I thought this was interesting

[actsnoblemartin]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage_strike

A marriage strike is the social phenomenon of men seeking to avoid marriage. The 'marriage strike' specifically refers to the action of men living within the Western world. Advocates of the marriage strike believe that after a considered cost-benefit analysis, the legal contract that is modern marriage no longer represents an attractive option for men living in the West's changed legal, economic, sociological, cultural, and demographic environment.

[Abbey Marie]

Are we back to the simplistic "Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free"?

[actsnoblemartin]

edited

[Abbey Marie]

There is nothing simple about what i wrote, with all due respect, you either didnt read the link, or didnt understand it.

Now, please read it and try to understand it, before you post again so we can actually have a conversation, instead of you just making veiled insults at me.

The comment had absolutely nothing to do with you, Martin. You apparently do not understand the reference.

Sigh. I want a longer vacation.

[Said1]

There is nothing simple about what i wrote, with all due respect, you either didnt read the link, or didnt understand it.

Now, please read it and try to understand it, before you post again so we can actually have a conversation, instead of you just making veiled insults at me.

It was pretty clear cut to me.......no buying cow, when there's free milk. Pls expand in your own words if this is incorrect.

[OCA]

There is nothing simple about what i wrote, with all due respect, you either didnt read the link, or didnt understand it.

Now, please read it and try to understand it, before you post again so we can actually have a conversation, instead of you just making veiled insults at me.

Abbey was spot on in her assessment of the article you posted, either you are a hypocritical liar about the meaning or or YOU YOURSELF do not understand the article.................for obvious reasons.

Oh and BTW, anyone on this board can make insults towards you veiled or not anytime we please, we've earned that right and you deserve as much...Ray.

[actsnoblemartin]

I apologize for being an over-sensitive bitch, and take back what i said.

Sorry love :coffee:

:cheers2:


The comment had absolutely nothing to do with you, Martin. You apparently do not understand the reference.

Sigh. I want a longer vacation.

[actsnoblemartin]

I dont think the article was anti-woman. Or about using women

The article was about that it is not economically smart for men to marry.

How the rules of divorce, child custody, alimony, child support favor women.

Marriage is great for women, because no matter what, they are taken care of.

I simply cant understand how some of you dont seem to grasp the concept that more and more men dont want to be treated unfairly in marriage and in divorce.

:dance:


It was pretty clear cut to me.......no buying cow, when there's free milk. Pls expand in your own words if this is incorrect.

[actsnoblemartin]

as i said, i was being an oversensitive BITCH about it.

abbey is a sweet heart, has very high character, and a high quality person, and i shouldnt be such a pussy, even if she or you wanna insult me, i hate to say this, but in this case, you are right.

I cant be so over sensitive.

I apologize sincerely

So, if you disagree. Ill have to suck it up and quit whining like a baby

:salute:


Abbey was spot on in her assessment of the article you posted, either you are a hypocritical liar about the meaning or or YOU YOURSELF do not understand the article.................for obvious reasons.

Oh and BTW, anyone on this board can make insults towards you veiled or not anytime we please, we've earned that right and you deserve as much...Ray.

[Said1]

I simply cant understand how some of you dont seem to grasp the concept that more and more men dont want to be treated unfairly in marriage and in divorce.


Possibly because many people here (at least not me) don't view marriage the same way you do. Is it fair to say it's something you don't seem to grasp? Also, your comments are sometimes a little annoying to those who have been married for quite sometime and personal financial security at the expense of their spouse is not what 'they're all about'. Contrary to what your world view allows you to see, every marital situation is different as is the reson for divorcing - so logically that would mean that the end results (ie divorce settlement) are not identical in millions of situtions.

[Dilloduck]

Are we back to the simplistic "Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free"?

Interesting phrase. Why should men have to buy women to for sex ? Are women expected to buy the men that they choose to have sex with?

[Said1]

Interesting phrase. Why should men have to buy women to for sex ? Are women expected to buy the men that they choose to have sex with?

It's a figure of speech left over from your day, you know that! :laugh2:

But anyway, do you think a man/women should move in with a women/man under the guise of 'might get married later, down the road'?

[Dilloduck]

It's a figure of speech left over from your day, you know that! :laugh2:

But anyway, do you think a man/women should move in with a women/man under the guise of 'might get married later, down the road'?

old phrase but apparently the intent still rings true. If a man wants sex he needs to buy it. or maybe--a women shouldn't have sex unless she gets paid for it.
I don't care what men and women do as far as living together in or out of wedlock.

[Said1]

old phrase but apparently the intent still rings true. If a man wants sex he needs to buy it. or maybe--a women shouldn't have sex unless she gets paid for it.
I don't care what men and women do as far as living together in or out of wedlock.

I don't get where you're going with the 'pay for sex' stuff. I thought the intent (or proper context of not buying a cow and free milk) was -- why marry a women when you can get the same perks of marriage (including sex) through common-law relationships? No one said anything about buying sex in the sense that you mean.

[Dilloduck]

I don't get where you're going with the 'pay for sex' stuff. I thought the intent (or proper context of not buying a cow and free milk) was -- why marry a women when you can get the same perks of marriage (including sex) through common-law relationships? No one said anything about buying sex in the sense that you mean.

It certainly was mentioned in the OP as a reason that more men are choosing to stay single. And I believe the statement is often made to women suggesting that if you give it away before mariage, you will never get someone to marry you.

[Said1]

It certainly was mentioned in the OP as a reason that more men are choosing to stay single. And I believe the statement is often made to women suggesting that if you give it away before mariage, you will never get someone to marry you.

I didn't read the entire article. It says they prefer to pay for sex, as in 'you have sex with me an i'll pay you cash'?

And I guess if you say it's often said to women, I have to believe you.

[Dilloduck]

I didn't read the entire article. It says they prefer to pay for sex, as in 'you have sex with me an i'll pay you cash'?

And I guess if you say it's often said to women, I have to believe you.

Parents (mostly mothers) tend to say it to daughters and girlfiends say it to girlfriends. "Quit giving it away" as if it is the only incentive for him to marry or stay around. Either way there is no denying that sex is being used as a commodity to manipulate behavior.

[Abbey Marie]

Parents (mostly mothers) tend to say it to daughters and girlfiends say it to girlfriends. "Quit giving it away" as if it is the only incentive for him to marry or stay around. Either way there is no denying that sex is being used as a commodity to manipulate behavior.

As I said, it's a simplistic saying. I doubt it applies much today in the U.S., where people rarely "save themselves for marriage".

By the same token, I know of a few women who moved in with their guy hoping for a marriage that never materialized. I suspect that inertia takes over in many of these situations, and the guys didn't see any benefit in marriage when everything was going along fine in his estimation. If that's a cow/milk situation, so be it. Either way, I don't think it's something I would get excited about.

As for sex as a commodity, it always has been and always will be be seen as the woman giving something away. It's just the nature of the beast, so to speak.

[Dilloduck]

As I said, it's a simplistic saying. I doubt it applies much today in the U.S., where people rarely "save themselves for marriage".

By the same token, I know of a few women who moved in with their guy hoping for a marriage that never materialized. I suspect that inertia takes over in many of these situations, and the guys didn't see any benefit in marriage when everything was going along fine in his estimation. If that's a cow/milk situation, so be it. Either way, I don't think it's something I would get excited about.

As for sex as a commodity, it always has been and always will be be seen as the woman giving something away. It's just the nature of the beast, so to speak.

That again is the point of the OP. It isn't given for free. Apparently a lot of men find it far too costly. Literally.
after a considered cost-benefit analysis,

[Kathianne]

Parents (mostly mothers) tend to say it to daughters and girlfiends say it to girlfriends. "Quit giving it away" as if it is the only incentive for him to marry or stay around. Either way there is no denying that sex is being used as a commodity to manipulate behavior.

So you are throwing in with Martin and those from the wiki?

[Dilloduck]

So you are throwing in with Martin and those from the wiki?

I'm not "throwing in" with anyone. I'm making my own comments about the OP.

[Kathianne]

I'm not "throwing in" with anyone. I'm making my own comments about the OP.

That's cool. For some reason I got the impression you thought women were out to get men, via sex. My mistake.

[actsnoblemartin]

:)


Possibly because many people here (at least not me) don't view marriage the same way you do. Is it fair to say it's something you don't seem to grasp?

It is very possible, I will concede that point to you

Also, your comments are sometimes a little annoying to those who have been married for quite sometime


and unlike before, I had no intent to offend anyone with this thread, and i apoligize for my past actions, many times, being immature. But this thread, I found interesting and worth discussing.

and personal financial security at the expense of their spouse is not what 'they're all about'.


I dont understand

Contrary to what your world view allows you to see, every marital situation is different as is the reson for divorcing

I will grant you that its possible, but the link said the majority of divorces were no fault, which meant they could have been for any reason under the sun

- so logically that would mean that the end results (ie divorce settlement) are not identical in millions of situtions.

True, they are not identical, but i honestly believe the woman and man, should only be entitled to wages they earned during the marriage, if a home was bought, then sell the home, and split the profits. As i understand, a home is a joint marital purchase. I simply fail to understand, why a man should ever have to pay a woman alimony, when women now a days can work. Feel free to educate me, on any part of this where im wrong, this thread is NOT about hating women, I wanted an actual conversation, and i thank you for speaking with me on it.

[Dilloduck]

That's cool. For some reason I got the impression you thought women were out to get men, via sex. My mistake.

Some women certainly use sex to lure them in.

[actsnoblemartin]

im not really talking about the sex though, im talking about the rules of divorce, and who benefits from them.


It was pretty clear cut to me.......no buying cow, when there's free milk. Pls expand in your own words if this is incorrect.

[Abbey Marie]

Well, Martin, it looks like my post got your thread going! :) ;)

Apology accepted...

Abbey

[Said1]

im not really talking about the sex though, im talking about the rules of divorce, and who benefits from them.

I know, I wasn't talking about sex either. Sheesh. :laugh2:

[Dilloduck]

Well, Martin, it looks like my post got your thread going! :) ;)

Apology accepted...

Abbey

ya--that cow and milk stuff did the trick but gender debates always score big--pay attention, Marty!! It beats the hell out of " what kind of food makes you fart" ?

[Abbey Marie]

ya--that cow and milk stuff did the trick but gender debates always score big--pay attention, Marty!! It beats the hell out of " what kind of food makes you fart" ?

I must have missed that one!

[Dilloduck]

I must have missed that one!

I was just giving him shit :poke:

[actsnoblemartin]

I know this is gonna sound hypocritical, but isnt it derogatory to compare women to cows?

secondly, I am arguing there is little incentive for men to marry.

why would any rational man (no offense to any married man here) want to get married when their is a 50% chance it will fail, and if it does, i love half my wealth, plus alimony, plus child support.

It doesnt make any sense to me, could you imagine leaving your house, if their was a 50% chance you would be killed every time you left

now, for women... marriage is a wonderful thing.

you will end up with custody of the children 90%+ of the time, you will get alimony, and child support.

You will most likely even get the house, that you were living in.

Now, im no genius... but i dont understand how any honest woman can tell me, that if the shoe were on the other foot, they would wanna marry, or tell me, it is a good idea for men to marry

by the way, ive been told by a friend with aspburgers, that 89% of people with aspburgers who marry end up divorced.

even if a wife cheats and the husband is not the father, in many states, he is forced to pay for the kid

Now, their is not one word in this thread about hating women, what i DIS-LIKE, is the way the family court/divorce court has a bigger bias then the liberal media, and favors women, the vast majority of the time.

Now someone please explain to me, why and how im wrong, and why men should marry again?

Change the rules, and maybe men will want to be married, if the system was more fair and equitable instead of kicking men in the privates, and taking so much of their soul.


As I said, it's a simplistic saying. I doubt it applies much today in the U.S., where people rarely "save themselves for marriage".

By the same token, I know of a few women who moved in with their guy hoping for a marriage that never materialized. I suspect that inertia takes over in many of these situations, and the guys didn't see any benefit in marriage when everything was going along fine in his estimation. If that's a cow/milk situation, so be it. Either way, I don't think it's something I would get excited about.

As for sex as a commodity, it always has been and always will be be seen as the woman giving something away. It's just the nature of the beast, so to speak.

[actsnoblemartin]

my thread/posts having nothing to doing that.


That's cool. For some reason I got the impression you thought women were out to get men, via sex. My mistake.

[actsnoblemartin]

I know, I wasn't talking about sex either. Sheesh. :laugh2:
fair enough, sorry ms said1. And for the record. I appreciate your contributions to this thread.

thank you :salute:

[actsnoblemartin]

I may be thick in the head sometimes, but i am learning that women are individuals, to be judged accordingly, and i must not allow myself to indulge in hateful thoughts against women or anyone else.

I may NOT love everything about women, but i will keep trying to quit being a knuckle head about them :coffee:

Youre a dear/sweetheart abbey

:salute:


Well, Martin, it looks like my post got your thread going! :) ;)

Apology accepted...

Abbey

[Abbey Marie]

my thread/posts having nothing to doing that.

Of course it has something to do with sex.

From the article:


[edit] Cohabitation Without Marriage
Proponents of the marriage strike advise that men should simply cohabit (live with a girlfriend), and not actually marry. Living with a girlfriend presents a legally safer alternative, with marriage's benefits to men, with a reduction in the penalties found within marriage.


Does anyone really think that a man would consider a "marriage strike" if it meant he couldn't have sex with the woman he loves?

[actsnoblemartin]

ya--that cow and milk stuff did the trick but gender debates always score big--pay attention, Marty!! It beats the hell out of " what kind of food makes you fart" ?

I agree, and my female canadian nurse friend told me something that made me think, women and men are not bad, their different, and that its ok to be equal, but different.

I like that, im trying to apply the knowledge that each individual human being deserves a chance to be my friend, and like a famous civil rights leader said judge them on the content of their character.

So since i know i have a prejudice towards women, i am working hard to guard my thoughts. I no longer receive email from or go to sites that de-mean women.

[Abbey Marie]

I may be thick in the head sometimes, but i am learning that women are individuals, to be judged accordingly, and i must not allow myself to indulge in hateful thoughts against women or anyone else.

I may NOT love everything about women, but i will keep trying to quit being a knuckle head about them :coffee:

Youre a dear/sweetheart abbey

:salute:

That's a healthy attitude, Martin, for everyone to have.

[Dilloduck]

I know this is gonna sound hypocritical, but isnt it derogatory to compare women to cows?

secondly, I am arguing there is little incentive for men to marry.

why would any rational man (no offense to any married man here) want to get married when their is a 50% chance it will fail, and if it does, i love half my wealth, plus alimony, plus child support.

It doesnt make any sense to me, could you imagine leaving your house, if their was a 50% chance you would be killed every time you left

now, for women... marriage is a wonderful thing.

you will end up with custody of the children 90%+ of the time, you will get alimony, and child support.

You will most likely even get the house, that you were living in.

Now, im no genius... but i dont understand how any honest woman can tell me, that if the shoe were on the other foot, they would wanna marry, or tell me, it is a good idea for men to marry

by the way, ive been told by a friend with aspburgers, that 89% of people with aspburgers who marry end up divorced.

even if a wife cheats and the husband is not the father, in many states, he is forced to pay for the kid

Now, their is not one word in this thread about hating women, what i DIS-LIKE, is the way the family court/divorce court has a bigger bias then the liberal media, and favors women, the vast majority of the time.

Now someone please explain to me, why and how im wrong, and why men should marry again?

Change the rules, and maybe men will want to be married, if the system was more fair and equitable instead of kicking men in the privates, and taking so much of their soul.

OK marty--I'll ignore Abbey's 'cow-milk' thingy and go with ya. You (the man) are supposed to marry the woman if you want to have --------.
Never mind--good point. Why DO men want to get married other than the "cow-milk" thing ? :laugh2:

[actsnoblemartin]

ok, but i dont agree with everything the article says.

for instance, i dont believe in living with women, and i believe in being honest.

so, as long as the woman knows, all i want u for is sex, and she has the ability to say no, if she chooses to engage in that type of relationship, who am i to judge.

People need to be honest about what they want


Of course it has something to do with sex.

From the article:



Does anyone really think that a man would consider a "marriage strike" if it meant he couldn't have sex with the woman he loves?

[Abbey Marie]

OK marty--I'll ignore Abbey's 'cow-milk' thingy and go with ya. You (the man) are supposed to marry the woman if you want to have --------.
Never mind--good point. Why DO men want to get married other than the "cow-milk" thing ? :laugh2:

:cow:

http://school.discoveryeducation.com/clipart/images/milk.gif

[Dilloduck]

Of course it has something to do with sex.

From the article:



Does anyone really think that a man would consider a "marriage strike" if it meant he couldn't have sex with the woman he loves?

That doesn't say anything about sex---it just says living together. Long walks on the beach--cuddling--:laugh2:

[Dilloduck]

:cow:

http://school.discoveryeducation.com/clipart/images/milk.gif

sex--it's all you can think about ain't it ! :slap:

[actsnoblemartin]

:laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:


:cow:

http://school.discoveryeducation.com/clipart/images/milk.gif

[Abbey Marie]

sex--it's all you can think about ain't it ! :slap:

Actually, I was thinking about breast-feeding. :laugh2:

[Dilloduck]

Actually, I was thinking about breast-feeding. :laugh2:

Ya ya--I know---that's what they are supposed to be all about :lame2:

[Dilloduck]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage_strike

A marriage strike is the social phenomenon of men seeking to avoid marriage. The 'marriage strike' specifically refers to the action of men living within the Western world. Advocates of the marriage strike believe that after a considered cost-benefit analysis, the legal contract that is modern marriage no longer represents an attractive option for men living in the West's changed legal, economic, sociological, cultural, and demographic environment.

Well congrats, Marty. Looks like you threw this curveball right passed the attack squad ! Tell us--how does that well earned victory feel for ya ? :clap:

[actsnoblemartin]

Well congrats, Marty. Looks like you threw this curveball right passed the attack squad ! Tell us--how does that well earned victory feel for ya ? :clap:

Great thank you

:salute:

it feels so good not to be angry, or feel the need to be aggressive, but rather to be honest, while learning how to socialize Smartly, i hope smartly is a word lol

thanks again :)

[Dilloduck]

Great thank you

:salute:

it feels so good not to be angry, or feel the need to be aggressive, but rather to be honest, while learning how to socialize Smartly, i hope smartly is a word lol

thanks again :)

Don't get too cocky--women can never handle that one very well !! :laugh2:

[Said1]

Don't get too cocky--women can never handle that one very well !! :laugh2:

Handle what well?

[Dilloduck]

Handle what well?

:laugh2: oh man--here we go again !

[Said1]

:laugh2: oh man--here we go again !

Hardley. Your to busy with puttin' a log on the fire and cooking up some bacon and some beans. And don't forget, tomorrow's Sunday, my car needs washin'.


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Oh, Lord it's hard to be humble. :laugh2:

[Dilloduck]

Hardley. Your to busy with puttin' a log on the fire and cooking up some bacon and some beans. And don't forget, tomorrow's Sunday, my car needs washin'.


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Oh, Lord it's hard to be humble. :laugh2:

well Canadian women are a whole cow of a different color !!!:laugh2: