Bill Would End Ban On Photos Of Returning Military Dead

[Psychoblues]

Introduced and sponsored by a Republican, no less. Although a somber subject, this issue is one that more Americans need to become personally attached. War is hell and Americans need to understand that. Some act as if it were somehow somebody else's problem if not frivolous from it's outset.

Source: PDNOnline

The Department of Defense would be required to grant journalists access to ceremonies honoring fallen military personnel under a bill introduced in the U.S. House of Representatives.

The legislation is significant because it would, for the first time since Vietnam, let photojournalists capture the powerful images of flag-draped caskets arriving on American soil during wartime.

This week the bill won the endorsement of the National Press Photographers Association.

The Fallen Hero Commemoration Act, or H.R. 6662, was introduced July 30 by Rep. Walter B. Jones (R-N.C.), a member of the House Committee on Armed Services.

The bill states: "The Secretary of Defense shall grant access to accredited members of the media at military commemoration ceremonies and memorial services conducted by the Armed Forces for members of the Armed Forces who have died on active duty and when the remains of members of the Armed Forces arrive at military installations in the United States." It was referred to the Committee on Armed Services............

More: http://www.pdnonline.com/pdn/newswire/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003839279

The celebration is not appropriate in this post.

:salute:

[Sitarro]

Introduced and sponsored by a Republican, no less. Although a somber subject, this issue is one that more Americans need to become personally attached. War is hell and Americans need to understand that. Some act as if it were somehow somebody else's problem if not frivolous from it's outset.

Source: PDNOnline

The Department of Defense would be required to grant journalists access to ceremonies honoring fallen military personnel under a bill introduced in the U.S. House of Representatives.

The legislation is significant because it would, for the first time since Vietnam, let photojournalists capture the powerful images of flag-draped caskets arriving on American soil during wartime.

This week the bill won the endorsement of the National Press Photographers Association.

The Fallen Hero Commemoration Act, or H.R. 6662, was introduced July 30 by Rep. Walter B. Jones (R-N.C.), a member of the House Committee on Armed Services.

The bill states: "The Secretary of Defense shall grant access to accredited members of the media at military commemoration ceremonies and memorial services conducted by the Armed Forces for members of the Armed Forces who have died on active duty and when the remains of members of the Armed Forces arrive at military installations in the United States." It was referred to the Committee on Armed Services............

More: http://www.pdnonline.com/pdn/newswire/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003839279

The celebration is not appropriate in this post.

:salute:

Hopefully the wording...... "accredited members of the media" will keep the assholes from shoving microphones and cameras in the faces of grieving family members. That was what the original ban was about, respect for the fallen and their families...... not the bullshit propagated by the antiwar clowns on the left.

[Psychoblues]

The door will be opened, zero, and I am certain that the likes of the jerks at FauxNews, etc., will not be denied. It is time, however, that as Americans and concerned citizens we see what is happening to our families, our countrymen and especially our troops.

[Sitarro]

The door will be opened, zero, and I am certain that the likes of the jerks at FauxNews, etc., will not be denied. It is time, however, that as Americans and concerned citizens we see what is happening to our families, our countrymen and especially our troops.

What a load of horse shit. Who doesn't know? If someone doesn't they are ignorant enough to be voting Democrat because they don't have a clue about the world around them....... the dream Dem voter, totally oblivious and easily lead with a carton of cigarettes or a fried chicken lunch.

[Psychoblues]

What a freakin' punkass you are, zero. I didn't imply that even someone as ignorant as you did not "know". I said "see" which is more relevant to the information we are discussing.



What a load of horse shit. Who doesn't know? If someone doesn't they are ignorant enough to be voting Democrat because they don't have a clue about the world around them....... the dream Dem voter, totally oblivious and easily lead with a carton of cigarettes or a fried chicken lunch.

You don't like cigarettes or fried chicken? I suggest you avoid them.

:salute::cheers2::clap::laugh2::cheers2::salute:

[rppearso]

You don't need to shove cameras and microphones into someones face to drive home the cost of an unnecessary war. Besides when did being antiwar have a negative connotation, war is expensive and destroys families and lives. This will help the American people see the drama that war causes and get more people to be anti war and the war monger assholes can go starve in a ditch. Berating an anti war movement is like berating a homeless shelter or a charity you look like a total ass clown when you make statements like that. I hope the democrats start doing massive military cuts as well, this nation was never ment to have a 1.5 million man standing military. Im all for having the most cutting edge weapons of death and continuing that research for the future but we dont need 1.5 million people on active duty plus all of the infrastructure to support 1.5 million people not to mention the gross over staffing of the reserves/national gaurd thats what the draft is for. When you cut down the size you could also cut out the bureaucracy and get rid of the assholes and make the military truly professional.

[Psychoblues]

Are you not happy with the professionalism of the military, rp?

:salute::cheers2::clap::laugh2::cheers2::salute:

[rppearso]

Are you not happy with the professionalism of the military, rp?

:salute::cheers2::clap::laugh2::cheers2::salute:

Anyone who focuses on customs/coutesys, power trips, boot shining, or meaningless busy work, etc rather than doing meaningful projects is not a professional. Professionalism is not an outward facad but actual performance at ones job. The military is too "rank" focused rather than postion focused. Also basic training as a one size fits all is a joke, "basic" training should be curtailed for an individuals choosen field because someone has to want to do what they are doing in order to excell at it, fear mongering will get people to do the bare minimum or teach people that they need to learn to circumvent the system. And the hazing would have to stop if you wanted to be considered a professional, people call themselves all kinds of things all the time but that does not mean that thats in fact what you are, all kinds of people call themselves engineers who are not and most people in the military are not professionals, some are but most are not. Its the governments way to make them feel special like they are a cut above to try to motivate them when in fact all they have is a few weeks of (or 9 weeks or whatever) of MOS training which hardly qualifies you as a professional in anything. I watched people coming out of MOS training when I was in the guard and they were complaining that the civilian trainers were trying to be there "friends" while they taught them the rudimentary fundamentals of swaping out parts on a helicopter, these civilians were probably degreed PROFESSIONALS who were trying to teach them something and all the trainee could think of was he was trying to be my friend, how dare he, he should have been a pompous ass like a drill sgt these are the caliber of people I saw in the military.

[Psychoblues]

I dig that, rp. Thanks for the expose'!!!!!!!!!!

:salute::cheers2::clap::laugh2::cheers2::salute:

[CatalystOfChaos]

What disturbs me is that for these journalists, its all about the dollars.

If I felt that they actually just wanted to convey truth, I wouldn't mind.

But very Alan Jacksonesque, I feel that they'll just exploit people's grief for attention and money.

[Psychoblues]

Welcome to the world of corporate controlled mainstream media, COC!!!!!!!!



What disturbs me is that for these journalists, its all about the dollars.

If I felt that they actually just wanted to convey truth, I wouldn't mind.

But very Alan Jacksonesque, I feel that they'll just exploit people's grief for attention and money.

Have you ever considered independent sources?

:salute::cheers2::clap::laugh2::cheers2::salute:

[hjmick]

...I feel that they'll just exploit people's grief for attention and money.

Don't forget political hay.

[Immanuel]

The celebration is not appropriate in this post.

:salute:

Thank you. :salute:

Immie

[rppearso]

What disturbs me is that for these journalists, its all about the dollars.

If I felt that they actually just wanted to convey truth, I wouldn't mind.

But very Alan Jacksonesque, I feel that they'll just exploit people's grief for attention and money.

Even if a journalist is just doing there job for the paycheck, in this case they are still conveying the truth. The motivation of the guy carrying the camera is irrelavant as long as the coverage is still the same. Also the fact that they are covering military funnerals shows a sense of patriotism by the fact that they are trying to end a pointless war to keep more of these funerals from happeneing by showing people the cost of war. The press is not a non profit organization so I expect them to make a few bucks selling news papers, without the press we would be like the soviet union. News is about 90% truth and if you can keep from getting emotionally sucked into the 10% bias you can get good information from main stream media. Usually if there saying there is a fire in neigborhood A there is a fire but then they go further to say the arsonst was a pill poper who need phyciatric evaluation ..... but you got the news you needed there was a fire. 99% of the time the media does not 100% fabricate a story out of thin air usually something did in fact happen.

[Sitarro]

Even if a journalist is just doing there job for the paycheck, in this case they are still conveying the truth. The motivation of the guy carrying the camera is irrelavant as long as the coverage is still the same. Also the fact that they are covering military funnerals shows a sense of patriotism by the fact that they are trying to end a pointless war to keep more of these funerals from happeneing by showing people the cost of war. The press is not a non profit organization so I expect them to make a few bucks selling news papers, without the press we would be like the soviet union. News is about 90% truth and if you can keep from getting emotionally sucked into the 10% bias you can get good information from main stream media. Usually if there saying there is a fire in neigborhood A there is a fire but then they go further to say the arsonst was a pill poper who need phyciatric evaluation ..... but you got the news you needed there was a fire. 99% of the time the media does not 100% fabricate a story out of thin air usually something did in fact happen.

If one of those assholes tries to use a relative of mine for his bullshit story, he will have to remove the camera from his ass to retrieve the photos. These assholes, like you, are only after one thing, sensationalizing any death whether it occurs in battle or from an accident....... they don't bother to differentiate. You are a punk and dishonest about the military and what it takes to run it. The military isn't a job motivated by pay which makes it completely different from civilian life, just because you were not disciplined enough to get through basic doesn't make it less valid. Oh and by the way, you are not only a pussy but an idiot as well, who could possibly give a shit what you think.

[rppearso]

If one of those assholes tries to use a relative of mine for his bullshit story, he will have to remove the camera from his ass to retrieve the photos. These assholes, like you, are only after one thing, sensationalizing any death whether it occurs in battle or from an accident....... they don't bother to differentiate. You are a punk and dishonest about the military and what it takes to run it. The military isn't a job motivated by pay which makes it completely different from civilian life, just because you were not disciplined enough to get through basic doesn't make it less valid. Oh and by the way, you are not only a pussy but an idiot as well, who could possibly give a shit what you think.

Spoken like a true asshole. Most people in the media do it because its what they enjoy doing not because they are collecting a pay check, in fact most professionals do what they do because they enjoy it and the pay check is a nice bonus. You should apply for the chair of the federal reserve because you just wrote a whole paragraph with little to no substance. The sensationaliation of military deaths is to forshadow the cost of war, I dont care if they rolled there humv during training, even the perparation and training for a needless war counts as casulties. Im not dishonest about anything, alot of people I met in the military were schmucks and alot of people were also 2 faced.

[Immanuel]

Spoken like a true asshole. Most people in the media do it because its what they enjoy doing not because they are collecting a pay check, in fact most professionals do what they do because they enjoy it and the pay check is a nice bonus. You should apply for the chair of the federal reserve because you just wrote a whole paragraph with little to no substance. The sensationaliation of military deaths is to forshadow the cost of war, I dont care if they rolled there humv during training, even the perparation and training for a needless war counts as casulties. Im not dishonest about anything, alot of people I met in the military were schmucks and alot of people were also 2 faced.

Can I ask you a question? It is not to put you on the spot or to make you look bad, but I want to know how you feel about this.

Do you think it is appropriate and are you speaking of a reporter approaching a grieving parent, spouse or child of a deceased soldier, sticking a microphone in front of their face and saying something stupid like, "So Mrs. X, how do you feel about having to bury your child today?"

Is that the kind of journalism you are supporting here?

I pray to God that is not what you are saying because you are saying that they actually enjoy what they are doing.

Immie

[rppearso]

Can I ask you a question? It is not to put you on the spot or to make you look bad, but I want to know how you feel about this.

Do you think it is appropriate and are you speaking of a reporter approaching a grieving parent, spouse or child of a deceased soldier, sticking a microphone in front of their face and saying something stupid like, "So Mrs. X, how do you feel about having to bury your child today?"

Is that the kind of journalism you are supporting here?

I pray to God that is not what you are saying because you are saying that they actually enjoy what they are doing.

Immie

I disagree with shoving a microphone in someones face but simply covering the funeral and showing the number of people effected by the individuals death due to a senseless war and the drama of the scene will graphicly represent what this war is costing to the general public. Just like showing a road side bomb going off and showing a humv full of dead burned up soldiers and showing the public that this is what happens when you half ass a war or fight a senseless war in the first place. The level of dilusion amongst military members is unbelivable and almost makes you not feel sorry for there deaths because its almost as if most of them are brainless idiots, that is clearly shown by my my rep on this military board. If there was any true commradary in the miltiary they would not be treating each other like shit and would not be condesending towards the contractors that provide them with EVERYTHING they use nor would they support war and especially half assing a war. If they want to sig hiel to bush and spit on the civilian scientists and engineers (ie pouges) and go out and fight an enemy with an M-16 instead of a few hundred MOAB's or a tactical nuke then I say they deserve to get shot for being dense and brainless.

[Immanuel]

I disagree with shoving a microphone in someones face

Thanks for the reply and although I understand the frustration with the way the administration has handled the war, I must disagree with you on our soldiers.

I'm certainly glad you don't agree with shoving a mic in a grieving person's face. That is not to say that if the person who his grieving wants to make a statement, they should not be allowed to, but I feel that they should be given some common courtesy.

Immie

[rppearso]

Thanks for the reply and although I understand the frustration with the way the administration has handled the war, I must disagree with you on our soldiers.

I'm certainly glad you don't agree with shoving a mic in a grieving person's face. That is not to say that if the person who his grieving wants to make a statement, they should not be allowed to, but I feel that they should be given some common courtesy.

Immie

If you disagree with how the administration is handling the war then why stay in the military. The president is not an emperor he answers to the people and soldiers should be part of the people (although there citizenship is striped from them per the UCMJ). If you disagree with the president but continue to fuel his decisions through your continued action then you might as well agree. Of all people soldiers should be agreeing with me and my rep points should be through the roof positive, so you can say you disagree with the administartions decisions but your actions are the opposite.

[Immanuel]

If you disagree with how the administration is handling the war then why stay in the military. The president is not an emperor he answers to the people and soldiers should be part of the people (although there citizenship is striped from them per the UCMJ). If you disagree with the president but continue to fuel his decisions through your continued action then you might as well agree. Of all people soldiers should be agreeing with me and my rep points should be through the roof positive, so you can say you disagree with the administartions decisions but your actions are the opposite.

Question:

Where did I say I was in the Military?

I was in the Coast Guard Reserves until 1986, but I am not in the military today and to be quite honest with you... I'm over weight, out of shape and have a back that bothers me every day. I only wish I could get back in. Of course, I would go Coast Guard again, as I prefer saving lives to taking them.

I do, however, respect the job that our men and women in uniform are doing regardless of whether or not they agree with President Bush. It is their job... their careers. They don't have the luxury of walking in today and saying, "I quit", just because they don't like President Bush's decisions. Hell, if I am not mistaken, when things weren't going his way, he took their right not to re-up away from them.

Immie

[rppearso]

Question:

Where did I say I was in the Military?

I was in the Coast Guard Reserves until 1986, but I am not in the military today and to be quite honest with you... I'm over weight, out of shape and have a back that bothers me every day. I only wish I could get back in. Of course, I would go Coast Guard again, as I prefer saving lives to taking them.

I do, however, respect the job that our men and women in uniform are doing regardless of whether or not they agree with President Bush. It is their job... their careers. They don't have the luxury of walking in today and saying, "I quit", just because they don't like President Bush's decisions. Hell, if I am not mistaken, when things weren't going his way, he took their right not to re-up away from them.

Immie

Thus making you an indentured servant to the state and no longer a citizen ..... how is that honorable? Its not everyones career's, not everyone is a lifer and if given the option to walk I bet a huge number of people would take it, I just wonder where thoes people are at on this forum.

That being said you have to be a willing participant to the indentured servitude, regulations cant force action all the regulations do is fear monger and if you buy into that fear you will be a slave. Military regulations are not like civil regulations, most civil regulations are designed to keep the peace and harmony for the good of the society and are agreed upon by many, military regulations are dictated by a few and are intended to control groups of people and are not nessicarily to the benifit of the individual but to benifit the machine sometimes without regard to the individual.

I really should put all these posts I write together and publish a book on the miltiary war machine. Of course I would have to dig through all the different posts and forums for all of the different genious things I have stated but it might be worth it.

[Immanuel]

Thus making you an indentured servant to the state and no longer a citizen ..... how is that honorable? Its not everyones career's, not everyone is a lifer and if given the option to walk I bet a huge number of people would take it, I just wonder where thoes people are at on this forum.

That being said you have to be a willing participant to the indentured servitude, regulations cant force action all the regulations do is fear monger and if you buy into that fear you will be a slave.

I really should put all these posts I write together and publish a book on the miltiary war machine. Of course I would have to dig through all the different posts and forums for all of the different genious things I have stated but it might be worth it.

I'm sorry, but none of the makes the least bit of sense especially since as I said, I am not in the Military.

Immie

[rppearso]

I'm sorry, but none of the makes the least bit of sense especially since as I said, I am not in the Military.

Immie

"You" refering to anyone in the military. If you put yourself in the position of being back in the military it should make perfect sense.

[5stringJeff]

If the intent of the bill is to allow the press to show photos of flag-draped coffins, I don't have an issue. But I have to agree with Sitarro... if the media members involved are going to get up in the face of mourning widows, that's uncalled for. Still, I think it's only the tabloid media that does such things.

[5stringJeff]

Thus making you an indentured servant to the state and no longer a citizen ..... how is that honorable? Its not everyones career's, not everyone is a lifer and if given the option to walk I bet a huge number of people would take it, I just wonder where thoes people are at on this forum.

Maybe you should read this quote (http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/g/georgewash146818.html) by George Washington:

"When we assumed the Soldier, we did not lay aside the Citizen."

[Psychoblues]

I don't think you have anything to worry about, zero.




If one of those assholes tries to use a relative of mine for his bullshit story, he will have to remove the camera from his ass to retrieve the photos. These assholes, like you, are only after one thing, sensationalizing any death whether it occurs in battle or from an accident....... they don't bother to differentiate. You are a punk and dishonest about the military and what it takes to run it. The military isn't a job motivated by pay which makes it completely different from civilian life, just because you were not disciplined enough to get through basic doesn't make it less valid. Oh and by the way, you are not only a pussy but an idiot as well, who could possibly give a shit what you think.

And if your threat is involved, I don't think the journalists have anything to worry about either.

:salute::cheers2::clap::laugh2::cheers2::salute:

[rppearso]

Maybe you should read this quote (http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/g/georgewash146818.html) by George Washington:

"When we assumed the Soldier, we did not lay aside the Citizen."

Maybe in George Washingtons days this was true but now days you have stop loss and a whole myriad of other bureaucratic UCMJ policies that civilians do not adhere to.

George Washington also said this:

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/g/georgewash109674.html

Over grown military establishments are under any form of government inauspicious to liberty, and are to be regarded as particularly hostile to republican liberty. You can go through all kinds of quotes from the founding fathers and what we are seeing today is nothing of what the fathers planned for us.

Here is another article:
http://www.military.com/NewContent/0,13190,Defensewatch_111403_Who,00.html

Most american soldiers now days are neither kind hearted, good natured or easy going, in fact when I was in basic and the guard it was the large minority that displayed these characteristics.

[Psychoblues]

The American troop/soldier does what they do for a myriad of reasons with patriotism being only one of them. When they perish by any act of war or even any mistake of incompetent training the potential civilians that might find themselves eligible for similar demise are well served by having been at least marginally educated as to the propensities of what many consider their own actions.

After all, they're all volunteers, aren't they? Don't you think they should be shown and told the truth on the front end?

:salute::cheers2::clap::laugh2::cheers2::salute:

[rppearso]

The American troop/soldier does what they do for a myriad of reasons with patriotism being only one of them. When they perish by any act of war or even any mistake of incompetent training the potential civilians that might find themselves eligible for similar demise are well served by having been at least marginally educated as to the propensities of what many consider their own actions.

After all, they're all volunteers, aren't they? Don't you think they should be shown and told the truth on the front end?

:salute::cheers2::clap::laugh2::cheers2::salute:

Absolutely, but that is almost never the case. The military has gotten very good at manipulating people into joining over the years and I consider myself a pretty smart guy with a BS in engineering but because I wanted to fly I was romanticized into the national guard and did not learn the real truth until I was already in, so can you really call someone a "volunteer" when they don't know the whole truth before they join. Its a very tedious game of knowing what is beneath the contract with the scant data available for what really matters (ie if I actually wanted to attend flight school after OCS I would have to sign for 6 more years which I was never made aware of up front so I opted out) but not before I got a busted ankle in basic that bothers me to this day for nothing. And when someone does join that is not educated does that give recruiters a right to exploit that ignorance and still be able to claim to be honorable.

[Psychoblues]

Exploitation of ignorance is the job of the recruiter, rp. And like you, I resent and abhor it. Ignorance has nothing to do with educational degrees or even personal educational ambitions. It just means that you don't know and some poke around to find that in you and exploit you for it. It's a con game at best.



Absolutely, but that is almost never the case. The military has gotten very good at manipulating people into joining over the years and I consider myself a pretty smart guy with a BS in engineering but because I wanted to fly I was romanticized into the national guard and did not learn the real truth until I was already in, so can you really call someone a "volunteer" when they don't know the whole truth before they join. Its a very tedious game of knowing what is beneath the contract with the scant data available for what really matters (ie if I actually wanted to attend flight school after OCS I would have to sign for 6 more years which I was never made aware of up front so I opted out) but not before I got a busted ankle in basic that bothers me to this day for nothing. And when someone does join that is not educated does that give recruiters a right to exploit that ignorance and still be able to claim to be honorable.

Thanks for sharing that with me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:salute::cheers2::clap::laugh2::cheers2::salute: