Experts question benefit of school time-out rooms

[LiberalNation]

Three hours seems excssive but this expert is over the top. There has to be a system of punishment for bad behavior if you are going to have any order whatsoever.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081017/ap_on_re_us/time_out_rooms;_ylt=Au5ELIHDA9kuzhNSKILSLBVvzwcF

DES MOINES, Iowa – After failing to finish a reading assignment, 8-year-old Isabel Loeffler was sent to the school's time-out room — a converted storage area under a staircase — where she was left alone for three hours. The autistic Iowa girl wet herself before she was finally allowed to leave. Appalled, her parents removed her from the school district and filed a lawsuit.

Some educators say time-out rooms are being used with increased frequency to discipline children with behavioral disorders. And the time outs are probably doing more harm than good, they add.

"It really is a form of abuse," said Ken Merrell, head of the Department for Special Education and Clinical Sciences at the University of Oregon. "It's going to do nothing to change the behavior. You're using it as an isolation booth."

Segregating children removes them from the positive aspect of the classroom and highlights that they're different from other children, said Stephen Camarata, director of the Kennedy Center for Behavioral Research at Vanderbilt University. And isolating an autistic child might be particularly counterproductive.

"They don't like being around other people so they might increase their negative behavior because they view it a reward," he said.

Though there is no data on the use of time-out rooms, Camarata speculates that they've become widespread as schools confronted a growing enrollment of children with behavior disorders.

"I believe it's because classrooms are much less flexible with more focus on compliance," he said. (Bull, classrooms have alway been unflexible and focused on complience, it's better than what it used to be)

The Disability Rights Education and Defense Fund in Berkeley, Calif., receives calls from parents across the country who complain about time-out rooms, said Cheryl Theis, an education advocate for the organization.

"Parents call and say their child's disability has been exacerbated by this and are traumatized by this," she said.

[Trigg]

At least the school is still allowed to use timeout. A free pre-school a friend works at won't even allow that.

There has to be some sort of punishment for bad behavior at schools or we'll have the inmates running the asylum.

[hjmick]

A quick rap across the knuckles with a wooden ruler.

[Gaffer]

The inmates already run the asylum.

[Yurt]

A quick rap across the knuckles with a wooden ruler.

funny you should say that...

in latter 80's when i was in junior high, our wood shop teacher was old school. our junior high was actually a "middle" school 7-9, so the 9th graders ruled. i wanted to be cool and popular so i pretty much sized up the cool 9th graders and sat next to them knowing by sitting next to them i would be included in their "cool" club....at least for that period :laugh2:

well one day, the coolest 9th grader, brought in a few playboys....well....wood class.....so we looked, giggled...etc...all while the boring woodshop teacher is teaching us about safety, not only in wood shop, but priming us for next semester in metal shop. long story short, he of course noticed us in the back and he blew a fuse....YELLING

all i remember is:

DAMN YOU KIDS THESE DAYS, I CAN'T FUCKING BELIEVE IT. DO YOU HAVE NO RESPECT?

this of course caused the cool 9th grader to laugh and say "chill dude" its only a magazine or something like that....

ONLY A MAGAZINE, THIS IS A SAFETY CLASS, YOUR SAFETY, YOU KNOW, SAFETY...

then he turns around and goes all quiet and tells us how a decade ago we could have been spanked for that, hard, by him and how he would have enjoyed teaching us a lesson, but oh no, can't touch you kids today, so you have no respect.

i thought he was asshole, now, i think he has a point

please someone, tell me i am not getting old

[Yurt]

The inmates already run the asylum.

i've done some prison law and am shocked at the cuddling they get. granted, in some cases the inmate was treated bad, but good lord, our inmates get better treatment and education than probably a good percentage of the world.

[Gaffer]

i've done some prison law and am shocked at the cuddling they get. granted, in some cases the inmate was treated bad, but good lord, our inmates get better treatment and education than probably a good percentage of the world.

Very true. I use to work there. It's even worse now than when I was there.

[hjmick]

please someone, tell me i am not getting old

Can't do it... Welcome to the club.

[crin63]

Its just another consequence of liberalism. Its just libs trying to find a better way than swats because they don't want consequences for peoples actions. I tried all their stupid socially acceptable pathetic ideas for 3 years when my son was young. 2 weeks of swats in the 4th grade and I had an instant star student who ended up graduating high school as valedictorian.

Good old fashion swats work just fine when properly applied.

[Yurt]

Can't do it... Welcome to the club.

what club? such a club cannot surely exist

[CatalystOfChaos]

Its just another consequence of liberalism. Its just libs trying to find a better way than swats because they don't want consequences for peoples actions. I tried all their stupid socially acceptable pathetic ideas for 3 years when my son was young. 2 weeks of swats in the 4th grade and I had an instant star student who ended up graduating high school as valedictorian.

Good old fashion swats work just fine when properly applied.

Well, that was an important part of why I did well in school... but I honestly think it was largely also due to restriction from TV, Computer, Video games.

Not that I think these things are bad, quite the contrary. But if I hadn't read as much for pleasure as I did then, I can only imagine how hard it would be to just sit down with a book and study it when needed.

[Yurt]

Well, that was an important part of why I did well in school... but I honestly think it was largely also due to restriction from TV, Computer, Video games.

Not that I think these things are bad, quite the contrary. But if I hadn't read as much for pleasure as I did then, I can only imagine how hard it would be to just sit down with a book and study it when needed.

you might have a point. a good point. but my point:

i grew up in the "liberal" household. tv, music, michael jackson was extreme and bruce springsteen was out there and i was not allowed to listen to that music. yes, that was "liberal" in the 80's.

i was the last for everything, style, tv, music....and i still blame my parent, who divorced, how dare they, divorce and leave me hanging between the two of them....and i am a victim, how dare they try and play me for favorite treatment.

where is my excuse? where is my father's excuse? my mother's excuse? and so on.....

[bullypulpit]

Three hours seems excssive but this expert is over the top. There has to be a system of punishment for bad behavior if you are going to have any order whatsoever.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081017/ap_on_re_us/time_out_rooms;_ylt=Au5ELIHDA9kuzhNSKILSLBVvzwcF

DES MOINES, Iowa – After failing to finish a reading assignment, 8-year-old Isabel Loeffler was sent to the school's time-out room — a converted storage area under a staircase — where she was left alone for three hours. The autistic Iowa girl wet herself before she was finally allowed to leave. Appalled, her parents removed her from the school district and filed a lawsuit.

Some educators say time-out rooms are being used with increased frequency to discipline children with behavioral disorders. And the time outs are probably doing more harm than good, they add.

"It really is a form of abuse," said Ken Merrell, head of the Department for Special Education and Clinical Sciences at the University of Oregon. "It's going to do nothing to change the behavior. You're using it as an isolation booth."

Segregating children removes them from the positive aspect of the classroom and highlights that they're different from other children, said Stephen Camarata, director of the Kennedy Center for Behavioral Research at Vanderbilt University. And isolating an autistic child might be particularly counterproductive.

"They don't like being around other people so they might increase their negative behavior because they view it a reward," he said.

Though there is no data on the use of time-out rooms, Camarata speculates that they've become widespread as schools confronted a growing enrollment of children with behavior disorders.

"I believe it's because classrooms are much less flexible with more focus on compliance," he said. (Bull, classrooms have alway been unflexible and focused on complience, it's better than what it used to be)

The Disability Rights Education and Defense Fund in Berkeley, Calif., receives calls from parents across the country who complain about time-out rooms, said Cheryl Theis, an education advocate for the organization.

"Parents call and say their child's disability has been exacerbated by this and are traumatized by this," she said.

Hmmm...When I went to school, when I transgressed the rules, I got my ass beaten. Both at school and twice as bad when I got home. As a result, I'm a hard working, tax-paying, law-abiding (except for speed limits) citizen.

"Time-outs" do nothing to reinforce the fact that one's actions have very real, and sometimes painful consequences.