St. Peter asks them why they supported abortion for all these years, they will tell St. Peter that they never supported abortion but that they supported a woman's right to choose. When asked what the difference is they will say, "well, I would never choose to have one myself, but a woman is entitled to her own opinions and to make her own decisions. The government does not control my body."

See! There is justification for being a Christian and supporting abortion... er the right to choose. They don't support abortion. They only support the right to choose and only pig headed men like us don't understand.

Except... when we get to those gates, that won't be the question that St. Peter asks us.

Immie

I'm confused. Are you speaking of something as antiquated as responsibility? :eek:

[Immanuel]

I'm confused. Are you speaking of something as antiquated as responsibility? :eek:

Actually, I was speaking more along the lines of slight of hands, or speaking out of both sides of you mouth, but responsibility fits in as well.

I mean really if you are using the "pro-choice" argument, what you are really doing is supporting the right to choose an abortion and effectively supporting abortion. To go even further when you fight against any attempts to regulate it or decrease it you are in effect fighting FOR abortion.

Immie

[LiberalNation]

It seems that they cut and paste bits and pieces of the Bible to fit their warped minds instead of accepting the whole counsel of God.

Same with the right. After all, adultry, divorce, tellng lies, turn the other cheek, greed, give to the poor, never seem to make it into law or practice with them.

But god damn everyone else who doesn't believe exactly as they do.

[Yurt]

Same with the right. After all, adultry, divorce, tellng lies, turn the other cheek, greed, give to the poor, never seem to make it into law or practice with them.

But god damn everyone else who doesn't believe exactly as they do.

sweeping generalizations are so cool :clap:

[LiberalNation]

esspecially since you can use them against all groups. They have the uncanny ability of being thrown right back in your face.

[LiberalNation]

Except... when we get to those gates, that won't be the question that St. Peter asks us.

Immie
I know, he's gona ask why you lt peope get away with lying not making it a crime, or adultry. WHy did you allow your country to be ruled by mans law instead of gods.

[Yurt]

esspecially since you can use them against all groups. They have the uncanny ability of being thrown right back in your face.

why would you want that thrown back in your face?

[LiberalNation]

It seems that they cut and paste bits and pieces of the Bible to fit their warped minds instead of accepting the whole counsel of God.
yeah no generalization there. No opinion either, his groups knows the true word. Everyone else is wrong.

[Immanuel]

I know, he's gona ask why you lt peope get away with lying not making it a crime, or adultry. WHy did you allow your country to be ruled by mans law instead of gods.

Actually, he's going to ask if you voted for McCain or Obama and you better have the right answer. :lol:

Immie

[LiberalNation]

No, no, all presidents in your lifetime......

[Yurt]

why would you want that thrown back in your face?

still curious

[LiberalNation]

This isn't a practice sanctioed by the church voters for Obama can still take communion. I know I just did this morning. No wine tho, no way I'm drinking after 60 other people.

[Abbey Marie]

This isn't a practice sanctioed by the church voters for Obama can still take communion. I know I just did this morning. No wine tho, no way I'm drinking after 60 other people.

I guess you're not taking a bong hit, then.

[retiredman]

I guess you're not taking a bong hit, then.

we do little communion cups of welch's grape juice. no contamination issues that way.


intinction isn't so bad either

[crin63]

Same with the right. After all, adultry, divorce, tellng lies, turn the other cheek, greed, give to the poor, never seem to make it into law or practice with them.

But god damn everyone else who doesn't believe exactly as they do.

I'm not sure who you are talking about but it's a very nice rant. Might make your, "rant of the week". I give it a 7.5 out of 10.

God has already judged what things are sins and pointing them out to someone may be being a blessing to them.

[DragonStryk72]

<blockquote>COLUMBIA, S.C. - A South Carolina Roman Catholic priest has told his parishioners that they should refrain from receiving Holy Communion if they voted for Barack Obama because the Democratic president-elect supports abortion, and supporting him "constitutes material cooperation with intrinsic evil." - <a href=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27705755/>MSNBC</a></blockquote>

Hmmm...Sounds like someone needs to loose their tax-exempt status.

Ask, Seek, Knock
Lk. 11.7-10
7 ¶ Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
8 for every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone?
10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent?

or here's another one:

Judging Others
Lk. 6.3738, 4142
1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. Mk. 4.24
3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

yeah, I think Jesus had it right there, so really, I think it's okay for people to take communion, should they ask for it. He should go ahead and read the New Testament again.

[DragonStryk72]

He's not telling them who to vote for. He is suggesting they search their hearts before taking Communion. Since Communion is a holy sacrament in the Catholic church, I don't think it uncommon or wrong to suggest not partaking for serious reasons. Supporting the murder of the unborn being one of them. I applaud the Catholics for taking a stand against the violation of the Commandment against murder. For being consistent as well.

What is highly questionable, is when a church like Obama's preaches the politics of hate straight from the pulpit on a regular basis.

So what of the violent murderers of the born and grown? By your summation, they get thrown to the lions as well. But, I guess you're right, it's not like the bible ever mentions anything as far as forgiveness. Oh yeah, btw, Irish Catholic for 29 years, along with 6 years Catholic School, so yeah, some of us catholics do remember the parts that are more difficult to follow

[Psychoblues]

This ought to clear up any confusion about the position of the Catholic Church in regards to communion being taken and observed by Obama voters:

Source: The Greenville News

By Eric Connor • STAFF WRITER • November 14, 2008

... "As administrator of the Diocese of Charleston, let me state with clarity that Father Newman’s statements do not adequately reflect the Catholic Church’s teachings," Monsignor Martin T. Laughlin said Friday in a posting on the diocese’s Web site. "Any comments or statements to the contrary are repudiated" ...

Newman advised parishioners who voted for Obama to do penance before participating in communion "lest they eat and drink their own condemnation."

On Friday, Laughlin said in his posting that "... if a person has formed his or her conscience well, he or she should not be denied Communion, nor be told to go to confession before receiving Communion."

Laughlin said in the statement that "we should all come together to support the President-elect and all elected officials with a view to influencing policy in favor of the protection of the unborn child"...

More: http://www.greenvilleonline.com/article/20081114/LIFE06/81114030/1013/NEWS05&referrer=NEWSFRONTCAROUSEL

Indeed, it is only the very silliest of the silly ones that would differ.

Psychoblues

[stephanie]

is this what we are going to get to listen to the whole four years of this little Marxist Presidency..

everything that is said against him, you all are going to whine and whine and whine some more...

this is still a free friggin country, we all still have freedom of speech, that is at least until your little Marxist gets sworn in..

[Psychoblues]

Are you asking for some cheese to go with your whine, stevie?



is this what we are going to get to listen to the whole four years of this little Marxist Presidency..

everything that is said against him, you all are going to whine and whine and whine some more...

this is still a free friggin country, we all still have freedom of speech, that is at least until your little Marxist gets sworn in..

:laugh2:

Psychoblues

[Yurt]

Are you asking for some cheese to go with your whine, stevie?




:laugh2:

Psychoblues

how about you keep quiet about what you think would or would not clear up something about what the catholic church says....

you have no authority on the matter and your OP does nothing to support your misguided first sentence of this thread.

[stephanie]

Are you asking for some cheese to go with your whine, stevie?




:laugh2:

Psycho Blues

you and your liberal buddies are the whiners..anything that is said against the little Marxist, oooooooooooooooooo

hell your buddy bully wanted their tax-exempt taken away..

this saying is becoming more true every day...Scratch a Liberal-find a Fascist

[Psychoblues]

I se you are as much the idiot as you have proven yourself time and time again, yuk.


how about you keep quiet about what you think would or would not clear up something about what the catholic church says....

you have no authority on the matter and your OP does nothing to support your misguided first sentence of this thread.

How about you telling someone else to keep quiet? Do you have any authority? I think not.

Psychoblues

[Yurt]

please stop insulting me...and stick to the topic

[Psychoblues]

Same to you, shithead.



please stop insulting me...and stick to the topic

I posted an article and you came in gunning for me personally. Pissonya.

Psychoblues

[Yurt]

Same to you, shithead.




I posted an article and you came in gunning for me personally. Pissonya.

Psychoblues

kindly stop insulting me and stick to the topic, thank you.

[Psychoblues]

Do I need to remind you of your ignorant first post in this thread, yuk?



kindly stop insulting me and stick to the topic, thank you.

Are you now playing the "victim" and expecting some sort of sick mercy?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!

Psychoblues

[Yurt]

if you want to stop the insults and discuss the topic, then let's continue, if not, i have nothing further to add to your wonderful thread

[Psychoblues]

Then, how about us talking about the Diocese of South Carolina condemning the Priest that advised his parishoners to not take Communion if they had voted for Obama?


if you want to stop the insults and discuss the topic, then let's continue, if not, i have nothing further to add to your wonderful thread

That was the original gist of the thread before you so rudely interrupted!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!

Psychoblues

[Abbey Marie]

So what of the violent murderers of the born and grown? By your summation, they get thrown to the lions as well. But, I guess you're right, it's not like the bible ever mentions anything as far as forgiveness. Oh yeah, btw, Irish Catholic for 29 years, along with 6 years Catholic School, so yeah, some of us catholics do remember the parts that are more difficult to follow

Do your arms hurt after that stretch?

Who is being thrown to the lions? Anyone who asks forgiveness and repents, will be forgiven. Where in the article did it say that priest said these people could not be forgiven? Perhaps I missed it.

Oh, and please do tell us how low to bow to you superior 29 years of Catholic-ness.

[Psychoblues]

Do your arms stetch, abby?




Do your arms hurt after that stretch?

Who is being thrown to the lions? Anyone who asks forgiveness and repents, will be forgiven. Where in the article did it say that priest said these people could not be forgiven? Perhaps I missed it.

Oh, and please do tell us how low to bow to you superior 29 years of Catholic-ness.

This merge doesn't corelate well. Did you graduate high school or are you still stuck there?

Psychoblues

[crin63]

I might be an authority on catholic-ness, my cousin is a Cardinal. :coffee:

[bullypulpit]

you think is "problem" is only found with theology?


But such is the nature of human experience and religion... - <a href=http://www.debatepolicy.com/showpost.php?p=324159&postcount=70>#70</a>

Pay more attention please. Subjectivity is an element of all human experience, but religion is rooted almost entirely in subjectivity.