A Closer Look At The Birth Certificate

[stephanie]

A Closer Look At The Birth Certificate
By John P. Connolly, The Bulletin
10/21/2008

One of the most intense allegations of the ongoing lawsuit against Sen. Barack Obama alleging ineligibility for the presidency is whether or not Mr. Obama can produce his birth certificate.

If Mr. Obama were to produce his birth certificate, it would lay the entire question to rest. It would prove, beyond a reasonable doubt, that the U.S. government officially recognizes Mr. Obama's citizenship. The Obama campaign says that it has already produced this document, a scanned copy of which is available at the campaign's "Fight the Smears" Web site.

One point critics of Mr. Obama have made is the fact that the document posted is not, in fact, a birth certificate. It is a birth certification, which is a computer-generated printout of a birth record. A certification is a cheap print-off for people who have lost their original birth certificates. For most people, there is little practical difference between a certificate of live birth and a certification of live birth, although the certification requires extra verification when being used like a birth certificate.

Because of the tenuous nature of identifying a certification of birth as genuine, it requires an embossed seal and authoritative signature. The low-resolution scan available on the Obama campaign Web site appears to have neither of those. The ink from a date stamp, "June 6, 2007," is visible clearly, but it appears that the document does not have a seal or signature. The campaign only scanned the front of the document.


read the rest..
http://www.thebulletin.us/site/index.cfm?newsid=20171644&BRD=2737&PAG=461&dept_id=576361&rfi=8

[Yurt]

i wonder what the constitutional issues would be if he was elected and then found out not to be a citizen

also, he is going to be in HI this week to visit his typical white person grandmother, get a copy dude....and didn't he vacation in HI for a week in August?

the more i hear about this, the more suspicious i get

[Sitarro]

Have you guys seen this? This attorney is serious and certainly no flake.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gA6_k3NtXZs&eurl=http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/10/this_could_be_the_game_changer.html

[retiredman]

My mom recently told me that she cannot find my birth certificate or the ones for my brother or sister. I would think that is fairly common. But I can always get a copy like Obama's from the Secretary of State. And did so when I got my tourist passport. They had a record of my being born at a place and date which agreed with what I had been told. I would imagine that Hawaii has the same info on Obama.

[Immanuel]

My mom recently told me that she cannot find my birth certificate or the ones for my brother or sister. I would think that is fairly common. But I can always get a copy like Obama's from the Secretary of State. And did so when I got my tourist passport. They had a record of my being born at a place and date which agreed with what I had been told. I would imagine that Hawaii has the same info on Obama.

It also came with the seal of the state embossed on it as well, I am sure. To be certified and legal, it had to have the seal embossed on it otherwise it is not a legal document. I needed a copy of my certificate to get my passport. I had to get a certified (embossed) copy from the county I was born in and of course, once I paid the fee, I got it.

I'm sure if Senator Obama was born in Hawaii, the good state of Hawaii can provide a certified copy of his birth certificate.

Immie

[Little-Acorn]

There's a pretty good chance that Obama has a real, genuine birth CERTIFICATE in his back pocket (or a nearby file folder), and is merrily letting the fanatic lawsuit-filers waste tons of their time rather than doing something useful like campaign against Obama's socialism.

And when the fanatics have spent thousands of man-hours and millions of dollars on their "case", and have worked themselves into an absolute frenzy and are screaming for his capitulation, with the election three days away, he'll take twenty minutes off, come to the court, drop the certificate on the table, and go back to campaigning, leaving the mouth-foaming fanatics looking at each other.

There are lots of reasons to vote against Obama.

Birth certificates aren't one of them.

[Immanuel]

There are lots of reasons to vote against Obama.

Birth certificates aren't one of them.

I wonder what would happen if after he was sworn in that it was discovered that he is an illegal alien. :D As far as I am concerned, that would be grounds for impeachment right? Do you think the libs would fight to save his Presidency and demand that the constitutional requirement be nullified or simply claim that it doesn't mean what it really says?

Immie

[KitchenKitten99]

I wonder what would happen if after he was sworn in that it was discovered that he is an illegal alien. :D As far as I am concerned, that would be grounds for impeachment right? Do you think the libs would fight to save his Presidency and demand that the constitutional requirement be nullified or simply claim that it doesn't mean what it really says?

Immie

I thought it was a federal crime to produce fake documents about your citizenship/status?

If Obama were elected, and it was found later that he is ineligible, it is very much likely he could be prosecuted.

My question is, would he go down on his own, or would there be others he would take with him to lay part of the blame?

[Yurt]

as far as i know, obama has not claimed the original is lost...

the OP brings up an interesting point, what if, on the original it had some damaging information and that is why obama will produce only an electronic copy, not a copy of the original.

[retiredman]

as far as i know, obama has not claimed the original is lost...

the OP brings up an interesting point, what if, on the original it had some damaging information and that is why obama will produce only an electronic copy, not a copy of the original.

what if?

I would recommend sticking to the facts.

[darin]

what if?

I would recommend sticking to the facts.

Thought you had Yurt on Ignore? I can't keep up nowadays...

Anywho - The point is, in fact, nobody (read: public) has seen a valid copy of a BC from Obamamamamamama. They've seen e-versions in low detail.

That's the point of this thread. I would recommend sticking to the point. :)

[Sitarro]

I wonder what would happen if after he was sworn in that it was discovered that he is an illegal alien. :D As far as I am concerned, that would be grounds for impeachment right? Do you think the libs would fight to save his Presidency and demand that the constitutional requirement be nullified or simply claim that it doesn't mean what it really says?

Immie

If he would be impeached we will be left with Home Depot's Joe Biden??????? Aneurism Joe as President????? One exploding blood vessel away from Nancy "Stretch" Pelosi as President???????

[retiredman]

Thought you had Yurt on Ignore? I can't keep up nowadays...

Anywho - The point is, in fact, nobody (read: public) has seen a valid copy of a BC from Obamamamamamama. They've seen e-versions in low detail.

That's the point of this thread. I would recommend sticking to the point. :)

I did have yurt on ignore, but at the urging of a moderator, I have decided to work hard to respond politiely to all. even you.

I think that the e-version that was posted online looks very similar in detail to the copy that I received from MY state when I needed to get a tourist passport. "What if" speculation about the next president's birth certificate really seems like some pretty desperate stuff.

[Gaffer]

I did have yurt on ignore, but at the urging of a moderator, I have decided to work hard to respond politiely to all. even you.

I think that the e-version that was posted online looks very similar in detail to the copy that I received from MY state when I needed to get a tourist passport. "What if" speculation about the next president's birth certificate really seems like some pretty desperate stuff.

All he has to do is make his BC public and all the what if's go away. That's all that's being asked. His failure to do that makes it suspicious.

[manu1959]

I did have yurt on ignore, but at the urging of a moderator, I have decided to work hard to respond politiely to all. even you.

I think that the e-version that was posted online looks very similar in detail to the copy that I received from MY state when I needed to get a tourist passport. "What if" speculation about the next president's birth certificate really seems like some pretty desperate stuff.

desperate like when the left went after mccain for not being a citizen.....desperate like that.....

[retiredman]

desperate like when the left went after mccain for not being a citizen.....desperate like that.....

those folks who did so were acting foolishly... no doubt.

[Little-Acorn]

All he has to do is make his BC public and all the what if's go away. That's all that's being asked. His failure to do that makes it suspicious.

As I said, he's enjoying the spectacle of fanatical mouth-foaming Republicans exhausting themselves chasing him, when he's not running away.

If/when it finally comes to the trial, and the final demand is made that he "own up", he'll just lay a genuine original BC on the table, and walk away smiling.

You guys are really setting yourselves up on this one. I strongly suggest you get real lives instead, and concentrate on his liberalism and America-hating alliances.

[KitchenKitten99]

As I said, he's enjoying the spectacle of fanatical mouth-foaming Republicans exhausting themselves chasing him, when he's not running away.
If/when it finally comes to the trial, and the final demand is made that he "own up", he'll just lay a genuine original BC on the table, and walk away smiling.

You guys are really setting yourselves up on this one. I strongly suggest you get real lives instead, and concentrate on his liberalism and America-hating alliances.

The guy who filed the lawsuit is a registered Democrat.

[Yurt]

Thought you had Yurt on Ignore? I can't keep up nowadays...

Anywho - The point is, in fact, nobody (read: public) has seen a valid copy of a BC from Obamamamamamama. They've seen e-versions in low detail.

That's the point of this thread. I would recommend sticking to the point. :)

uh, huh, he was reading my thread the other day (only a minute after i posted it, no other posts) when i was on "ignore" ...busted...and after thinking about him insulting my wife, i put him on ignore

anyways back to the thread...

as i said multiple times:

this is his second time in HI since the issue has come up, take a few minutes, get a copy and move on...

Acorn:

get real lives? all you are doing is speculation as well, you are speculating he has his BC and will pull this stunt...i suggest you take your own advice

[Yurt]

The guy who filed the lawsuit is a registered Democrat.

:lol:

thats right!

and a fairly prominent dem as well

[manu1959]

:lol:

thats right!

and a fairly prominent dem as well

i smell ............. clinton....

[Yurt]

i smell ............. clinton....

:no:

:puke3:

[retiredman]

uh, huh, he was reading my thread the other day (only a minute after i posted it, no other posts) when i was on "ignore" ...busted...and after thinking about him insulting my wife, i put him on ignore

anyways back to the thread...

as i said multiple times:

this is his second time in HI since the issue has come up, take a few minutes, get a copy and move on...

Acorn:

get real lives? all you are doing is speculation as well, you are speculating he has his BC and will pull this stunt...i suggest you take your own advice

he already posted a copy online for all to see.

[retiredman]

uh, huh, he was reading my thread the other day (only a minute after i posted it, no other posts) when i was on "ignore" ...busted...and after thinking about him insulting my wife, i put him on ignore



actually, I did not insult your wife, I insulted you, and I want to apologize for that. I was thinking about sending you multiple PM's but since you have me on ignore, you wouldn't get them. I will try very hard not to insult you in the future and to ignore the insults from you that will come my way. As I said, I look forward to polite discussions with you in the future.

[Binky]

My mom recently told me that she cannot find my birth certificate or the ones for my brother or sister. I would think that is fairly common. But I can always get a copy like Obama's from the Secretary of State. And did so when I got my tourist passport. They had a record of my being born at a place and date which agreed with what I had been told. I would imagine that Hawaii has the same info on Obama.


I'm 61 years old and my birth certificate is a document that I've kept with my important papers since my mom gave it to me when I turned 18. I know EXACTLY where it is kept and I can easily get my hands on it.

Any person that has a legitmate birth certificate wouldn't have trouble getting a copy of it if need be. Nor would he or she be unwilling to produce it if asked. It's a simple as that. If there is nothing funky going on with it one way or the other, then why hasn't he produced it rather than waste time on this matter?

And if he's elected and it comes to light at some later date that he is not a naturalized citizen, would Biden step in and become president? I know when Pres. Kennedy was assinated, V. P Johson took over and was sworn in. Does the same hold true if Obama were impeached?

Anyway, I don't think anyone would impeach him. He's their wonder boy and perceived to be the Messiah. They'd fight tooth and nail to not let that happen.

[retiredman]

I'm 61 years old and my birth certificate is a document that I've kept with my important papers since my mom gave it to me when I turned 18. I know EXACTLY where it is kept and I can easily get my hands on it.

.

you've got yours...I don't have mine... why do we think that Obama has his?

[Immanuel]

he already posted a copy online for all to see.

Not a certified copy. As it is, it is nothing put a picture online without an ounce of authentication.

Immie

[Yurt]

Not a certified copy. As it is, it is nothing put a picture online without an ounce of authentication.

Immie

obammmy is purportedly a harvard trained lawyer, even he knows that copy would not be admissible UNLESS he can show that there is NO other available copy.

he hasn't done this. why do i bring up legalities? because he has gangs of lawyers working with his campaign to threaten anyone who dares speak against him....further...this claim is in court and his gang of lawyers is fighting it, not on the merits, but on legal technicalities...what is he hiding?

[retiredman]

obammmy is purportedly a harvard trained lawyer, even he knows that copy would not be admissible UNLESS he can show that there is NO other available copy.

he hasn't done this. why do i bring up legalities? because he has gangs of lawyers working with his campaign to threaten anyone who dares speak against him....further...this claim is in court and his gang of lawyers is fighting it, not on the merits, but on legal technicalities...what is he hiding?

How does one disprove a negative? How can Obama prove that his original birth certificate does not exist?

[AFbombloader]

My mom recently told me that she cannot find my birth certificate or the ones for my brother or sister. I would think that is fairly common. But I can always get a copy like Obama's from the Secretary of State. And did so when I got my tourist passport. They had a record of my being born at a place and date which agreed with what I had been told. I would imagine that Hawaii has the same info on Obama.

I couldn't use a copy of the birth certificate to enlist someone inth the Air Force. I needed to have a raised seal birth certificate. It sounds like tat is the only thing that will stop people from questioning the validity of Obama's birth. If it is a requirement for enlistment, it should be a requirement to become the CIC. Most states allow you to order a replacement certificate online. I am not sure if HI does. What is stopping him from even doing that?

AF:salute:

[No1tovote4]

My mom recently told me that she cannot find my birth certificate or the ones for my brother or sister. I would think that is fairly common. But I can always get a copy like Obama's from the Secretary of State. And did so when I got my tourist passport. They had a record of my being born at a place and date which agreed with what I had been told. I would imagine that Hawaii has the same info on Obama.
I would imagine yours had the seal and signature that is required to make it a legal document, unlike the one on his website.

[No1tovote4]

what if?

I would recommend sticking to the facts.
That would be easier if the facts were in fact available.

The fact is, he has not provided a suitable document to the courts and is fighting a request to do so, inexplicably.

[Yurt]

I would imagine yours had the seal and signature that is required to make it a legal document, unlike the one on his website.

that still is not good enough, unless he can show the original is unavailable and for good cause...

[retiredman]

that still is not good enough, unless he can show the original is unavailable and for good cause...

good cause? How about it was a piece of paper that somebody gave his mother when he was born and she then moved to Indonesia and all over God's green acre and now is dead and no one has a clue where in the world it might be? Isn't that good enough?:lol:

[Immanuel]

How does one disprove a negative? How can Obama prove that his original birth certificate does not exist?

He doesn't need to. He only needs to get a certified copy from the County Clerk or who ever handles that in the State of Hawaii. Easy enough to do.

Immie

[retiredman]

He doesn't need to. He only needs to get a certified copy from the County Clerk or who ever handles that in the State of Hawaii. Easy enough to do.

Immie


I would suggest that the copy available on the internet is exactly that.

[Immanuel]

I would suggest that the copy available on the internet is exactly that.

And you would be wrong, as it is not a certified copy of anything.

Immie

[retiredman]

And you would be wrong, as it is not a certified copy of anything.

Immie

I disagree

[Yurt]

good cause? How about it was a piece of paper that somebody gave his mother when he was born and she then moved to Indonesia and all over God's green acre and now is dead and no one has a clue where in the world it might be? Isn't that good enough?:lol:

i thought you said you read his books....


Barack Obama has claimed in writing to have a valid printed document: In the first chapter of his book Dreams From My Father, describing his origins, he wrote about finding a local Hawaiian newspaper article about his Kenyan father: "I discovered this article, folded away among my birth certificate and old vaccination forms, when I was in high school."

[Kathianne]

i thought you said you read his books....

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Yurt again.

[Immanuel]

I disagree

Then you are obviously a partisan hack that has no idea what the words "certified copy" means.

Immie

[No1tovote4]

I would suggest that the copy available on the internet is exactly that.
Except it is not certified and does not have the handling number, both of which have been shown to be necessary to make it an official document.

The one on "Factcheck" is itself questionable as they are owned by a company that funneled money for Obama's political needs in the past. If Obama truly wanted the question answered he would simply hand over the document rather than inexplicably attempting to deny any and all access to it except by a group that he holds strong sway with.

Did you even watch the video or are you thrusting your fists against the post while insisting you still see ghosts?

[retiredman]

Except it is not certified and does not have the handling number, both of which have been shown to be necessary to make it an official document.

The one on "Factcheck" is itself questionable as they are owned by a company that funneled money for Obama's political needs in the past. If Obama truly wanted the question answered he would simply hand over the document rather than inexplicably attempting to deny any and all access to it except by a group that he holds strong sway with.

Did you even watch the video or are you thrusting your fists against the post while insisting you still see ghosts?


I watched the video...it seemed filled with groundless speculation.

[No1tovote4]

I watched the video...it seemed filled with groundless speculation.
Which could be silenced by one small action of Obama's.

It was actually backed up with information, the speculation part comes from the denial of information by one of the parties.

[retiredman]

Which could be silenced by one small action of Obama's.

It was actually backed up with information, the speculation part comes from the denial of information by one of the parties.


no..the speculation part came from goofy assertions that he was born in Kenya.

did you ever bother to imagine that, for the Obama campaign, this is so trivial that it is beneath their radar?

[No1tovote4]

no..the speculation part came from goofy assertions that he was born in Kenya.

did you ever bother to imagine that, for the Obama campaign, this is so trivial that it is beneath their radar?
No. I don't consider it that way because of the seal-less document he presented for my perusal. And that speculation about Kenya comes from direct information of a relative who claims to have been present at his birth.

There seems to be a directed effort at withholding this information. Information that we all know is simple to get and could be easily answered. He's even in Hawaii right now. Get the document and hand it over, it isn't that difficult and your campaign surely has the money....

[retiredman]

No. I don't consider it that way because of the seal-less document he presented for my perusal.

There seems to be a directed effort at withholding this information. Information that we all know is simple to get and could be easily answered. He's even in Hawaii right now. Get the document and hand it over, it isn't that difficult and your campaign surely has the money....

did you ever consider that it might be too trivial for his campaign to even CARE about? really. I would doubt that anyone in his campaign is even thinking about his birth certificate.

[No1tovote4]

did you ever consider that it might be too trivial for his campaign to even CARE about? really. I would doubt that anyone in his campaign is even thinking about his birth certificate.
Again. No.

Meeting the constitutional requirements to become President is not "trivial" unless you think the Constitution is, as others believe that Bush thinks, just a "piece of paper". And I guarantee they are thinking about his birth certificate, they are paying a slew of lawyer to try to deny access for even longer.

[retiredman]

Again. No.

Meeting the constitutional requirements to become President is not "trivial" unless you think the Constitution is, as others believe that Bush thinks, just a "piece of paper".


If you KNEW you were born in the USA, would YOU waste any time trying to prove it to a minuscule, insignificant minority, the vast majority of which were not planning on voting for you in the first place?

[No1tovote4]

If you KNEW you were born in the USA, would YOU waste any time trying to prove it to a minuscule, insignificant minority, the vast majority of which were not planning on voting for you in the first place?
I would have provided it long, long ago. It's inane to suggest you would hire lawyers to try to keep it hidden rather than just supply the document because you "didn't care".

MM, worship of a man doesn't become you, and ignoring constitutional requirements because you just think you are that great isn't one of the things I thought you would support.

Nothing but hackery could, at this point after that much money was spent on lawyers, make anybody suggest that he "didn't care".

[retiredman]

I would have provided it long, long ago. It's inane to suggest you would hire lawyers to try to keep it hidden rather than just supply the document because you "didn't care".

MM, worship of a man doesn't become you, and ignoring constitutional requirements because you just think you are that great isn't one of the things I thought you would support.

Nothing but hackery could, at this point after that much money was spent on lawyers, make anybody suggest that he "didn't care".

I am not aware of how much money he spent on lawyers.

[No1tovote4]

I am not aware of how much money he spent on lawyers.
Well they don't come cheap and there are, according to the video, many.

Even paying one lawyer to get them to suppress the information suggests that he cares to keep it silenced for some reason that I find inexplicable.

His action is what creates the questions themselves. When it was asked if McCain was a "natural born citizen" he didn't hesitate to supply actual evidence with seals and signatures affixed. Why is it so important for Obama to pay people to help him hide this document? It's a simple request, one that no other Presidential candidate of modern times has denied.

[retiredman]

Well they don't come cheap and there are, according to the video, many.

Even paying one lawyer to get them to suppress the information suggests that he cares to keep it silenced for some reason that I find inexplicable.

His action is what creates the questions themselves. When it was asked if McCain was a "natural born citizen" he didn't hesitate to supply actual evidence with seals and signatures affixed. Why is it so important for Obama to pay people to help him hide this document? It's a simple request, one that no other Presidential candidate of modern times has denied.


other than McCain, how many other presidential candidates in modern times have been asked?

[Kathianne]

Well they don't come cheap and there are, according to the video, many.

Even paying one lawyer to get them to suppress the information suggests that he cares to keep it silenced for some reason that I find inexplicable.

His action is what creates the questions themselves. When it was asked if McCain was a "natural born citizen" he didn't hesitate to supply actual evidence with seals and signatures affixed. Why is it so important for Obama to pay people to help him hide this document? It's a simple request, one that no other Presidential candidate of modern times has denied.

I agree. Like I said, from the get go my take was this was a false issue, the question in my mind came from the Obama campaign's desire to conceal and deny. Why? Unless there IS a problem?

[No1tovote4]

other than McCain, how many other presidential candidates in modern times have been asked?
Well, I did research and found all of them from my lifetime available for viewing. Whether or not they were asked, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush, Clinton, Bush all supplied them, at the very least, for historical reference.

It seems that none of the others actually had to be asked.

[Kathianne]

Well, I did research and found all of them from my lifetime available for viewing. Whether or not they were asked, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush, Clinton, Bush all supplied them, at the very least, for historical reference.

It seems that none of the others actually had to be asked.

Damn, I like researching, but you've always been better. Props.

[stephanie]

the little Marxist could probably commit murder and his cult members would just make an excuse for it, and still vote for him..

[retiredman]

the little Marxist could probably commit murder and his cult members would just make an excuse for it, and still vote for him..

steph...I am curious...do you use "marxist" in any sort of an intellectual way, or is it merely a perjorative? Can you really articulate what it is that is "marxist" about Obama's philosophy?

[Kathianne]

steph...I am curious...do you use "marxist" in any sort of an intellectual way, or is it merely a perjorative? Can you really articulate what it is that is "marxist" about Obama's philosophy?

Exactly where do you draw the line at who you look down upon? Birth? Education? Posting style? Political affiliation? Branch of service?

[No1tovote4]

the little Marxist could probably commit murder and his cult members would just make an excuse for it, and still vote for him..
IMO, the one vote against the law to protect those born alive during an attempted abortion is indefensible enough. Add in all the other things and this guy isn't just Teflon, he's greased Teflon on ice...

Then he lied and said that it didn't have a provision that said it was not meant to make abortion illegal... but it did. His excuse didn't hold.

This happens often with this guy, and suggests that it will in this case as well simply because of history.

First we heard that he barely knew Ayers, then CNN finds he launched his political career from Ayers' home. They have had a long and fruitful relationship. Now the excuse is "I was 8 when he bombed..." Dude is totally unwilling to say what he did was wrong. He was thrilled to say he wished he had done more. And when he got off because the cops were stupid and didn't get warrants for some of the evidence? He came out and announced "Guilty as Hell, free as a bird!"

If an abortion bomber who got off on a technicality and wished he had "done more" stated this crap then McCain launched his political career from his house how far do you think he would have gone? I'd bet dollars to donuts that he wouldn't be running for President. It wouldn't even have mattered if the bomber had done it after closing when nobody was hurt.

First we heard how much he didn't know that Wright said those things in church, later we found out that he did know it all the time. Then he denied the words but not the pastor. It was about this time that I was posting about the fact that about one year before in TIME Wright had spoken of a plan between them to "distance" Obama from Wright. Days later the plan was sprung... Wright said stupid things (IMO on purpose as part of that plan) that allowed Obama to deny his "Crazy Uncle"...

He didn't reject the church until they had a visiting Priest that also embarrassed him, so they too were done.

Nothing this man has said or done suggests that anything he tries to hide will pan out. In fact, so far none of them have. Yet he still has the worship of throngs of crowds willing to deny even the Constitutional requirements in order to get him elected.

I may not vote for McCain, but I sure as heck am not voting for a guy I can't even trust when he speaks about his pastor. Nor will I ignore it when he starts acting like he has something to hide.

[Kathianne]

IMO, the one vote against the law to protect those born alive during an attempted abortion is indefensible enough. Add in all the other things and this guy isn't just Teflon, he's greased Teflon on ice...

Then he lied and said that it didn't have a provision that said it was not meant to make abortion illegal... but it did. His excuse didn't hold.

This happens often with this guy, and suggests that it will in this case as well simply because of history.

First we heard that he barely knew Ayers, then CNN finds he launched his political career from Ayers' home. They have had a long and fruitful relationship. Now the excuse is "I was 8 when he bombed..." Dude is totally unwilling to say what he did was wrong. He was thrilled to say he wished he had done more. And when he got off because the cops were stupid and didn't get warrants for some of the evidence? He came out and announced "Guilty as Hell, free as a bird!"

If an abortion bomber who got off on a technicality and wished he had "done more" stated this crap then McCain launched his political career from his house how far do you think he would have gone? I'd bet dollars to donuts that he wouldn't be running for President. It wouldn't even have mattered if the bomber had done it after closing when nobody was hurt.

First we heard how much he didn't know that Wright said those things in church, later we found out that he did know it all the time. Then he denied the words but not the pastor. It was about this time that I was posting about the fact that about one year before in TIME Wright had spoken of a plan between them to "distance" Obama from Wright. Days later the plan was sprung... Wright said stupid things (IMO on purpose as part of that plan) that allowed Obama to deny his "Crazy Uncle"...

He didn't reject the church until they had a visiting Priest that also embarrassed him, so they too were done.

Nothing this man has said or done suggests that anything he tries to hide will pan out. In fact, so far none of them have. Yet he still has the worship of throngs of crowds willing to deny even the Constitutional requirements in order to get him elected.

I may not vote for McCain, but I sure as heck am not voting for a guy I can't even trust when he speaks about his pastor. Nor will I ignore it when he starts acting like he has something to hide.
:clap::clap::clap:

I've been too lazy to work up the long post on this, you did good. I'm concerned though, when someone like myself finds little reason to bother, what is to become of us? I know I'm like 99% more 'active' politically than most.

[stephanie]

Mfm just can't stand to have his "cult leader" called by any other name...

I think I'll start calling him what he really is, the little Marxist lying thug..:dance:

[Abbey Marie]

IMO, the one vote against the law to protect those born alive during an attempted abortion is indefensible enough. Add in all the other things and this guy isn't just Teflon, he's greased Teflon on ice...

Then he lied and said that it didn't have a provision that said it was not meant to make abortion illegal... but it did. His excuse didn't hold.

This happens often with this guy, and suggests that it will in this case as well simply because of history.

First we heard that he barely knew Ayers, then CNN finds he launched his political career from Ayers' home. They have had a long and fruitful relationship. Now the excuse is "I was 8 when he bombed..." Dude is totally unwilling to say what he did was wrong. He was thrilled to say he wished he had done more. And when he got off because the cops were stupid and didn't get warrants for some of the evidence? He came out and announced "Guilty as Hell, free as a bird!"

If an abortion bomber who got off on a technicality and wished he had "done more" stated this crap then McCain launched his political career from his house how far do you think he would have gone? I'd bet dollars to donuts that he wouldn't be running for President. It wouldn't even have mattered if the bomber had done it after closing when nobody was hurt.

First we heard how much he didn't know that Wright said those things in church, later we found out that he did know it all the time. Then he denied the words but not the pastor. It was about this time that I was posting about the fact that about one year before in TIME Wright had spoken of a plan between them to "distance" Obama from Wright. Days later the plan was sprung... Wright said stupid things (IMO on purpose as part of that plan) that allowed Obama to deny his "Crazy Uncle"...

He didn't reject the church until they had a visiting Priest that also embarrassed him, so they too were done.

Nothing this man has said or done suggests that anything he tries to hide will pan out. In fact, so far none of them have. Yet he still has the worship of throngs of crowds willing to deny even the Constitutional requirements in order to get him elected.

I may not vote for McCain, but I sure as heck am not voting for a guy I can't even trust when he speaks about his pastor. Nor will I ignore it when he starts acting like he has something to hide.

Excellent post, N.

[manu1959]

steph...I am curious...do you use "marxist" in any sort of an intellectual way, or is it merely a perjorative? Can you really articulate what it is that is "marxist" about Obama's philosophy?

is your claim that there are no similarities between marxist philosphies and obama's rehtoric....

[MtnBiker]

Well, I did research and found all of them from my lifetime available for viewing. Whether or not they were asked, Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush, Clinton, Bush all supplied them, at the very least, for historical reference.

It seems that none of the others actually had to be asked.

In your research, how many presidential canidates were sons by fathers of foreign nations that had multiple children by multiple women in mulitple locations around the globe?

[No1tovote4]

In your research, how many presidential canidates were sons by fathers of foreign nations that had multiple children by multiple women in mulitple locations around the globe?
One.

[MtnBiker]

One.

that one

[Kathianne]

Questions not wanting to be asked. John, are you listening?

[Yurt]

good cause? How about it was a piece of paper that somebody gave his mother when he was born and she then moved to Indonesia and all over God's green acre and now is dead and no one has a clue where in the world it might be? Isn't that good enough?:lol:

AGAIN:

Barack Obama has claimed in writing to have a valid printed document: In the first chapter of his book Dreams From My Father, describing his origins, he wrote about finding a local Hawaiian newspaper article about his Kenyan father: "I discovered this article, folded away among my birth certificate and old vaccination forms, when I was in high school."


:lol:

[crin63]

This whole thing should be cleared up right after the Manchurian Candidate gets back from Hawaii with his newly created birth certificate.

Everyone I talked to today figures he went there to get a forged copy. It will be truly amazing if he produces it after his trip to Hawaii.

[No1tovote4]

This whole thing should be cleared up right after the Manchurian Candidate gets back from Hawaii with his newly created birth certificate.

Everyone I talked to today figures he went there to get a forged copy. It will be truly amazing if he produces it after his trip to Hawaii.
What would be amazing is if he got caught.

[Yurt]

This whole thing should be cleared up right after the Manchurian Candidate gets back from Hawaii with his newly created birth certificate.

Everyone I talked to today figures he went there to get a forged copy. It will be truly amazing if he produces it after his trip to Hawaii.

very interesting, i wonder what he ever did with his birth certificate that he kept all through high school with his other very important documents

[Binky]

you've got yours...I don't have mine... why do we think that Obama has his?


As I said, if it's a legitmate one, then it's easy enough to get. It's not a big deal unless there is some reason why it is being made one.

[Yurt]

Originally Posted by manfrommaine
good cause? How about it was a piece of paper that somebody gave his mother when he was born and she then moved to Indonesia and all over God's green acre and now is dead and no one has a clue where in the world it might be? Isn't that good enough?

AGAIN:

Barack Obama has claimed in writing to have a valid printed document: In the first chapter of his book Dreams From My Father, describing his origins, he wrote about finding a local Hawaiian newspaper article about his Kenyan father: "I discovered this article, folded away among my birth certificate and old vaccination forms, when I was in high school."


:lol:


http://vtipy.netroof.eu/data/images/basketball-pwnd.jpg

[retiredman]

I am CERTAIN that I cannot find my birth certificate and neither can my Mom. I, for one, would not be able to find my high school era vaccination forms if my life depended on it. I cannot believe you think that YOU could. No wait....you're the guy who has saved every snapshop he ever took....never mind :lol:

[Yurt]

i highly doubt mfm claimed in his post that obama has ever claimed his lost it...mfm got pwnd bad in this thread by first saying his mother lost it...then when i presented evidence from obama's own book (that mfm has so proudly bashed me for not reading) that states obama had his birth certificate in a special, special place in high school...mfm ran like a lost dog :laugh2:

does anyone have a link that says obama has lost it? i mean, he kept it in a very special place in high school, along with very important documents about his father etc....and then poof he just lost it