Questions on heaven.

[Noir]

Good day Dp users, just starting a thread to ask the christains on the site about a key part of their faith; heaven.

How do you view it?
I find it impossible to imagin how one could exist in heaven, with our own personality (could also be called soul) and yet be in a sinless enviroment, and even if this were possible would it be disirable?

So what do you guys think of your great reward, will you still be you in heaven? Will you know of others who are there? Will you know of the life you lived on earth? (I realize that anything said will ofcouse be basicly guessing, but I think it is important to discus this as it is in essence the main mission of a christain)

[April15]

Heaven is a concept of the human mind. Used to engage slaves into sub servence for fear of not having a chance to have peace on earth.

[5stringJeff]

Good day Dp users, just starting a thread to ask the christains on the site about a key part of their faith; heaven.

How do you view it?
I find it impossible to imagin how one could exist in heaven, with our own personality (could also be called soul) and yet be in a sinless enviroment, and even if this were possible would it be disirable?

So what do you guys think of your great reward, will you still be you in heaven? Will you know of others who are there? Will you know of the life you lived on earth? (I realize that anything said will ofcouse be basicly guessing, but I think it is important to discus this as it is in essence the main mission of a christain)

My understanding, from a born-again/evangelical Christian standpoint, is that believers in Jesus Christ will be in heaven, with memories of their life on earth, but without the desire to sin. God will remove that desire from us, so that our only desire will be to do what pleases God. I would think that is much more desirable than our current situation, in which we are constantly struggling between pleasing God and pleasing ourselves.

[crin63]

I see heaven as a side benefit to sins forgiven, peace with God and serving my savior Jesus Christ. Heaven actually does not and did not factor into my decision making or reasons that I became a Christian.

Don't get me wrong I'll be very happy to call heaven my home.

[Psychoblues]

Heaven, like love, is where you find it, noir. IMHO. nothing mystical at all about it!!!!!!!!!!

Speaking of Heaven:

:salute::cheers2::clap::laugh2::cheers2::salute:

[Noir]

My understanding, from a born-again/evangelical Christian standpoint, is that believers in Jesus Christ will be in heaven, with memories of their life on earth, but without the desire to sin. God will remove that desire from us, so that our only desire will be to do what pleases God. I would think that is much more desirable than our current situation, in which we are constantly struggling between pleasing God and pleasing ourselves.

This is the most common type of answer I get when I ask this question, I.e you will have memories but no desire to sin. But, if you can remember your past life then surly you will know of sin, for example, if in a few years I were to be born again and went to heaven, would u not miss those I had left behind on earth, esspecaily if I knew they were nor followers of Christ and so if they didn't change there ways they would spend enernity in hell?
And could this sadness not easily turn to anger not hate, ergo sin? You answer seems to suggest emotion control, were you will only feel what god wants you to feel.

And yet this seems quite ironic that god would have to control your emotions to remove sin, seemingly removing the freedom of thought from those who folowed him.

[Nukeman]

This is the most common type of answer I get when I ask this question, I.e you will have memories but no desire to sin. But, if you can remember your past life then surly you will know of sin, for example, if in a few years I were to be born again and went to heaven, would u not miss those I had left behind on earth, esspecaily if I knew they were nor followers of Christ and so if they didn't change there ways they would spend enernity in hell?
And could this sadness not easily turn to anger not hate, ergo sin? You answer seems to suggest emotion control, were you will only feel what god wants you to feel.

And yet this seems quite ironic that god would have to control your emotions to remove sin, seemingly removing the freedom of thought from those who folowed him.Your forgetting one vital concept, "KNOWING IS NOT THE SAME AS WANTING" Just because you know you have sinned does not mean you will want to sin.

[Mr. P]

My understanding, from a born-again/evangelical Christian standpoint, is that believers in Jesus Christ will be in heaven, with memories of their life on earth, but without the desire to sin. God will remove that desire from us, so that our only desire will be to do what pleases God. I would think that is much more desirable than our current situation, in which we are constantly struggling between pleasing God and pleasing ourselves.

Forgive me Jeff, but this sounds like what Jim Jones probably told his followers before they drank the cool-aid.

[Noir]

Your forgetting one vital concept, "KNOWING IS NOT THE SAME AS WANTING" Just because you know you have sinned does not mean you will want to sin.

Very true, but we must also memo 'knowledge is power' and with the knowledge of sin you have the power to commit sin. There I can only assume that you do not have this knowledge in heaven. Which leads to questins over freedom of thought in heaven.

[crin63]

I don't think anyone will have time or the inclination to worry about anyone left behind while they are in heaven.

I think that they will be so overwhelmed by being able to see their Saviors face, God's glory, being in His presence and the whole scene of the angelic host singing praises to God and on and on and on that there will be no realization of anything else for centurys.

[Noir]

I don't think anyone will have time or the inclination to worry about anyone left behind while they are in heaven.

I think that they will be so overwhelmed by being able to see their Saviors face, God's glory, being in His presence and the whole scene of the angelic host singing praises to God and on and on and on that there will be no realization of anything else for centurys.

It would not matter how long it took, if you are there for eternity.

You also bring about the notion of seeing, humans can see de to the eye organ, yet our eyes will stay behind and rot, will we manafest soul organs in heaven? (this is more o of a side point, my main concerns lie withfreedom of thought in heaven)

[crin63]

It would not matter how long it took, if you are there for eternity.

You also bring about the notion of seeing, humans can see de to the eye organ, yet our eyes will stay behind and rot, will we manafest soul organs in heaven? (this is more o of a side point, my main concerns lie withfreedom of thought in heaven)

Those who go to heaven will have glorified human bodies. It will not just be conscious awareness.

Freedom of thought is an interesting question and I have never thought of it in those terms. I think it depends on your view of God and salvation as to how you would answer this question.

Have you ever been somewhere and seen something that was so incredible that you just stood and stared for several minutes trying to take it all in?
No matter what it was it will pale in comparison to the splendor of heaven if you are a Christian, the chance to meet Jesus face to face, to be able to behold him, to bow down and worship at his feet, to see the throne room, to hear the angelic host, to go to the judgment seat of Christ to see if you have any rewards and so much more.
I believe that those in heaven will have freedom of thought but will be so caught up in everything I mentioned and so much more that nothing else will matter to them.

[gabosaurus]

Sing me a song, youre a singer
Do me a wrong, youre a bringer of evil
The devil is never a maker
The less that you give, youre a taker
So its on and on and on, its heaven and hell, oh well

The lover of lifes not a sinner
The ending is just a beginner
The closer you get to the meaning
The sooner youll know that youre dreaming
So its on and on and on, oh its on and on and on
It goes on and on and on, heaven and hell
I can tell, fool, fool!

Well if it seems to be real, its illusion
For every moment of truth, theres confusion in life
Love can be seen as the answer, but nobody bleeds for the dancer
And its on and on, on and on and on....

They say that lifes a carousel
Spinning fast, youve got to ride it well
The world is full of kings and queens
Who blind your eyes and steal your dreams
Its heaven and hell, oh well
And theyll tell you black is really white
The moon is just the sun at night
And when you walk in golden halls
You get to keep the gold that falls
Its heaven and hell, oh no!
Fool, fool!
Youve got to bleed for the dancer!
Fool, fool!
Look for the answer!
Fool, fool, fool!

[Missileman]

My understanding, from a born-again/evangelical Christian standpoint, is that believers in Jesus Christ will be in heaven, with memories of their life on earth, but without the desire to sin. God will remove that desire from us, so that our only desire will be to do what pleases God. I would think that is much more desirable than our current situation, in which we are constantly struggling between pleasing God and pleasing ourselves.

This answer raises a couple questions:

1. Would it not be desireable that everyone wind up in heaven?

2. If God can remove the desire to sin so that one is "qualified" to inhabit heaven, why the need for the "proving ground" of earth? If indeed you have to be altered in that way, what difference does it make what kind of person you are here. Essentially, a serial child molester will wind up in the same state as the most devout nun.

[emmett]

This answer raises a couple questions:

1. Would it not be desireable that everyone wind up in heaven?

2. If God can remove the desire to sin so that one is "qualified" to inhabit heaven, why the need for the "proving ground" of earth? If indeed you have to be altered in that way, what difference does it make what kind of person you are here. Essentially, a serial child molester will wind up in the same state as the most devout nun.

Ah.........not exactly! Not all earthly souls will be able to acheive this "glory" of eternal salvation, the way i understand it. The alternative is damnation. The choice is while you are here.

Let me simplify it. Everyone has been invited to the party. However, you must accept the invitation now or there will be no cakey for you.

[Missileman]

Ah.........not exactly! Not all earthly souls will be able to acheive this "glory" of eternal salvation, the way i understand it. The alternative is damnation. The choice is while you are here.

Let me simplify it. Everyone has been invited to the party. However, you must accept the invitation now or there will be no cakey for you.

I think you misunderstand the question...if God can make a person (soul) with no desire to sin in heaven, why not skip the bullshit and make everyone non-sinning inhabitants of heaven? Does God really want a portion of his creation to wind up in damnation?

And before you start in with the free will arguments, I'll do a pre-emptive strike:

If a person, through free will "qualifies" for heaven, why would that free will need to be stripped once you get there?

[LuvRPgrl]

This answer raises a couple questions:

1. Would it not be desireable that everyone wind up in heaven?

2. If God can remove the desire to sin so that one is "qualified" to inhabit heaven, why the need for the "proving ground" of earth? If indeed you have to be altered in that way, what difference does it make what kind of person you are here. Essentially, a serial child molester will wind up in the same state as the most devout nun.


First off, if I do pass away and wind up in a place called "heaven", I dont really care what any of the answers to any of the questions are. I have FAITH that God has it all worked out.

1.Yes, no ,,,maybe.

2. God may not be able to, or choose to remove the desire to sin from those who refuse the transformation. Otherwise a good question, but the spiritual realm of God and heaven are probably way too advanced and complicated for us to understand even in its simplist form. I personally believe it is like trying to teach someone calculus who can barely learn to add and subtract.

I go with the idea that it dont much matter how it works, just if it works that way. God, yes or no. I personally already have the answer,

Im also of the opinion, in the long run, evil could not continue to exist on its own. Uncontrolled checked/unfettered, it would eventually destroy itself. Evil only wishes to destroy. If you had a room full of 10 evil beings, they would break into groups wanting to destroy the other groups. Once it is down to one group, the individuals would seek to destroy each other until only one is left, and then it would either desire to destroy itself, or it would simply exist alone.

[LuvRPgrl]

I think you misunderstand the question...if God can make a person (soul) with no desire to sin in heaven, why not skip the bullshit and make everyone non-sinning inhabitants of heaven? Does God really want a portion of his creation to wind up in damnation?

And before you start in with the free will arguments, I'll do a pre-emptive strike:

If a person, through free will "qualifies" for heaven, why would that free will need to be stripped once you get there?

Maybe it is the proving grounds for persons (souls) to show their true essence, if they can give in to the will of God, or not. Only those who have chosen to allow it can be transformed.

Or, maybe we all will wind up in Gods presence (heaven?)

If God just skipped the eartly experiment??, then those whom God would have known would never capitulate to His will, would scream they never had the chance to prove themselves.

[emmett]

I'll let LuvRPgrl answer you on this issue, she is doing a much better job than I.

[LuvRPgrl]

I'll let LuvRPgrl answer you on this issue, she is doing a much better job than I.


Thanks on that Emmet.

Common mistake, LuvRPgrl is a guy married to a "rp" girl. RP = Republic of the Philippines.

Another thing, if the BIble is true, then God doesnt want us to know much about heaven anyways, except that it it desirable, thats why there is not too much info on it.

If the Bible isnt true, then the answer to the question is irrelevant.

It is something nice to talk about, banter ideas, but I do know a couple of those questioning are really looking for ways to disgrace God/Christianity/Christians

[-Cp]

My understanding, from a born-again/evangelical Christian standpoint, is that believers in Jesus Christ will be in heaven, with memories of their life on earth, but without the desire to sin. God will remove that desire from us, so that our only desire will be to do what pleases God. I would think that is much more desirable than our current situation, in which we are constantly struggling between pleasing God and pleasing ourselves.

Christ said "The Kingdom of Heaven is within you"............

[crin63]

Christ said "The Kingdom of Heaven is within you"............

I missed that scripture. Do you have the address?

[Monkeybone]

actually if you look at it, "Heaven" itself isn't the main goal, it's a nice rest-stop though. the main thing that is really coming is the new, perfect Earth that will come about with the coming back of Jesus and everything. the New Jerusalem and all that. the whole, Heaven will be on Earth.

[Noir]

Thanks on that Emmet.

Common mistake, LuvRPgrl is a guy married to a "rp" girl. RP = Republic of the Philippines.


Woops, i though he was a girl who loved Role Play...well...hm...



It is something nice to talk about, banter ideas, but I do know a couple of those questioning are really looking for ways to disgrace God/Christianity/Christians

I think the topic has been debated without any flaming ect, i guess the main reason for that is no one really knows and its not a question that is asked often.

[5stringJeff]

This is the most common type of answer I get when I ask this question, I.e you will have memories but no desire to sin. But, if you can remember your past life then surly you will know of sin, for example, if in a few years I were to be born again and went to heaven, would u not miss those I had left behind on earth, esspecaily if I knew they were nor followers of Christ and so if they didn't change there ways they would spend enernity in hell?
And could this sadness not easily turn to anger not hate, ergo sin? You answer seems to suggest emotion control, were you will only feel what god wants you to feel.

And yet this seems quite ironic that god would have to control your emotions to remove sin, seemingly removing the freedom of thought from those who folowed him.

I hope this helps a bit:

1. If I remember my past life, I will "know of sin." Yes, I will. However, the Christian is called to view sin as God sees it: as an absolute affront to the Eternal God. As a Christian, in this life, I am tempted both from within (i.e. my own nature, that wants to sin) and from without (i.e. other people who tempt me to sin); in heaven, there will be neither the desire to sin nor the temptation of others.

2. Control and freedom of thought. As a Christian, I want God to remove the part of my nature that leads me to sin. He does not remove it from us while we are on earth; when we get to heaven, though, it will be removed. So in that sense, it's not removing freedom of thought or free will; I want to lose that part of me.

[5stringJeff]

Forgive me Jeff, but this sounds like what Jim Jones probably told his followers before they drank the cool-aid.

That may be true. However, God does not tell us to commit ritualized suicide. In fact, the Bible teaches the opposite, that as Christians, we can have an abundance of life.

[5stringJeff]

This answer raises a couple questions:

1. Would it not be desireable that everyone wind up in heaven?

2. If God can remove the desire to sin so that one is "qualified" to inhabit heaven, why the need for the "proving ground" of earth? If indeed you have to be altered in that way, what difference does it make what kind of person you are here. Essentially, a serial child molester will wind up in the same state as the most devout nun.


I think you misunderstand the question...if God can make a person (soul) with no desire to sin in heaven, why not skip the bullshit and make everyone non-sinning inhabitants of heaven? Does God really want a portion of his creation to wind up in damnation?

And before you start in with the free will arguments, I'll do a pre-emptive strike:

If a person, through free will "qualifies" for heaven, why would that free will need to be stripped once you get there?

It would be desirable that everyone ends up in heaven. In fact, the Bible states that God does want everyone to repent so that they will wind up in heaven. But as it is, God has given us this life in order to believe in and accept Him. It's not a "proving ground;" we cannot earn our way into heaven. Christians are called to tell others about Christ, just as others tld us about Him. That's God's plan for spreading the news about salvation: person to person.

As far as the child molester and the nun, if a child molester repented of his evil and chose to accept Christ, he would, indeed, be in heaven right next to a nun. But the nun has also sinned - maybe not by molesting children, but she has sinned nonetheless, and is guilty just like the child molester is guilty.

And you already talked about free will. But to answer your last question, I will tell you what I told Noir. As a Christian, I want to lose that part of me that leads me to sin. It's kind of like wisdom teeth. They're naturally a part of the body, but they cause a lot of pain, so we go to the dentist to get them removed. Likewise, the sinful nature that we all have is a part of us, that causes a lot of pain and suffering, and so we desire for god to remove it from us.

[AllieBaba]

This is the most common type of answer I get when I ask this question, I.e you will have memories but no desire to sin. But, if you can remember your past life then surly you will know of sin, for example, if in a few years I were to be born again and went to heaven, would u not miss those I had left behind on earth, esspecaily if I knew they were nor followers of Christ and so if they didn't change there ways they would spend enernity in hell?
And could this sadness not easily turn to anger not hate, ergo sin? You answer seems to suggest emotion control, were you will only feel what god wants you to feel.

And yet this seems quite ironic that god would have to control your emotions to remove sin, seemingly removing the freedom of thought from those who folowed him.


Only God knows.
Only those who have faith in and love Christ will be in Heaven. And once in heaven, all desire to sin will be removed... we will have all we need or desire, no pain, no sadness, no anger. So where is the motivation for sin?

And we'll be in the presence of God everyday. I don't believe a human can be in the presence of God and sin.

[5stringJeff]

Christ said "The Kingdom of Heaven is within you"............


I missed that scripture. Do you have the address?

Apparently, Christ mentioned heaven 119 times (http://www.studylight.org/desk/?l=en&query=heaven&section=8&translation=nas&oq=) in the Gospels, but I couldn't find that either. I did find this one, though:

"Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand."

[-Cp]

Apparently, Christ mentioned heaven 119 times (http://www.studylight.org/desk/?l=en&query=heaven&section=8&translation=nas&oq=) in the Gospels, but I couldn't find that either. I did find this one, though:

"Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand."

Sorry, he said "Kingdom of God"...

"The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor will they say, ‘See here!’ or ‘See there!’ For indeed, the kingdom of God is within [or among] you." Luke 17:20-21

[No1tovote4]

Sorry, he said "Kingdom of God"...

"The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor will they say, ‘See here!’ or ‘See there!’ For indeed, the kingdom of God is within [or among] you." Luke 17:20-21
The word "heavens" in the Bible speaks only of the sky, not of a place. It is "paradise". It is only modern English that maintains the word "heaven" in place of paradise.