The Sky Is Falling --- Wall Street Meltdown

[mundame]

Major situation with large American banks, plural, failing one after the other this past week and today, and no discussion here about it at all?

Does no one think this is important?

[Kathianne]

Major situation with large American banks, plural, failing one after the other this past week and today, and no discussion here about it at all?

Does no one think this is important?

I've been watching, as of about 10 minutes ago, it was doing better than earlier, still way down.

[stephanie]

Du Underground thinks this is GREAT..

they think it will give the Democrats a better shot at winning the white house..

nothing like your fellow countrymen and women rooting for your downfall...kinda like Mikey Moore rooting for a hurricane..

[darin]

YAY! The democrat-controlled CONGRESS sure is living up to their campaign promises, right? Those about strengthening our Economy, etc?

Now folks may learn just how powerless congress can be. Congress already knows it - but says what it takes to get votes.

[Immanuel]

The sky is falling... dang... it is time to buy.

I'm the administrator of my firms 401k. Everyone keeps asking me if they should get out and how. I simply have been telling them to buckle up and enjoy the ride. I hope that is not the wrong advice.

Worried about it? Sure a little bit. But now is not the time to react by bailing out. Its too late.

Immie

[mundame]

I've been watching, as of about 10 minutes ago, it was doing better than earlier, still way down.


Yes, no real ....crash, god forbid. The Dow is down -242 as I type, but it often is lately, so I guess the weekend maneuvers have somewhat reassured the market, as they were intended to --- get Lehman Bros. out of the way and sell Merrill Lynch off fast. Now AIG has the attention, but at least we see Treasurey doesn't mean to bail out any more banks with taxpayers money, at least not in the near future.

Merrill Lynch: "Bullish on America."


America: Bearish on Merrill Lynch.

[mundame]

The sky is falling... dang... it is time to buy.

I'm the administrator of my firms 401k. Everyone keeps asking me if they should get out and how. I simply have been telling them to buckle up and enjoy the ride. I hope that is not the wrong advice.

Worried about it? Sure a little bit. But now is not the time to react by bailing out. Its too late.

Immie


Yes, I entirely agree. I'm holding and waiting for an upturn, and it may well take till the turn of the year, anyway. September is often bad, and we still have to get through [shudder] October. And then of course, election month, November. But I agree with you, Immie, hold 'em.

[Kathianne]

Yes, no real ....crash, god forbid. The Dow is down -242 as I type, but it often is lately, so I guess the weekend maneuvers have somewhat reassured the market, as they were intended to --- get Lehman Bros. out of the way and sell Merrill Lynch off fast. Now AIG has the attention, but at least we see Treasurey doesn't mean to bail out any more banks with taxpayers money, at least not in the near future.

Merrill Lynch: "Bullish on America."


America: Bearish on Merrill Lynch.

up from the -288 I last saw, which was up from the -300+ earlier. Thanks for proving my point.

[Immanuel]

Yes, I entirely agree. I'm holding and waiting for an upturn, and it may well take till the turn of the year, anyway. September is often bad, and we still have to get through [shudder] October. And then of course, election month, November. But I agree with you, Immie, hold 'em.

If Obama wins in November... I'm jumping ship! Sell... Sell... Sell... will be my mantra because the market will not recover for at least four years. :laugh2:

Immie

[mundame]

up from the -288 I last saw, which was up from the -300+ earlier. Thanks for proving my point.


Well, the weekend warriors from Treasury have two or three times now got things calmed down for MONDAY, and then they collapse later in the week. But at least it's a good sign they haven't gone down worse than this today.

I guess I do think we're in trouble now. How can quite so many large American banks fail and it have no real effect, you know? I was a bull till this weekend, but now I'm pessimistic.

[mundame]

If Obama wins in November... I'm jumping ship! Sell... Sell... Sell... will be my mantra because the market will not recover for at least four years. :laugh2:

Immie


This point of view is why I am worried about November; I don't think this current meltdown will be over till the New Year, if then.

Though conversely, if McCain wins, the market may regain some calm.

[Immanuel]

This point of view is why I am worried about November; I don't think this current meltdown will be over till the New Year, if then.

Though conversely, if McCain wins, the market may regain some calm.

I was only kidding. I'm sure if Obama wins there will be some very good buying opportunities, but truthfully, I don't play the market beyond mutual funds, 401k, IRAs etc.

The stock market is an interesting world to follow, but when you get down to it, it is little more than a gambling addiction and I have a family to support.

Immie

[mundame]

The stock market is an interesting world to follow, but when you get down to it, it is little more than a gambling addiction and I have a family to support.

Immie


Oh, migod, you are so, so right.

Only speculate with play money!! they say. But..........it was still, you know, money.............................

I definitely wish Wall Street well. http://macg.net/emoticons/fear1.gif

[avatar4321]

I havent been saying anything because while i happen to know tons about economics, financing markets are not my thing. So I decided not to talk alot about stuff i dont know details on.

[Immanuel]

Oh, migod, you are so, so right.

Only speculate with play money!! they say. But..........it was still, you know, money.............................

I definitely wish Wall Street well. http://macg.net/emoticons/fear1.gif

If I had money to play with, I'd be playing the market. I don't have the extra money so I don't play.

People can make money on the market, but it takes knowledge and money, but unfortunately, they can lose their butts as well. I'm not willing to take the risk, at least not right now, so I stay out of it for the most part.

Immie

[manu1959]

ah....the free market and capitalism at its best.....buy wells fargo and b of a......

[midcan5]

Why does this surprise anyone I wonder? Liberals and others have said this for years now. Free market greed is how we got into the great depression and regulation helped us out and kept us out till Reagan started the destruction of America and the lemmings on the right followed right over the cliff.

"Ever since Ronald Reagan declared in his first inaugural address that "in the present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem, government is the problem," conservatives have been steadily privatizing government functions on the theory that free markets can do everything better. Education, medicine, criminal justice, social services, building and maintaining roads and bridges, supporting an army at war--you name it, it has all been contracted out to allegedly more efficient and innovative private enterprise."

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/12-0

This is the Bush-McCain economy. Senator McCain may have forgotten, but President Bush already tried his economic policies and the results are not good. We have just been through a business cycle in which the wage of the typical worker and the typical working family fell. This is the first time that has ever happened."

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/09-3

[PostmodernProphet]

Okay...I don't own any stock in Lehman Brothers....I had no accounts with Lehman Brothers.....do I care?.....

[Silver]

I haven't seen the Democratic pundits smile so much since the last big roadside bomb caused multiple US casualties...all they see are political points....

[Yurt]

I haven't seen the Democratic pundits smile so much since the last big roadside bomb caused multiple US casualties...all they see are political points....

how sad and how true

[Kathianne]

how sad and how true

Hey, the Michael Moore branch was positively giddy on 9/11/01. Many on the left caught up by 9/15. Never underestimate...Only the Palestinians were ahead of them.

[Mr. P]

Why does this surprise anyone I wonder? Liberals and others have said this for years now. Free market greed is how we got into the great depression and regulation helped us out and kept us out till Reagan started the destruction of America and the lemmings on the right followed right over the cliff.

"Ever since Ronald Reagan declared in his first inaugural address that "in the present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem, government is the problem," conservatives have been steadily privatizing government functions on the theory that free markets can do everything better. Education, medicine, criminal justice, social services, building and maintaining roads and bridges, supporting an army at war--you name it, it has all been contracted out to allegedly more efficient and innovative private enterprise."

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/12-0

This is the Bush-McCain economy. Senator McCain may have forgotten, but President Bush already tried his economic policies and the results are not good. We have just been through a business cycle in which the wage of the typical worker and the typical working family fell. This is the first time that has ever happened."

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/09-3

Errrr wrong...The fed increasing the interest rate caused the market collapse and the depression.

[Mr. P]

Why does this surprise anyone I wonder? Liberals and others have said this for years now. Free market greed is how we got into the great depression and regulation helped us out and kept us out till Reagan started the destruction of America and the lemmings on the right followed right over the cliff.

"Ever since Ronald Reagan declared in his first inaugural address that "in the present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem, government is the problem," conservatives have been steadily privatizing government functions on the theory that free markets can do everything better. Education, medicine, criminal justice, social services, building and maintaining roads and bridges, supporting an army at war--you name it, it has all been contracted out to allegedly more efficient and innovative private enterprise."

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/12-0

This is the Bush-McCain economy. Senator McCain may have forgotten, but President Bush already tried his economic policies and the results are not good. We have just been through a business cycle in which the wage of the typical worker and the typical working family fell. This is the first time that has ever happened."

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/09-3

Question..Does UPS or FED-X do a better job than the U.S. Postal service? Who would you ship with? Why has the Postal service tried so hard to keep these companies out of home mail delivery, because they aren't competent, or because they are inefficient?

[Yurt]

Question..Does UPS or FED-X do a better job than the U.S. Postal service? Who would you ship with? Why has the Postal service tried so hard to keep these companies out of home mail delivery, because they aren't competent, or because they are inefficient?

yes

[Kathianne]

Question..Does UPS or FED-X do a better job than the U.S. Postal service? Who would you ship with? Why has the Postal service tried so hard to keep these companies out of home mail delivery, because they aren't competent, or because they are inefficient?

What is the US Postal Service? Didn't they go out of business years ago? If not, they should have.

[Mr. P]

What is the US Postal Service? Didn't they go out of business years ago? If not, they should have.

They are the folks that now charge you .43 cents? to mail a standard letter or bill across town, and if yer lucky it will get there on time without damage.

[Immanuel]

They are the folks that now charge you .43 cents? to mail a standard letter or bill across town, and if yer lucky it will get there on time without damage.

True, but it is great when you don't want a check to get across town before payday!

Immie

[Kathianne]

They are the folks that now charge you .43 cents? to mail a standard letter or bill across town, and if yer lucky it will get there on time without damage.

Gee, I've been ignorant of US Postal Service for a few years. .43? They weren't worth .10 in the best of times, at least during my lifetime. I'm glad they are irrelevant today, now let's not create anything else that goes by the name of US....

[Mr. P]

True, but it is great when you don't want a check to get across town before payday!

Immie

That's true! LOL But then it's late.

I do everything on puter or phone..I can't tell you when I sent my last bill in the mail. I even make deposits online.

[Mr. P]

Gee, I've been ignorant of US Postal Service for a few years. .43? They weren't worth .10 in the best of times, at least during my lifetime. I'm glad they are irrelevant today, now let's not create anything else that goes by the name of US....

OH stop...U.S....ok? :slap:

[Kathianne]

OH stop...U.S....ok? :slap:

I was thinking USMedicalcare.com.

Freak out.

[Mr. P]

I was thinking USMedicalcare.com.

Freak out.

Oh thanks...MORE nightmares tonight! Maybe Pshco will ship me some beer so I'll sleep well, via UPS. :laugh2:

[Kathianne]

Oh thanks...MORE nightmares tonight! Maybe Pshco will ship me some beer so I'll sleep well, via UPS. :laugh2:

I'm sorry, but that is what came to mind. I dropped USPS years ago. They suck and cost way too much for their service.

[fj1200]

Why does this surprise anyone I wonder? Liberals and others have said this for years now. Free market greed is how we got into the great depression and regulation helped us out and kept us out till Reagan started the destruction of America and the lemmings on the right followed right over the cliff.

"Ever since Ronald Reagan declared in his first inaugural address that "in the present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem, government is the problem," conservatives have been steadily privatizing government functions on the theory that free markets can do everything better. Education, medicine, criminal justice, social services, building and maintaining roads and bridges, supporting an army at war--you name it, it has all been contracted out to allegedly more efficient and innovative private enterprise."

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/12-0

This is the Bush-McCain economy. Senator McCain may have forgotten, but President Bush already tried his economic policies and the results are not good. We have just been through a business cycle in which the wage of the typical worker and the typical working family fell. This is the first time that has ever happened."

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/09/09-3

Not to disagree completely with Mr. P about the cause of the GD, you're still wrong.

Government error led to the GD. Whether it was the Fed who had no idea what they were doing or the stupidity of Congress and Hoover at passing the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act, the fault did not lie in the free market.

It is utter folly to blame after Reagan 28 years after he was elected especially in a time where Government Sponsored Entities, such as Fannie and Freddie, are given an overly large, underly regulated, subsidized market that it's the free market that caused the current situation. That is a huge stretch for the cause and effect of Reagan's policies.

Private enterprise is not allegedly more efficient and innovative, it is clearly so.

[midcan5]

I haven't seen the Democratic pundits smile so much since the last big roadside bomb caused multiple US casualties...all they see are political points....

Sorry about your hallucinations, you may want to see a doctor. Good luck.

[midcan5]

Not to disagree completely with Mr. P about the cause of the GD, you're still wrong.

Government error led to the GD. Whether it was the Fed who had no idea what they were doing or the stupidity of Congress and Hoover at passing the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act, the fault did not lie in the free market.

It is utter folly to blame after Reagan 28 years after he was elected especially in a time where Government Sponsored Entities, such as Fannie and Freddie, are given an overly large, underly regulated, subsidized market that it's the free market that caused the current situation. That is a huge stretch for the cause and effect of Reagan's policies.

Private enterprise is not allegedly more efficient and innovative, it is clearly so.

History says different and no one blames the government for the GD. They may not have done the right things after it started but they didn't cause it. Notice since FDR, in spite of of some poor economic decisions, we have not had another time like that. Why: Government regulation, heavy taxation and a spreading of wealth to all people. That started to change with Reagan and republican rule and you see what happens when greed is the motivator. Surely you don't need a list of failures today, nor to be told what is happening to the working man in this nation. Notice too Europe, so called socialism, is not in the state we are in today.

http://gusmorino.com/pag3/greatdepression/

"This speculation and the resulting stock market crashes acted as a trigger to the already unstable U.S. economy. Due to the maldistribution of wealth, the economy of the 1920's was one very much dependent upon confidence. The market crashes undermined this confidence. The rich stopped spending on luxury items, and slowed investments. The middle-class and poor stopped buying things with installment credit for fear of loosing their jobs, and not being able to pay the interest. As a result industrial production fell by more than 9% between the market crashes in October and December 192948. As a result jobs were lost, and soon people starting defaulting on their interest payment. Radios and cars bought with installment credit had to be returned. All of the sudden warehouses were piling up with inventory. The thriving industries that had been connected with the automobile and radio industries started falling apart. Without a car people did not need fuel or tires; without a radio people had less need for electricity. On the international scene, the rich had practically stopped lending money to foreign countries. With such tremendous profits to be made in the stock market nobody wanted to make low interest loans. To protect the nation's businesses the U.S. imposed higher trade barriers (Hawley-Smoot Tariff of 1930). Foreigners stopped buying American products. More jobs were lost, more stores were closed, more banks went under, and more factories closed. Unemployment grew to five million in 1930, and up to thirteen million in 193249. The country spiraled quickly into catastrophe. The Great Depression had begun."

[manu1959]

so lets see.......interest rates are holding......oil is under 100 a barrell.....stock market is correcting.....the capitalist market is eating the weak......

yep....melt down .... sell everything and buy gold ....oh wait that is falling too....

[red states rule]

so lets see.......interest rates are holding......oil is under 100 a barrell.....stock market is correcting.....the capitalist market is eating the weak......

yep....melt down .... sell everything and buy gold ....oh wait that is falling too....

and Dems were running Feddie Mac - Obama was #3 when it came to getting cash from both Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac

Somehow I do not think the liberal media will talk much about this



Campaign contributions bought influence as well, including donations to the presidential candidates.

snip

Sen. Barack Obama is the No. 3 recipient of Fannie and Freddie campaign dollars, having collected $123,000 from the companies since he first ran for the Senate in 2004, according to the Federal Election Commission and the Center for Responsive Politics.

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/08/news/companies/fan_fred_buying/index.htm?postversion=2008090908

[trobinett]

and Dems were running Feddie Mac - Obama was #3 when it came to getting cash from both Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac

Somehow I do not think the liberal media will talk much about this



Campaign contributions bought influence as well, including donations to the presidential candidates.

snip

Sen. Barack Obama is the No. 3 recipient of Fannie and Freddie campaign dollars, having collected $123,000 from the companies since he first ran for the Senate in 2004, according to the Federal Election Commission and the Center for Responsive Politics.

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/08/news/companies/fan_fred_buying/index.htm?postversion=2008090908

UnFUCKING believable, but NOT surprising.

Great post RSR! :clap:

[red states rule]

UnFUCKING believable, but NOT surprising.

Great post RSR! :clap:

Thank you

Here is more linking Dems


The Real Culprits In This Meltdown
By INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY | Posted Monday, September 15, 2008 4:20 PM PT

Big Government: Barack Obama and Democrats blame the historic financial turmoil on the market. But if it's dysfunctional, Democrats during the Clinton years are a prime reason for it.



Obama in a statement yesterday blamed the shocking new round of subprime-related bankruptcies on the free-market system, and specifically the "trickle-down" economics of the Bush administration, which he tried to gig opponent John McCain for wanting to extend.

But it was the Clinton administration, obsessed with multiculturalism, that dictated where mortgage lenders could lend, and originally helped create the market for the high-risk subprime loans now infecting like a retrovirus the balance sheets of many of Wall Street's most revered institutions.

Tough new regulations forced lenders into high-risk areas where they had no choice but to lower lending standards to make the loans that sound business practices had previously guarded against making. It was either that or face stiff government penalties.

The untold story in this whole national crisis is that President Clinton put on steroids the Community Redevelopment Act, a well-intended Carter-era law designed to encourage minority homeownership. And in so doing, he helped create the market for the risky subprime loans that he and Democrats now decry as not only greedy but "predatory."

Yes, the market was fueled by greed and overleveraging in the secondary market for subprimes, vis-a-vis mortgaged-backed securities traded on Wall Street. But the seed was planted in the '90s by Clinton and his social engineers. They were the political catalyst behind this slow-motion financial train wreck.

And it was the Clinton administration that mismanaged the quasi-governmental agencies that over the decades have come to manage the real estate market in America.

As soon as Clinton crony Franklin Delano Raines took the helm in 1999 at Fannie Mae, for example, he used it as his personal piggy bank, looting it for a total of almost $100 million in compensation by the time he left in early 2005 under an ethical cloud.

Other Clinton cronies, including Janet Reno aide Jamie Gorelick, padded their pockets to the tune of another $75 million.

Raines was accused of overstating earnings and shifting losses so he and other senior executives could earn big bonuses.

In the end, Fannie had to pay a record $400 million civil fine for SEC and other violations, while also agreeing as part of a settlement to make changes in its accounting procedures and ways of managing risk.

But it was too little, too late. Raines had reportedly steered Fannie Mae business to subprime giant Countrywide Financial, which was saved from bankruptcy by Bank of America.

At the same time, the Clinton administration was pushing Fannie and her brother Freddie Mac to buy more mortgages from low-income households.

The Clinton-era corruption, combined with unprecedented catering to affordable-housing lobbyists, resulted in today's nationalization of both Fannie and Freddie, a move that is expected to cost taxpayers tens of billions of dollars.

And the worst is far from over. By the time it is, we'll all be paying for Clinton's social experiment, one that Obama hopes to trump with a whole new round of meddling in the housing and jobs markets. In fact, the social experiment Obama has planned could dwarf both the Great Society and New Deal in size and scope.

for the complete article

http://ibdeditorial.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=306370789279709

[fj1200]

History says different and no one blames the government for the GD. They may not have done the right things after it started but they didn't cause it. Notice since FDR, in spite of of some poor economic decisions, we have not had another time like that. Why: Government regulation, heavy taxation and a spreading of wealth to all people. That started to change with Reagan and republican rule and you see what happens when greed is the motivator. Surely you don't need a list of failures today, nor to be told what is happening to the working man in this nation. Notice too Europe, so called socialism, is not in the state we are in today.

http://gusmorino.com/pag3/greatdepression/

"This speculation and the resulting stock market crashes acted as a trigger to the already unstable U.S. economy. Due to the maldistribution of wealth, the economy of the 1920's was one very much dependent upon confidence. The market crashes undermined this confidence. The rich stopped spending on luxury items, and slowed investments. The middle-class and poor stopped buying things with installment credit for fear of loosing their jobs, and not being able to pay the interest. As a result industrial production fell by more than 9% between the market crashes in October and December 192948. As a result jobs were lost, and soon people starting defaulting on their interest payment. Radios and cars bought with installment credit had to be returned. All of the sudden warehouses were piling up with inventory. The thriving industries that had been connected with the automobile and radio industries started falling apart. Without a car people did not need fuel or tires; without a radio people had less need for electricity. On the international scene, the rich had practically stopped lending money to foreign countries. With such tremendous profits to be made in the stock market nobody wanted to make low interest loans. To protect the nation's businesses the U.S. imposed higher trade barriers (Hawley-Smoot Tariff of 1930). Foreigners stopped buying American products. More jobs were lost, more stores were closed, more banks went under, and more factories closed. Unemployment grew to five million in 1930, and up to thirteen million in 193249. The country spiraled quickly into catastrophe. The Great Depression had begun."

That book report is your proof? I read McElvaine's book and he barely tried to support his hypothesis. McElvaine even acknowledged that the New Deal was a failure (I can't find the quote from another forum I posted it in). Meltzer in his book, the History of the Federal Reserve, analyzed the stock market run up and found that most of the adjustment in valuations occurred in '26 and '27, the markets held their elevated levels until 1929. He of course argues, along with Friedman and Schwartz, that the GD was a monetary phenomenon. I'm not completely convinced that that is the whole story as he barely references the SH Tariff Act and the abyssmal fiscal policies of the Hoover and subsequent FDR administrations. A deeper look at the recession (depression within the depression) of '37-'38 shows that after 4 years of New Deal futility the US economy was crushed and a new bear market ensued.

You certainly have a simplistic view of the economy, because we are now bearing the fruits of misguided government regulation. The stability of the post WWII was mainly due to Bretton Woods and the utter destruction of the rest of the worlds economy. All of that started to fall apart in the mid 60's as the Fed was creating more dollars than the world wanted leading to the loss of our gold reserves; Until Nixon closed the window and broke the link that gave some semblance of monetary stability. See hyper inflation of the 70's.

One thing to realize is even though SH was passed and instituted in 1930, the major opposition to it collapsed in October 1929. Other countries, Canada one of the first, retaliated before it was even signed by Hoover.

[red states rule]

On Tv this morning, libs and the talking heads are wondering if Pres Bush will make a stetment today about the "economic meltdown"

Pres Bush should make a statement. What he should say is the people who bought homes they could not afford are idiots

It would be an honest and refreshing comment

[Immanuel]

On Tv this morning, libs and the talking heads are wondering if Pres Bush will make a stetment today about the "economic meltdown"

Pres Bush should make a statement. What he should say is the people who bought homes they could not afford are idiots

It would be an honest and refreshing comment

Except it is not always the people who bought the homes that are really at fault. The mortgage brokers acted like used car salesmen and sold them on something they really should not have bought. They convinced them that the home was perfect for them and that nothing would go wrong. "Adjustable Rate Mortgages are the best thing since sliced bread. Just look at how low your rate is and it will never, ever go up."

Surprise! Rates went up. And they go up a hell of a lot faster than they come down. Maybe they could afford the mortgage at the lower rates, but interest rates were bound to head up eventually and the payments went up much higher than anticipated while incomes didn't compensate.

And no, I did not buy my home with an ARM. Thank God! They tried that with me. I told them it would be a deal breaker and I would have walked away from the purchase if it was the only way.

Immie

[Classact]

Major situation with large American banks, plural, failing one after the other this past week and today, and no discussion here about it at all?

Does no one think this is important?Thanks to Barney Frank backing these lending practices http://www.faireconomy.org/issues/racial_wealth_divide/archives

[red states rule]

Except it is not always the people who bought the homes that are really at fault. The mortgage brokers acted like used car salesmen and sold them on something they really should not have bought. They convinced them that the home was perfect for them and that nothing would go wrong. "Adjustable Rate Mortgages are the best thing since sliced bread. Just look at how low your rate is and it will never, ever go up."

Surprise! Rates went up. And they go up a hell of a lot faster than they come down. Maybe they could afford the mortgage at the lower rates, but interest rates were bound to head up eventually and the payments went up much higher than anticipated while incomes didn't compensate.

And no, I did not buy my home with an ARM. Thank God! They tried that with me. I told them it would be a deal breaker and I would have walked away from the purchase if it was the only way.

Immie


Yes, the banks and brokers are to blame as well. But I doubt if anyone held a gun to anyone's head and forced them to buy the house

The market will correct itself - there is no need to spend taxpayer money to bail ANYONE out

I have seen where Dems are up to their necks in this mess, yet they plead innocence and blame Republicans

What a shocker

[red states rule]

Thanks to Barney Frank backing these lending practices http://www.faireconomy.org/issues/racial_wealth_divide/archives

Dems are showing their lack of leadership skills with this. Frank, Pelosi, and Obama are playing the blame game and pointing fingers while ignoring they are a huge part of the problem

They led the charge to change the rules of og home ownership. They demanded banks "loosen" their standards

Hell, Obama's economic advisor drove Fannie Mae into the ground

[Classact]

Dems are showing their lack of leadership skills with this. Frank, Pelosi, and Obama are playing the blame game and pointing fingers while ignoring they are a huge part of the problem

They led the charge to change the rules of og home ownership. They demanded banks "loosen" their standards

Hell, Obama's economic advisor drove Fannie Mae into the groundThere's enough blame to go around but a lot of this mess started with the reform in the Clinton administration ... in 1999 if memory serves and Barney Frank was the driving force for the double standard for PC people of color.

[red states rule]

There's enough blame to go around but a lot of this mess started with the reform in the Clinton administration ... in 1999 if memory serves and Barney Frank was the driving force for the double standard for PC people of color.


You got it

Dems like Frank said if the h/o defaults on the loan the property would be owned by the government

[Immanuel]

Yes, the banks and brokers are to blame as well. But I doubt if anyone held a gun to anyone's head and forced them to buy the house

The market will correct itself - there is no need to spend taxpayer money to bail ANYONE out

I have seen where Dems are up to their necks in this mess, yet they plead innocence and blame Republicans

What a shocker

Yes, the market will correct itself, but how many people will suffer before it does? As for bailouts, I'm not calling for any. Even for people who end up losing their homes... life will go on. As for the banks and their investors? Well, there is always a risk in investing and business. Anyone who loses their shirts over this was a fool as an investor anyway. What is that they say about not putting all your eggs in one basket?

Immie

[red states rule]

Yes, the market will correct itself, but how many people will suffer before it does? As for bailouts, I'm not calling for any. Even for people who end up losing their homes... life will go on. As for the banks and their investors? Well, there is always a risk in investing and business. Anyone who loses their shirts over this was a fool as an investor anyway. What is that they say about not putting all your eggs in one basket?

Immie

Who will suffer? You answered your own question Immie

Life goes on. Capitalism is the best system in the world, and the government is going to make matters worse by interfering

The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'" Ronald Reagan

[Immanuel]

Who will suffer? You answered your own question Immie

Life goes on. Capitalism is the best system in the world, and the government is going to make matters worse by interfering

The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'" Ronald Reagan

Actually, there are a lot of people that are going to suffer. People who lose their homes are going to suffer. It has to be a traumatic experience and their credit ratings will make it difficult to recover in the near future.

Yes, Capitalism is by far the best system in the world, but when a family is going through foreclosure, I doubt that really matters to them.

Immie

[red states rule]

Actually, there are a lot of people that are going to suffer. People who lose their homes are going to suffer. It has to be a traumatic experience and their credit ratings will make it difficult to recover in the near future.

Yes, Capitalism is by far the best system in the world, but when a family is going through foreclosure, I doubt that really matters to them.

Immie

They bought a house they could not afford. It is their own fault they are in the mess they are in

Don't worry Immie. Politicans from both sides will be there to bail them out with OUR money

BTW, I work for in the mortgage indusrty. Only abouit 1.5% to 2% of the homes are in foreclosure

[Immanuel]

BTW, I work for in the mortgage indusrty. Only abouit 1.5% to 2% of the homes are in foreclosure

So... this is all your fault!!!!!

;)

Immie

[red states rule]

So... this is all your fault!!!!!

;)

Immie

You are so right Immie

I tell h/o's if you feel nobody thinks about you - miss a payment :laugh2:

[Immanuel]

You are so right Immie

I tell h/o's if you feel nobody thinks about you - miss a payment :laugh2:

:lol: I'd rather not. Once you get behind, it's real difficult to catch up.

It is tough for me to blame the industry as well. I'm sure there were some shady dealers out there who over sold h/o's, but most were doing the best they could for their customers. The fact that the economy has hit a downturn is not their faults. Yes... they should have known it was inevitable, but, they can not read the future and know who will end up being hurt by the downturn.

As you said only about 2% of mortgages are currently in foreclosure. The bank failures and the market downturn are not solely based upon the foreclosure. There are a lot of issues involved in this including competition.

Immie

[red states rule]

:lol: I'd rather not. Once you get behind, it's real difficult to catch up.

It is tough for me to blame the industry as well. I'm sure there were some shady dealers out there who over sold h/o's, but most were doing the best they could for their customers. The fact that the economy has hit a downturn is not their faults. Yes... they should have known it was inevitable, but, they can not read the future and know who will end up being hurt by the downturn.

As you said only about 2% of mortgages are currently in foreclosure. The bank failures and the market downturn are not solely based upon the foreclosure. There are a lot of issues involved in this including competition.

Immie


Immie, the last thing my company wants to do is go to foreclosure. the only ones who make money is the lawyers

If you have a problem, my company will work with you

Libs are saying this is like the great depression. Well the foreclosure rate back then was around 50% - we are around 2% right now

[Immanuel]

Immie, the last thing my company wants to do is go to foreclosure. the only ones who make money is the lawyers

If you have a problem, my company will work with you

Libs are saying this is like the great depression. Well the foreclosure rate back then was around 50% - we are around 2% right now

Do you have something against lawyers making money? :poke:

Of course the libs are saying it is like the Great Depression. After all, we are in an election year, the economy has taken a hit recently and their candidate is losing popularity by the minute. What would you expect them to say?

As for your company working with h/o's, I'm not part of the industry, but I know that mortgage companies go well beyond the legal requirements to keep from having to foreclose on a mortgage. They will let delinquient h/o's stay in a home without payment for many months and I have even heard of some who have not paid a mortgage bill for a year before being foreclosed. Foreclosure costs the mortgage holder a lot of money of which often, especially in a down housing market, the mortgage holder does not recover.

If they think you will pay eventually, they will do what they can to keep you there.

Immie

[red states rule]

Do you have something against lawyers making money? :poke:

Of course the libs are saying it is like the Great Depression. After all, we are in an election year, the economy has taken a hit recently and their candidate is losing popularity by the minute. What would you expect them to say?

As for your company working with h/o's, I'm not part of the industry, but I know that mortgage companies go well beyond the legal requirements to keep from having to foreclose on a mortgage. They will let delinquient h/o's stay in a home without payment for many months and I have even heard of some who have not paid a mortgage bill for a year before being foreclosed. Foreclosure costs the mortgage holder a lot of money of which often, especially in a down housing market, the mortgage holder does not recover.

If they think you will pay eventually, they will do what they can to keep you there.

Immie

I have seen folks as far back as 6 months. Yes my company will work with them

To libs everything is a crisis and ONLY more money and regulations for the Federal government will manke things right