What Recession?

[red states rule]

The liberal media and Democrats have been screaming how the sky is falling when it come to the US economy

Turns out the US economy grew in the first quarter, and the doom and gloomers are pissed the the economy is not is a recession


Economy grows by only 0.6 percent in first quarter

By JEANNINE AVERSA, AP Economics Writer
Wed Apr 30, 4:53 PM ET

WASHINGTON - The bruised economy limped through the first quarter, growing at just a 0.6 percent pace as housing and credit problems forced people and businesses alike to hunker down.

The country's economic growth during January through March was the same as in the final three months of last year, the Commerce Department reported Wednesday. The statistic did not meet what economists consider a definition of a recession — which is a contraction of the economy. This means that although the economy is stuck in a rut, it is still managing to grow, even if slightly.

Many analysts were predicting the gross domestic product (GDP) would weaken a bit more — to a pace of just 0.5 percent — in the first quarter. Earlier this year, some thought the economy would actually lurch into reverse during the opening quarter. Now, they say they believe that will likely happen during the current April-to-June period.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080430/ap_on_bi_go_ec_fi/economy;_ylt=Aq7JQSbF3XWubVB0PbIEPBus0NUE

[mundame]

Economy grows by only 0.6 percent in first quarter



Oh, you're back, good. http://wade.hu/smiley/kategoriak/%E1llatok/animal-smiley-016.gif

The Wall Street Journal is saying the slight rise is simply inflation ----- there has been a LOT of inflation! Also, the government tends to "revise" the figures in later months ---

Downwards. Or upward in the case of unemployment or inflation.

Not that I'm suggesting they lie or anything like that. http://deephousepage.com/smilies/spinning.gif

[red states rule]

Oh, you're back, good. http://wade.hu/smiley/kategoriak/%E1llatok/animal-smiley-016.gif

The Wall Street Journal is saying the slight rise is simply inflation ----- there has been a LOT of inflation! Also, the government tends to "revise" the figures in later months ---

Downwards. Or upward in the case of unemployment or inflation.

Not that I'm suggesting they lie or anything like that. http://deephousepage.com/smilies/spinning.gif

I am back for now. Another chemo treatment Friday morning

The point is, despite all the issues the US economy has - it GREW it the first quarter

Dems are very disappointed - they need a recession to help them with the election

[mundame]

Dems are very disappointed - they need a recession to help them with the election

Yes, well, so they do.

However, inflation may supply the bad news all by itself. Gas and food prices, notably.

*I* don't want any recession --- I want to make piles of money in the stock market going long!! (Yeah, sure, as if.) However, Warren Buffet is saying that he thinks this recession is going to be worse and longer than people think, and I have a high opinion of the thinking of the richest man in the world, so I consider myself warned.

[red states rule]

Yes, well, so they do.

However, inflation may supply the bad news all by itself. Gas and food prices, notably.

*I* don't want any recession --- I want to make piles of money in the stock market going long!! (Yeah, sure, as if.) However, Warren Buffet is saying that he thinks this recession is going to be worse and longer than people think, and I have a high opinion of the thinking of the richest man in the world, so I consider myself warned.

Left wing moonbats like Buffet have been saying the that for years. He is shelling out about $40 million in attacks ads against McCain and he bankrolls the left wing smear sites. Not such a nice guy when you see his other side

The liberal media was pissed over no recession:

AP Disgrace: 'Bruised Economy Grows by Only 0.6 Percent'
By Noel Sheppard | April 30, 2008 - 09:47 ET

The Associated Press's Jeannine Aversa really should change her writing focus, because economics is clearly not her specialty.

After telling readers in March that "Dangerous cracks in the nation's job market" are "ominous signs that the country is falling toward a recession or has already toppled into one," Aversa had the gall to report Wednesday, "The bruised economy limped through the first quarter of this year at a six-tenths of a percentage point growth rate as housing and credit problems forced people and businesses alike to hunker down."

Are you joking? You, your wire service, and virtually every media outlet in the nation have been telling Americans that we're already in a recession. A government report comes out saying that we're not, and this is how you begin your article covering the surprising announcement?

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2008/04/30/ap-disgrace-bruised-economy-grows-only-0-6-percent

[Kathianne]

I think things are really tough for most of us right now, with gas and food prices. Truth is, unless you went into a house you shouldn't have or want to sell in a down market, most of us haven't been troubled by the housing or credit crunch.

Seems were not alone:

http://www.usnews.com/blogs/capital-commerce/2008/4/30/dude-wheres-my-recession.html#


Dude, Where's My Recession?
April 30, 2008 09:51 AM ET | James Pethokoukis | Permanent Link

Out: Recession. In: Expansion. That's my quick take on today's first-quarter gross domestic product number, which showed that the economy grew 0.6 percent in the first quarter. Now that's not a robust number by any means, but it's not so bad given all the worry out there that the economy is headed off a cliff. Before you declare a recession, as many economic pundits have, shouldn't the economy, well, actually recess a bit—if only for a quarter?

Remember, the shorthand rule for declaring a recession is back-to-back quarters of negative growth. The semiofficial recession judge, the National Bureau of Economic Research, has a more complex formula, but I am not sure it has ever declared a recession when the economy never actually shrank. And consider this: The Intrade online betting market now says there is a meager 25 percent chance of a recession—using the negative-back-to-back-quarters definition—in 2008...

[red states rule]

I think things are really tough for most of us right now, with gas and food prices. Truth is, unless you went into a house you shouldn't have or want to sell in a down market, most of us haven't been troubled by the housing or credit crunch.

Seems were not alone:

http://www.usnews.com/blogs/capital-commerce/2008/4/30/dude-wheres-my-recession.html#

We have issues with the economy, but I do not believe it is as bad as the liberal media would have you believe

Only 4% to 5% of homeowners are late with their payments

[glockmail]

People have short memories, or no concept of history. My parents grew up during the depression and therefore instilled on us a sense of frugality. The economy was great since Regan, but I'm old enough to remember the Carter years. I don't take it for granted that the value of my investments, and my salary, will always go up. I think a lot of people don't understand that and therefore need to learn their lesson the hard way. If the government bails them out then they'll never learn it.

[red states rule]

People have short memories, or no concept of history. My parents grew up during the depression and therefore instilled on us a sense of frugality. The economy was great since Regan, but I'm old enough to remember the Carter years. I don't take it for granted that the value of my investments, and my salary, will always go up. I think a lot of people don't understand that and therefore need to learn their lesson the hard way. If the government bails them out then they'll never learn it.

When people whine about how this economy is in such bad shape, I remind them what it was like under Pres peanut Carter

Double digit interest rates (mortgages going for 15%)

Double digit inflation

and near double digit unemployment

Today some look to government for handouts and a bag of goodies - they do not care someone else has to pay fo it

With falling interest rates people can refi thier mortgages and people might be able to buy that home they could not get when rates were higher

[manu1959]

you have to wonder about the people that wish the economy was worse.....wish more soliders were being killed .......wish more homes were being forclosed on....wish gas prices were higher......they greet bad news with glee....they are thrilled when america faces adversity....

[red states rule]

you have to wonder about the people that wish the economy was worse.....wish more soliders were being killed .......wish more homes were being forclosed on....wish gas prices were higher......they greet bad news with glee....they are thrilled when america faces adversity....

They are called Democrats. The more bad news - the happier they are

[LiberalNation]

Bad news is at least interesting news. Now me, I wouldn't mind a short term bad economy. I'm quiting a job and hoping I can't find another one so I wont have to work but then I'm lucky and have the option not to work and instead free load off generous parents. They'll want me to find another job if they're out there tho.

[red states rule]

Bad news is at least interesting news. Now me, I wouldn't mind a short term bad economy. I'm quiting a job and hoping I can't find another one so I wont have to work but then I'm lucky and have the option not to work and instead free load off generous parents. They'll want me to find another job if they're out there tho.

I have always said voting Democrat it is easier then working

You have proven me right

[LiberalNation]

Sure, vote dem, don't work, too bad the majority have dems and the population by in large have jobs and work..........

[red states rule]

Sure, vote dem, don't work, too bad the majority have dems and the population by in large have jobs and work..........

Yet Dems run around telling us how lousy things are

95% of the population are working

Tax revenues to the government are up with tax cuts

The Dow is going back up

Yep, Dems do hate good news - screws up their talking points come election time

[LiberalNation]

and...................there's always bad too be had. When's the last time you filled your car up with gas, paid insurance, bought a gallon a milk. Inflation is real.

[red states rule]

and...................there's always bad too be had. When's the last time you filled your car up with gas, paid insurance, bought a gallon a milk. Inflation is real.

All of that this morning LN

The point is, the sky is not falling as the liberal media and Dems are saying. What happened to all the promises Dems made to get elected in 2006?

Seems since they took over Congress eveything you are whining about has gotten worse since they started running things in DC

[mundame]

I think things are really tough for most of us right now, with gas and food prices. Truth is, unless you went into a house you shouldn't have or want to sell in a down market, most of us haven't been troubled by the housing or credit crunch.


Stocks ARE doing well this week. Indeed, Ford took a 12% sales hit last month (breaking news) but its stock is rock-steady: are people not reading the news, or do they think things will recover? And I sold $150 too early this morning on LVLT, which is STILL climbing, darn its eyes. So maybe Bernanke will save Wall Street.

However, in the process the easy Fed credit and the weakening dollar is causing a LOT of inflation, and I'm worried about that. Now there, it is like the terrible Carter economy. I NEVER want to see an economy like that again; we felt really poor.

I'm also worried about credit. It's not just the problem of selling a house if you have to --- it's not getting a mortgage to buy, it's not getting home equity lines, not that we use those but a lot of people do, and credit card debt is steadily rising as people are paying mortgages with a charge card.

Bernanke is trying to save Wall Street, and so far, so good, I agree. He isn't having as much success clearing the credit crunch (and he's trying hard), however, and remember that everything he does along this line raises inflation.

And the separate issue of the weakening dollar ALSO raises inflation.



You guys weren't planning to retire on your savings, right? Because inflation eats savings for breakfast.

I realize there's this big push to equate worrying about the economy with not being patriotic, somehow, but I think that's silly. Numbers are numbers.

[mundame]

What happened to all the promises Dems made to get elected in 2006?

Seems since they took over Congress eveything you are whining about has gotten worse since they started running things in DC


Turns out a one-senator majority means gridlock in the Senate.

Which, IMO, has its pluses. I love gridlock, usually.

I don't know that they'll get their magic 60 this next election, but the Dems may pick up a few more senators.

[red states rule]

Turns out a one-senator majority means gridlock in the Senate.

Which, IMO, has its pluses. I love gridlock, usually.

I don't know that they'll get their magic 60 this next election, but the Dems may pick up a few more senators.

Point is Dems have not even presented any ideas to deal with the issues. So with a 60 vote majority, what the hell will they do?

More taxes, bigger govenrment, more social spending, government run health care?

We will go back to the econoimy we had under Pres Peanut Carter. How wil things be better?

[Kathianne]

Stocks ARE doing well this week. Indeed, Ford took a 12% sales hit last month (breaking news) but its stock is rock-steady: are people not reading the news, or do they think things will recover? And I sold $150 too early this morning on LVLT, which is STILL climbing, darn its eyes. So maybe Bernanke will save Wall Street.

However, in the process the easy Fed credit and the weakening dollar is causing a LOT of inflation, and I'm worried about that. Now there, it is like the terrible Carter economy. I NEVER want to see an economy like that again; we felt really poor.

I'm also worried about credit. It's not just the problem of selling a house if you have to --- it's not getting a mortgage to buy, it's not getting home equity lines, not that we use those but a lot of people do, and credit card debt is steadily rising as people are paying mortgages with a charge card.

Bernanke is trying to save Wall Street, and so far, so good, I agree. He isn't having as much success clearing the credit crunch (and he's trying hard), however, and remember that everything he does along this line raises inflation.

And the separate issue of the weakening dollar ALSO raises inflation.



You guys weren't planning to retire on your savings, right? Because inflation eats savings for breakfast.

I realize there's this big push to equate worrying about the economy with not being patriotic, somehow, but I think that's silly. Numbers are numbers.

As I said, most of us are finding gas and food to be difficult recently. Clothing however I'd say has not risen, perhaps even down a bit? All I know is that when I am in the mall, people are buying, A LOT!

[red states rule]

As I said, most of us are finding gas and food to be difficult recently. Clothing however I'd say has not risen, perhaps even down a bit? All I know is that when I am in the mall, people are buying, A LOT!

and the lines are long waiting to get into Red Lobster and Outback

[mundame]

Point is Dems have not even presented any ideas to deal with the issues. So with a 60 vote majority, what the hell will they do?

Pretty much whatever they want to do, RSR ------------------

That's the problem.




More taxes, bigger govenrment, more social spending, government run health care?


Sure. I assume so.



We will go back to the econoimy we had under Pres Peanut Carter. How wil things be better?

Things won't be better. But at least MAYBE they'll get us out of this stupid war; preferably both wars.

The people would elect a sensible Republican if they didn't have to fear the stupid warmonger types who want these wars to go on forever. John McCain even SAYS he wants it all to go on forever, migod, he must really have a secret wish to retire from public life. Why someone would run for president saying he's going to keep on doing all the things the public most hates, passes my understanding.

But do I think the Dems will save the economy?

Ha. http://bestsmileys.com/water/14.gif

[red states rule]

Things won't be better. But at least MAYBE they'll get us out of this stupid war; preferably both wars.

The people would elect a sensible Republican if they didn't have to fear the stupid warmonger types who want these wars to go on forever. John McCain even SAYS he wants it all to go on forever, migod, he must really have a secret wish to retire from public life. Why someone would run for president saying he's going to keep on doing all the things the public most hates, passes my understanding.

But do I think the Dems will save the economy?

Ha. http://bestsmileys.com/water/14.gif

With surrender and appeasemnt to the terorists will put us in more danger. One terrorists attack and the economy will take a huge hit

9-11 cost the US econmy $1 trillion

With the terrorists made stronger, all your other issues will beocome mute points

[mundame]

and the lines are long waiting to get into Red Lobster and Outback

That sure won't last if things go on like this.

The Wall Street Journal says restaurants are hurting the worst and the soonest.

1) People are cutting back on going out

2) Food is very high and going higher

3) They just raised the minimum wage and most restaurant employees are minimum wage.

It's a triple knock-out punch for restaurants; expect closures in your area. Lots of closures already have started.

[mundame]

With surrender and appeasemnt to the terorists will put us in more danger. One terrorists attack and the economy will take a huge hit


Same with Earth getting hit by an asteroid, or straying into bad cosmic radiation, or getting attacked by tentacled space aliens, or an epidemic of smallpox or a mystery disease that turns everyone green and slimy.

However, none of that has happened in seven years, nor has a terrorist attack, so I see no especial reason to base every decision on any of those things being about to happen.

[Hobbit]

Same with Earth getting hit by an asteroid, or straying into bad cosmic radiation, or getting attacked by tentacled space aliens, or an epidemic of smallpox or a mystery disease that turns everyone green and slimy.

However, none of that has happened in seven years, nor has a terrorist attack, so I see no especial reason to base every decision on any of those things being about to happen.

Yeah, and no Japanese fleets hit Pearl Harbor after 1941, but that was a case FOR the war, not against it.

[red states rule]

Same with Earth getting hit by an asteroid, or straying into bad cosmic radiation, or getting attacked by tentacled space aliens, or an epidemic of smallpox or a mystery disease that turns everyone green and slimy.

However, none of that has happened in seven years, nor has a terrorist attack, so I see no especial reason to base every decision on any of those things being about to happen.

And if we do get hit again, libs will scream why Pres bush did not do more to stop it. Forget the fact Dems have done everything to undermine his effrots to track, capture, imprision, and question the terrorists

[Hagbard Celine]

I am back for now. Another chemo treatment Friday morning

The point is, despite all the issues the US economy has - it GREW it the first quarter

Dems are very disappointed - they need a recession to help them with the election

Where do you get this bullsh*t? You're seriously warped man.

[red states rule]

Where do you get this bullsh*t? You're seriously warped man.

Based on fact. The liberal media acts like somebody died as they report no recession

Dems live for bad news - any good news for America is bad news for them

[Hagbard Celine]

And if we do get hit again, libs will scream why Pres bush did not do more to stop it. Forget the fact Dems have done everything to undermine his effrots to track, capture, imprision, and question the terrorists

You mean the same way Conservatives on this board have screamed that Clinton didn't do enough to stop 9/11? Give me a break with this sh*t. You've got a hard-on bigger than the World Trade Center for the Republican party and you hate Democrats so much it probably hurts you. Your blind double-standard partisanship isn't lost on me or anyone else. Everyone know's you're a crazy, traitorous radical who hates his fellow liberal Americans and that you'll say anything no matter how crazy to make your pov seem legitimate.

[red states rule]

You mean the same way Conservatives on this board have screamed that Clinton didn't do enough to stop 9/11? Give me a break with this sh*t. You've got a hard-on bigger than the World Trade Center for the Republican party and you hate Democrats so much it probably hurts you. Your blind double-standard partisanship isn't lost on me or anyone else. Everyone know's you're a crazy, traitorous radical who hates his fellow liberal Americans and that you'll say anything no matter how crazy to make your pov seem legitimate.

We had 5 terror attacks around the world (and the first WTC bombing) under Bill - and he did nothing

Dems treated terrorism as a crime and not what it is - an act of war. Karl Rove nailed it when he said Republicans saw 9-11 and knew we were at war. Liberals saw 9-11 and wanted to offer understanding and therapy to the terrorists

[Hagbard Celine]

We had 5 terror attacks around the world (and the first WTC bombing) under Bill - and he did nothing

Dems treated terrorism as a crime and not what it is - an act of war. Karl Rove nailed it when he said Republicans saw 9-11 and knew we were at war. Liberals saw 9-11 and wanted to offer understanding and therapy to the terrorists

No they didn't. That's another biased, crazy statement. Dems were just as pissed about 9/11 as Republicans were. We live here too. We want the best country we can get, just like you. over 50 percent of the population claims to have what you would call "lib" ideals. It's completely batsh*t insane for you to accuse us of being any less "American" or patriotic than you are. In-f*cking-sane.

[red states rule]

No they didn't. That's another biased, crazy statement. Dems were just as pissed about 9/11 as Republicans were. We live here too. We want the best country we can get, just like you. over 50 percent of the population claims to have what you would call "lib" ideals. It's completely batsh*t insane for you to accuse us of being any less "American" or patriotic than you are. In-f*cking-sane.

Lets see......

The Daily Kos kooks ran a petition for peace on 9-12

Elected Dems have called our troops terrorists and uneducated

Compared them to Nazi's and Pol Pot

Ted (hic) Kennedy said they were now running Saddam's torture chambers

Dems have tried to insert a surrender date in IRaq more the 41 times in spending bills

The liberal media has published classifed info that has told the terrorists how the US is tracking them and their money

Need more?

[red states rule]

Back to the thread topic

Neil Covuto nailed it a couple days ago in this


Foreclosures up 23 percent in the latest quarter.

Home prices down nearly 13 percent in the past 12 months.

Consumer confidence at a five-year low.

And a $60 video game they just can't keep on the shelves.

Thousands of eager consumers waiting in lines...in lines...to be among the first to scoop up "Grand Theft Auto IV."

A game that's become a cult.

And a fairly pricey one at that.

60 bucks a pop.

And apparently more than 10 million folks will more than happily pay it.

Because they just want to play it.

They love the graphics, they love the action, and apparently they love the controversial violence.

Even though, I suspect, many of them don't much love this economy.

Things are slowing.

They are not.

Things are bad.

But "Grand Theft Auto" sales are good.

What does a game tell us about the economy?

Not much, save maybe the possibility things aren't nearly so bad as we're told with this economy.

After all, this is a game, a discretionary purchase.

Games and discretionary purchases don't do well when we're not doing well.

Unless we're doing better than experts say we are.

The same experts who are confounded by Apple selling nearly two million iPhones last quarter and more than 10 million iPods too.

Which could explain why MasterCard had a great quarter.

Maybe we're charging this.

Or maybe, just maybe, we're just getting a charge out of this.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,353260,00.html

[red states rule]

Dems are upset ober the good economic news. For months they have been "reporting" how everything to going to hell

Now when the unemployment drops, the dollar is rising, and homes being forclosed on is only .05%; the libs still try and tell you all is doom and gloom

[NATO AIR]

I don't think its a recession but its certainly not a "good" economy persay.

My barometer is three-fold the unemployment line in my city (which is longer than ever before), the self-help office (which is longer than ever before with the people who have been on umemployment for the maximum period and are now working day by day projects whenever possible) and the prayer board at the local YMCA I attend which is packed with notes about seriously ill family members, laid off people, worried sick people about to lose their house or car, etc.

I don't see Washington or the state capitals doing much to ease this fear. I see the media peddling it a lot. I see rare bits of optimism and honesty from the candidates (like Obama rightfully calling out the gas tax holiday as a gimmick and McCain telling people the truth about jobs not coming back and the need to go back to trade school).

[red states rule]

I don't think its a recession but its certainly not a "good" economy persay.

My barometer is three-fold the unemployment line in my city (which is longer than ever before), the self-help office (which is longer than ever before with the people who have been on umemployment for the maximum period and are now working day by day projects whenever possible) and the prayer board at the local YMCA I attend which is packed with notes about seriously ill family members, laid off people, worried sick people about to lose their house or car, etc.

I don't see Washington or the state capitals doing much to ease this fear. I see the media peddling it a lot. I see rare bits of optimism and honesty from the candidates (like Obama rightfully calling out the gas tax holiday as a gimmick and McCain telling people the truth about jobs not coming back and the need to go back to trade school).



The US economy is doing fine. The Dow is back over 13,000, which means investors see a good future

All Dems want to do is jack up taxes, extend unemployment benefits (which will make people sit on the ass and not work) riase taxes on business and investments

Only 5% are late with their payments and only .05% are losing their homes

[NATO AIR]

The US economy is doing fine. The Dow is back over 13,000, which means investors see a good future

All Dems want to do is jack up taxes, extend unemployment benefits (which will make people sit on the ass and not work) riase taxes on business and investments

Only 5% are late with their payments and only .05% are losing their homes

I simply don't trust the numbers. We already know that the unemployment rate is only half the jobs picture, the "Jobless" rate is its highest in decades and that doesn't get discussed.

Fuel and food prices are going way up, wages are not. In the next 6-15 months, prices on consumer goods like electronics and clothing are going way up as well because of changes in Chinese labor laws and material prices rising to catch up with global demand.

There are far too many communities in Cali, Florida, Ohio, Georgia, Virginia, etc. that are facing enormous challenges because of the mortgage crisis and all the vacant homes, depressed tax bases, uncontrolled urban and exburban planning, etc.

What I'm essentially trying to say is that there is a middle ground on the economy, with Cavuto and co. on one side and many liberals on the other. We need to huddle in the middle, reform our financial system, support our communities that are in crisis, boost our job training programs and get ready for the first year where America is actually jacked into the global economy 100%. Its a brave new world out there and the Fed, the liberals, the president, the candidates and Wall Street don't have the answers we need.

The only great news to happen this whole year was the Treasury Department's half-decade financial reform plan which Congress, conservatives and liberals are up in arms about and won't support. It was hard look at how America could scrap, reform and combine laws and oversight to make America more competitive in the world.

Like all other major reforms attempted in the past 10 years, its dead in the water. That speaks volumes about the moral, political, intellectual and social bankruptcy of both our parties, Wall Street, Main Street, etc. We can't get things done that need to be. We won't accept painful reforms. We don't want to sacrifice.

That is disturbing on so many levels.

[red states rule]

You "don't trust the numbers"? Why is that, because they go against what you THINK is going on?

The numbers are correct or else the left would be showing proof they are worng. I work in the mortage business so I know the numbers are correct when it comes to housing

I see a few bumbs in the road, not a coming depression like some do

Dems answer is to tax the hell out of us and companies - which will drive the economy down

[bullypulpit]

Yes, well, so they do.

However, inflation may supply the bad news all by itself. Gas and food prices, notably.

*I* don't want any recession --- I want to make piles of money in the stock market going long!! (Yeah, sure, as if.) However, Warren Buffet is saying that he thinks this recession is going to be worse and longer than people think, and I have a high opinion of the thinking of the richest man in the world, so I consider myself warned.

The dollar...don't forget the dollar, which has been in free-fall since Chimpy McPresident first took office.

[red states rule]

The dollar...don't forget the dollar, which has been in free-fall since Chimpy McPresident first took office.

Hey Mr Doom and Gloomer - the dolar is going back up

Just like the Dow is back over 13.000

and the the jobless rate is back to only 5%

All this good news must depress the Hell out of you :laugh2:

[bullypulpit]

No they didn't. That's another biased, crazy statement. Dems were just as pissed about 9/11 as Republicans were. We live here too. We want the best country we can get, just like you. over 50 percent of the population claims to have what you would call "lib" ideals. It's completely batsh*t insane for you to accuse us of being any less "American" or patriotic than you are. In-f*cking-sane.

Insane...but it is typical of he and the rest of the the right wing ever since John Ashcroft told a congressional committee what amounted to <a href=http://archives.cnn.com/2001/US/12/06/inv.ashcroft.hearing/index.html>"You're either for us or for the terrorists..."</a>

[red states rule]

Insane...but it is typical of he and the rest of the the right wing ever since John Ashcroft told a congressional committee what amounted to <a href=http://archives.cnn.com/2001/US/12/06/inv.ashcroft.hearing/index.html>"You're either for us or for the terrorists..."</a>

Truth does hurt when it is pointed out to the left. The liberal media was telling us we were in a recession, if not a depression. Now that the economic news comes out showing they were wrong, they spin - and go out and find "victims"

I rememebr well how Dicky Gephardt sneered how every 100 points off the Dow was another Dem pick up in the House

[bullypulpit]

Hey Mr Doom and Gloomer - the dolar is going back up

Just like the Dow is back over 13.000

and the the jobless rate is back to only 5%

All this good news must depress the Hell out of you :laugh2:

<a href=http://www.reuters.com/article/hotStocksNews/idUSN2849823320080129>Mortgage foreclosure rates</a> continue to climb and the number of <a href=http://www.madeinusanews.com/content/view/444/98/>properties abandoned</a> by owners who could no longer afford the mortgage payments, and banks who can't unload the properties its highest rate since they started recording that statistic in 1956.

But don't let a little reality get in your way.

[red states rule]

<a href=http://www.reuters.com/article/hotStocksNews/idUSN2849823320080129>Mortgage foreclosure rates</a> continue to climb and the number of <a href=http://www.madeinusanews.com/content/view/444/98/>properties abandoned</a> by owners who could no longer afford the mortgage payments, and banks who can't unload the properties its highest rate since they started recording that statistic in 1956.

But don't let a little reality get in your way.

Once again Mr Doom and Gloomer the rate of foreclosres is only .05%

Or do the real numbers upset you?

[stang56k]

The liberal media and Democrats have been screaming how the sky is falling when it come to the US economy

Turns out the US economy grew in the first quarter, and the doom and gloomers are pissed the the economy is not is a recession


Economy grows by only 0.6 percent in first quarter

By JEANNINE AVERSA, AP Economics Writer
Wed Apr 30, 4:53 PM ET

WASHINGTON - The bruised economy limped through the first quarter, growing at just a 0.6 percent pace as housing and credit problems forced people and businesses alike to hunker down.

The country's economic growth during January through March was the same as in the final three months of last year, the Commerce Department reported Wednesday. The statistic did not meet what economists consider a definition of a recession — which is a contraction of the economy. This means that although the economy is stuck in a rut, it is still managing to grow, even if slightly.

Many analysts were predicting the gross domestic product (GDP) would weaken a bit more — to a pace of just 0.5 percent — in the first quarter. Earlier this year, some thought the economy would actually lurch into reverse during the opening quarter. Now, they say they believe that will likely happen during the current April-to-June period.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080430/ap_on_bi_go_ec_fi/economy;_ylt=Aq7JQSbF3XWubVB0PbIEPBus0NUE


you ,my friend, know nothing!


From Silicon Alley Insider, May 1, 2008:

The recession-deniers were out in force yesterday after the "better-than-expected!" GDP figures came out: See? The economy GREW in Q1! We aren't in a recession! All that horrendous economic and housing data is just media hysteria!

Here's what they didn't tell you:

First, those are just preliminary numbers. Hold the champagne until the several rounds of revisions are out.

Second, 0.6% growth is horrible, especially when you consider that the population is growing at least 1%. On a per-capita basis, GDP was down.

Third, as the NY Post's John Crudele explains, the much ballyhooed "growth" was the product of three key inputs, none of which is a sign of consumer recovery (and one of which is absurd):

* Government spending (deficits),
* Inventory growth (companies buying stuff to put on shelves), and, most important,
* A 2.6% inflation assumption

Get that? To calculate that the economy grew 0.6%, the government had to assume that inflation was only 2.6%. Anyone out there who buys gas or food occasionally think that inflation is only 2.6%? Didn't think so.

Move that inflation assumption up to even 4%, says John Crudele, and GDP in Q1 was down. For the second quarter in a row. Which makes this an official recession. As if we didn't know that already.

:coffee:

[red states rule]

I know thre liberal media and the kook left are sad over the fact the US economy is not in a recession

Your reaction proves that

How does the liberal media react?

AP Disgrace: 'Bruised Economy Grows by Only 0.6 Percent'
By Noel Sheppard | April 30, 2008 - 09:47 ET

The Associated Press's Jeannine Aversa really should change her writing focus, because economics is clearly not her specialty.

After telling readers in March that "Dangerous cracks in the nation's job market" are "ominous signs that the country is falling toward a recession or has already toppled into one," Aversa had the gall to report Wednesday, "The bruised economy limped through the first quarter of this year at a six-tenths of a percentage point growth rate as housing and credit problems forced people and businesses alike to hunker down."

Are you joking? You, your wire service, and virtually every media outlet in the nation have been telling Americans that we're already in a recession. A government report comes out saying that we're not, and this is how you begin your article covering the surprising announcement?

The country's economic growth during January through March was the same as in the final three months of last year, the Commerce Department reported Wednesday — but not the kind of statistic that economists define as a recession. Although the economy is stuck in a rut, it is still managing to keep growing — however slightly.

Rather than being contrite, Aversa seems disappointed, don't you agree?

As this is the first report from the AP, it will be interesting to see how lengthier editions later in the day, as well as tonight's network news broadcasts and tomorrow's print media, will cover this surprising announcement.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2008/04/30/ap-disgrace-bruised-economy-grows-only-0-6-percent

[NATO AIR]

You "don't trust the numbers"? Why is that, because they go against what you THINK is going on?

The numbers are correct or else the left would be showing proof they are worng. I work in the mortage business so I know the numbers are correct when it comes to housing

I see a few bumbs in the road, not a coming depression like some do

Dems answer is to tax the hell out of us and companies - which will drive the economy down

Because the numbers are misleading and used to fit an agenda. They're not telling the whole story.

You pathetically say the dollar is rising... is it rising anywhere near its previous levels? No. If so, American exports would be slipping dramatically and various resource suppliers like the Saudis wouldn't be nervously eyeing the euro and yen.

That's great about the national foreclosure rate, how about by cities and communities? I'm not persay saying America is in crisis but a good deal of America is, whether in red or blue states, cities or exburbs.

If you're in the mortgage business, you should know this first had as some of the companies in your industry and individuals in your industry were part of the problem here. They dumped their rules in favor of making ever more profit, damn the consequences. (The Royal Bank of Scotland admitted this in their own report on what happened in the past few months, and others like Wachovia & Bank Of America have admitted their risk analysis/management was deeply flawed).

Now granted, a .6% increase is an increase, so it must be good... or is it? Compared to prior economic numbers over the past few years, this is anemic and distresses people. That does not mean its the end of the world but it certainly does mean that something is amiss and we're not going at the pace we were, which further inflames the global situation because a US slowdown causes a slowdown in other places, which don't quite have the margin of error we have nor the social safety net we have.

Wow, people bought a $60 game by the millions? That's supposed to be a sign of a healthy economy and consumer confidence? Gimme a break!

How about the price of gas, milk, eggs, bread, fruit, flour, rice, etc doubling or more in the past 6 months? That's a far better sign of the kinds of fears Americans are having and why and how they are feeling about the economy.

I am the first to say the media has hyped this, even the conservative bastions like the WSJ. Drama and doubt sells better than hope and success.

Nevertheless, when commodities prices are going up like this (and likely to say up for years to come), people are feeling real-world evidence of something being amiss and rather than understanding the global complexity of what's happening, they fall in line with the media and elite narratives of recession.

Even worse, for those who live in communities hard-hit by the foreclosure and mortgage crisis, the evidence is right before their eyes (or so they think) as they watch abandoned houses and even neighborhoods unfold. The trickle effect hits businesses, schools and city and county tax bases just as hard. Further proof "something is amiss".

Blindly cheerleading as you do is the equivalent of irresponsibility as bad as the liberals claiming its the end of the world as we know it and we're headed towards the Great Depression.


The middle ground once again, its a place surrounded by facts and reality. Not so pleasant, not so horrible. Then again, not so crowded either as people tend to head to the opposing poles.

[stang56k]

I know thre liberal media and the kook left are sad over the fact the US economy is not in a recession

Your reaction proves that

How does the liberal media react?

AP Disgrace: 'Bruised Economy Grows by Only 0.6 Percent'
By Noel Sheppard | April 30, 2008 - 09:47 ET

The Associated Press's Jeannine Aversa really should change her writing focus, because economics is clearly not her specialty.

After telling readers in March that "Dangerous cracks in the nation's job market" are "ominous signs that the country is falling toward a recession or has already toppled into one," Aversa had the gall to report Wednesday, "The bruised economy limped through the first quarter of this year at a six-tenths of a percentage point growth rate as housing and credit problems forced people and businesses alike to hunker down."

Are you joking? You, your wire service, and virtually every media outlet in the nation have been telling Americans that we're already in a recession. A government report comes out saying that we're not, and this is how you begin your article covering the surprising announcement?

The country's economic growth during January through March was the same as in the final three months of last year, the Commerce Department reported Wednesday — but not the kind of statistic that economists define as a recession. Although the economy is stuck in a rut, it is still managing to keep growing — however slightly.

Rather than being contrite, Aversa seems disappointed, don't you agree?

As this is the first report from the AP, it will be interesting to see how lengthier editions later in the day, as well as tonight's network news broadcasts and tomorrow's print media, will cover this surprising announcement.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2008/04/30/ap-disgrace-bruised-economy-grows-only-0-6-percent

Live in delusion then... Lets all blame each other so that nothing EVER gets done with the very fuckin seriously problem that our economy is dying. Sitting here just arguing that its liberal propaganda is not the issue. But if and when the economy does die, the America and the world will not be the same, liberal conservative what ever stupid label you put on someone will be effected. tremendously. So lets sit there and blame the problem instead of trying to fix it... Ohh ya thats what politics in America has become, a big point the finger game, I forgot what a dummy I am.

[red states rule]

OMG, nommatter waht the numbrs ay, the doom and gloomers still keep going on with their sky is falling tlaking points

When the market tanked after 9-11 the left balmed Pres Bush

Now it is back over 13,000 they do not give him any credit

I also rememebr many years ago the same people who are blaming us for the mess, were telling us our credit requirement to were strict

Nobody held a gun to any buyers head and forced them to buy a home. One of the major reasons peole default is not due to the interest rate but to rising taxes and h/o ins when they have an escrow acccount. It cause a wild fluctions in their montly pamyments

Do you happen to know what states have the highest (and insane leverl of taxes)?

CA, MI, NY, and NJ

States run by tax crazy Dems

The saftey net you speak of has become a King sized bed thatnks to the left, and their cradel to grave programs

[red states rule]

Live in delusion then... Lets all blame each other so that nothing EVER gets done with the very fuckin seriously problem that our economy is dying. Sitting here just arguing that its liberal propaganda is not the issue. But if and when the economy does die, the America and the world will not be the same, liberal conservative what ever stupid label you put on someone will be effected. tremendously. So lets sit there and blame the problem instead of trying to fix it... Ohh ya thats what politics in America has become, a big point the finger game, I forgot what a dummy I am.

The left NEVER wants to sove problems, they would rather have the issue

Classic example if the libs "War on Poverty." 40 years and $9 trillion later, we are told all we have to do is pay more in taxes and they can get rid of poverty

If we pointout how their war has been a total and complete failure, the libs replies with their usual insults on how we are meanspirited, cheap, and heartless

[NATO AIR]

The left NEVER wants to sove problems, they would rather have the issue

Classic example if the libs "War on Poverty." 40 years and $9 trillion later, we are told all we have to do is pay more in taxes and they can get rid of poverty

If we pointout how their war has been a total and complete failure, the libs replies with their usual insults on how we are meanspirited, cheap, and heartless

You are part of the problem with this insane "its the left's fault" always crap.

There were some honest voices on the left and the right talking about this subprime nonsense for years warning the government, the market and the people about what would happen when this disgraceful runaway greed at all costs came to a head with reality.

By my count, there were something like 40 odd state attorney generals (many of them Republicans) and governors who did their best to limit the fallout in the past few years with no assistance whatsoever from the federal government, the Democrat Congress or the GOP Congress.

Meanwhile, the politicians in general still don't address the deep problems wit our society and our economic system. They're not out there pouring billions into our workers for new or expanded training, they're pouring billions into Wall Street and corporate welfare for airlines, Big Ag, Bear Stearns/JP Morgan, the defense contractors, sports leagues, etc.

They're standing in the way of vital reform of the financial sector and our laws and structures that would make the American economy and worker more competitive with the world. They're endangering the global free trade system with excess greed (like the subsidy ridden CAFTA which rips off Central American countries and pouring hundreds of subsidies and corporate give aways in the Colombia free trade deal) and excess politics devolving into fear mongering (the Mexicans are taking your job! The Chinese and Indians are destroying America!).

I could give a damn what the left or the right say about this. I care about America and Americans. The politicians like Bush, McCain,Edwards,Romney, Obama, Clinton, etc. have forgotten that. So has the media, everybody from Dobbs to Cavuto to Olbermann to O'Reilly. They all have agendas to push that have nothing to do with empowering Americans to compete in the new world economy and in defending this country from the great perils that we face.

[stang56k]

OMG, nommatter waht the numbrs ay, the doom and gloomers still keep going on with their sky is falling tlaking points

When the market tanked after 9-11 the left balmed Pres Bush

Now it is back over 13,000 they do not give him any credit

I also rememebr many years ago the same people who are blaming us for the mess, were telling us our credit requirement to were strict

Nobody held a gun to any buyers head and forced them to buy a home. One of the major reasons peole default is not due to the interest rate but to rising taxes and h/o ins when they have an escrow acccount. It cause a wild fluctions in their montly pamyments

Do you happen to know what states have the highest (and insane leverl of taxes)?

CA, MI, NY, and NJ

States run by tax crazy Dems

The saftey net you speak of has become a King sized bed thatnks to the left, and their cradel to grave programs

Your basing off the stock market lol? The stock market is just fickle mechanism that sways in the wind of the day... The only reason the Stock Market is up is because the Feds have injected it with billions of dollars via dropping the interest rates and creating more money. Meanwhile the stock market is doing alright, which is an illusion, the dollar is coming down which if you take that in account the stock market being 13000 in all actually is really much lower due to the dollars value. Hense the illusion. The real facts lie in activity of the dollar, inflation, GDP and net to debt ratios. The facts will tell you is not looking to good sir.

The economy is on life support.

BTW Iran just switch using the dollar as its trading currency , The 2nd largest OPEC exporter... Its just a matter of time before the other OPEC countries are tired of loosing money on a failing dollar and they switch. Which is the crux of which our economy is based on.

[red states rule]

So are you saying the lefts war on poverty has been a success?

All liberals come up with to solve any issue is to throw more money at the problem - of course each year they demand MORE money no matter how much of a failure the program turns out to be

[red states rule]

Your basing off the stock market lol? The stock market is just fickle mechanism that sways in the wind of the day... The only reason the Stock Market is up is because the Feds have injected it with billions of dollars via dropping the interest rates and creating more money. Meanwhile the stock market is doing alright, which is an illusion, the dollar is coming down which if you take that in account the stock market being 13000 in all actually is really much lower due to the dollars value. Hense the illusion. The real facts lie in activity of the dollar, inflation, GDP and net to debt ratios. The facts will tell you is not looking to good sir.

The economy is on life support.

BTW Iran just switch using the dollar as its trading currency , The 2nd largest OPEC exporter... Its just a matter of time before the other OPEC countries are tired of loosing money on a failing dollar and they switch. Which is the crux of which our economy is based on.


The Dow is an indication of the future. It is very possible we have hit the bottom of this business cycle and now we will start going back off

You must not work or have a 401K - then you would not be so dismissive of of the stock market

[stang56k]

The Dow is an indication of the future. It is very possible we have hit the bottom of this business cycle and now we will start going back off

You must not work or have a 401K - then you would not be so dismissive of of the stock market

Thats why any little tid bit of information will change it in ether direction in moments? I see the stock market as a PMS'ing chick.

[red states rule]

Thats why any little tid bit of information will change it in ether direction in moments? I see the stock market as a PMS'ing chick.

and I see you as totaly uneducated in Economics

Which means you are the perfect person to fall for the Dems and liberal media's doom and gloom plot lines

The last thing the Dems want are informed and educated voters

[stang56k]

and I see you as totally uneducated in Economics

Which means you are the perfect person to fall for the Dems and liberal media's doom and gloom plot lines

The last thing the Dems want are informed and educated voters

LOL...First off I don't fall into the whole labeling concept of rebuplicrates and democains... liberal, conservative its all bullshit. I see shit for what it is...Labeling is a divide and conquer mechanism in my opinion to keep everyone separated because the powers fear that...like i said my opinion.

Give me some proof other than... OMG dAmn liBeRals are mAkin shIt up again OMg!!!!!

Inflation is going rampant , Dollar is falling, and the credit/mortgage crisis is out of hand. Give me some proof this is just folly made up fair tail of the liberals agenda to screw over the conservatives *rolls eyes* please. I would like this to all be a joke just as bad as the next person.

[red states rule]

LOL...First off I don't fall into the whole labeling concept of rebuplicrates and democains... liberal, conservative its all bullshit. I see shit for what it is...Labeling is a divide and conquer mechanism in my opinion to keep everyone separated because the powers fear that...like i said my opinion.

Give me some proof other than... OMG dAmn liBeRals are mAkin shIt up again OMg!!!!!

Inflation is going rampant , Dollar is falling, and the credit/mortgage crisis is out of hand. Give me some proof this is just folly made up fair tail of the liberals agenda to screw over the conservatives *rolls eyes* please. I would like this to all be a joke just as bad as the next person.

The current economic numbers do not support your doom and gloom rants

As I have pointed out many times

[Said1]

Y The real facts lie in activity of the dollar, inflation, GDP and net to debt ratios. The facts will tell you is not looking to good sir.

What do the numbers look like?



BTW Iran just switch using the dollar as its trading currency , The 2nd largest OPEC exporter... Its just a matter of time before the other OPEC countries are tired of loosing money on a failing dollar and they switch. Which is the crux of which our economy is based on.

What's replacing the dollar?

[red states rule]

Another example of how the libral media loves taxes, and how despite how they "report" people suffering from high gas prices - government must never go without


Alter Suggests Only 'Stupid' Voters Want Gas Tax Cut
By Brad Wilmouth | May 3, 2008 - 15:12 ET

On Friday's Countdown show, MSNBC analyst Jonathan Alter, also of Newsweek, suggested that voters who support Hillary Clinton's call for a temporary suspension of the federal gasoline tax are "stupid" as he contended that the Clinton campaign team are "assuming that people are too stupid to realize that this is a bad idea that won't save them any money at the pump." Alter later argued that the tax cut strategy may end up succeeding politically for Clinton because "there are a lot of what are called 'low information' voters" who are "not reading the unanimous, unanimous newspaper editorials against this. They're not talking to the environmentalists, the economists, everybody who unanimously believes this is a bad idea. They're, you know, understandably struggling, and at the pump, they're paying a lot for gas, and they want some relief." (Transcript follows)

Host Keith Olbermann introduced the segment with a clip of Clinton arguing that members of Congress should declare themselves as either "with us or against us when it comes to taking on the oil companies." The MSNBC host seemed rankled at her use of the "with us or against us" phrase as he relayed Barack Obama's charge that her plan was ripped off from Republicans. Olbermann: "Senator Obama not alone in believing that that phrase, "with us or against us," had been borrowed from President Bush, as he claimed today. The Illinois Democrat again pointing out that Senator Clinton's gas tax plan already seems to have some friends on Capitol Hill." Obama referred to John McCain's support for the gas tax cut in a soundbite.

Notably, Olbermann did not take note of the fact that Senator Clinton had already used the term "with us or against us" referring to the war on terrorism after the 9/11 attacks, even before President Bush used the term as he sought the united the world against Osama bin Laden and the Taliban.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/brad-wilmouth/2008/05/03/alter-suggests-only-stupid-voters-want-gas-tax-cut

[stang56k]

The current economic numbers do not support your doom and gloom rants

As I have pointed out many times

Before your dumb ass gives me bad rep why don't you look at the big picture here for a second if your attention span is able to compute....Cool the Dollar went up for a few days and the stock market had a day of gains, is that relevant in the big scheme of things...no.


Tax payers 59 Trillion dollar obligation.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2007-05-28-federal-budget_N.htm?csp=34

Infaltion 4% highest its been in 11 years...

http://inflationdata.com/Inflation/Inflation_Rate/HistoricalInflation.aspx

US dollar the since 06

http://quotes.ino.com/chart/?s=NYBOT_DX&v=dmax

Purchasing power of the Dollar....

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f288/stang56k/zyv034.gif

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China moving money out of T bonds
http://www.naturalnews.com/023005.html

Trillion dollar mortgage time bomb

http://money.cnn.com/2008/04/21/news/economy/fannie_freddie/index.htm

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This is a fraction of the problems....

[stang56k]

What do the numbers look like?




What's replacing the dollar?

Euro and Yen.. heres is the article

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2008-04/30/content_8083804.htm

[red states rule]

You can't say we are in a recession before the numbers are in.

I would really like to know what it would take for you to accept we are in recession conditions. - Two consecutive quarters of negative growth, the same definition we have been using for 30 years.

We are in a period of slow economic growth, NOT a recession. If you don't like the definition of recession then change it, but until then it IS the definition of a recession.

You can't change how a recession is defined just because it helps your position.

The democrats have been in charge for the past two years? Not my concern, I'm doing just fine.

Why are you so miserable?

[stang56k]

you ,my friend, know nothing!


From Silicon Alley Insider, May 1, 2008:

The recession-deniers were out in force yesterday after the "better-than-expected!" GDP figures came out: See? The economy GREW in Q1! We aren't in a recession! All that horrendous economic and housing data is just media hysteria!

Here's what they didn't tell you:

First, those are just preliminary numbers. Hold the champagne until the several rounds of revisions are out.

Second, 0.6% growth is horrible, especially when you consider that the population is growing at least 1%. On a per-capita basis, GDP was down.

Third, as the NY Post's John Crudele explains, the much ballyhooed "growth" was the product of three key inputs, none of which is a sign of consumer recovery (and one of which is absurd):

* Government spending (deficits),
* Inventory growth (companies buying stuff to put on shelves), and, most important,
* A 2.6% inflation assumption

Get that? To calculate that the economy grew 0.6%, the government had to assume that inflation was only 2.6%. Anyone out there who buys gas or food occasionally think that inflation is only 2.6%? Didn't think so.

Move that inflation assumption up to even 4%, says John Crudele, and GDP in Q1 was down. For the second quarter in a row. Which makes this an official recession. As if we didn't know that already.

:coffee:

Your Attention span is acute. Did I say we were in a rescission all I did was say that information was not accurate and posted this article before you went on your dem lib hating rant.

[red states rule]

Your Attention span is acute. Did I say we were in a rescission all I did was say that information was not accurate and posted this article before you went on your dem lib hating rant.

The only recession that exists, is the false recession everyone wants to believe is a recession because it serves their political agenda.

Those who hate Bush, falsely claim that a recession exists, because they have been convinced it is so by those Politicians whom now occupy the Majority in the Congress.

Another case of 'constantly repeating a known lie, until it eventually becomes the truth', on the lips of everyone who isn't intelligent enough to Know the Difference.

Many of us are still waiting for Nancy Pelosi, and the rest of the Majority in Congress to show, and tell us what their Plan was, prior to the 2006 elections, when they said, and bragged about having a solution to the oil/gas price problems.

Almost two years have passed, and STILL....Nothing from the Phony Democrat Majority who promised change, and has yet to provide, or comply with the Promises that won them the election.

So, if there is a Ressesion in any way. It does exist between the ears of Every Democrat Politician that now; happily plays their usual games with the American people who foolishly swallowed all of their lies.

[stang56k]

The only recession that exists, is the false recession everyone wants to believe is a recession because it serves their political agenda.

Those who hate Bush, falsely claim that a recession exists, because they have been convinced it is so by those Politicians whom now occupy the Majority in the Congress.

Another case of 'constantly repeating a known lie, until it eventually becomes the truth', on the lips of everyone who isn't intelligent enough to Know the Difference.

Many of us are still waiting for Nancy Pelosi, and the rest of the Majority in Congress to show, and tell us what their Plan was, prior to the 2006 elections, when they said, and bragged about having a solution to the oil/gas price problems.

Almost two years have passed, and STILL....Nothing from the Phony Democrat Majority who promised change, and has yet to provide, or comply with the Promises that won them the election.

So, if there is a Ressesion in any way. It does exist between the ears of Every Democrat Politician that now; happily plays their usual games with the American people who foolishly swallowed all of their lies.

Your eluding the facts by incorporating politics in the matter...I don't give a fuck about democrats or republicans and can careless about them. I do care about the fact still stands there might be bleak times ahead if none of these assholes do anything about it.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24127314/

[red states rule]

Your eluding the facts by incorporating politics in the matter...I don't give a fuck about democrats or republicans and can careless about them. I do care about the fact still stands there might be bleak times ahead if none of these assholes do anything about it.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24127314/

I am well aware facts confuse and anger liberals and the Bush haters

Here are more facts to gurther drive you up your padded wall

Actually, the unemployment rate both rose and dropped under every administration; but you must be talking about the total change from the time they entered to the time they left.

So of course, you're just looking at two points in time - when the President entered office and when he left - and drawing a conclusion.

If you look at the charts, you'll see that the unemployment rate did indeed drop after Kennedy got taxes cut - dropped like a rock - and then started going up again after Nixon took office. But that only lasted a year, and then it started dropping again. Then when Nixon resigned, it started going up again, quickly, and again within a year headed downward during Ford's administration.

Carter took office, and the rate continued to drop for two years, but then they started rising again, and continued to rise not only for the rest of Carter's administration, but into the first two years of Reagan's.

The first contradiction of what you said: Carter entered office with a dropping unemployment rate at 7.5%; and left office with a rising unemployment rate, also at 7.5%. That's not a drop.

Then the rate dropped again two years after Reagan took office - faster and further than they'd dropped under Kennedy, and continued dropping for the rest of Reagan's administration.

And here we have a second direct contradiction of what you said - as Reagan entered office with a 7.5% unemployment rate, and left office with 5.4%. That's not a rise; it's a drop.

Then GHWBush took office, and the rate increased, but peaked in June of 92 and started dropping again. Then Clinton took office and the rate continued to drop until the tail end of his administration, when it went up from its nadir of 3.9% to 4.2% before GW took office. That trend continued through June of 2003 (peaking at 6.3%), then the rate started dropping again, and continued to drop until March of 2007. Since then it has increased only 0.7% over it's low of 4.4%, and is currently still at only 5.1%.

As for recessions, there were actually two under Truman - one in 1945, and one from 1948 to 1949; and there was also one under Carter in 1980. He's a Democrat.

But hey - don't let the facts confuse you.

[stang56k]

I am well aware facts confuse and anger liberals and the Bush haters

Here are more facts to gurther drive you up your padded wall

Actually, the unemployment rate both rose and dropped under every administration; but you must be talking about the total change from the time they entered to the time they left.

So of course, you're just looking at two points in time - when the President entered office and when he left - and drawing a conclusion.

If you look at the charts, you'll see that the unemployment rate did indeed drop after Kennedy got taxes cut - dropped like a rock - and then started going up again after Nixon took office. But that only lasted a year, and then it started dropping again. Then when Nixon resigned, it started going up again, quickly, and again within a year headed downward during Ford's administration.

Carter took office, and the rate continued to drop for two years, but then they started rising again, and continued to rise not only for the rest of Carter's administration, but into the first two years of Reagan's.

The first contradiction of what you said: Carter entered office with a dropping unemployment rate at 7.5%; and left office with a rising unemployment rate, also at 7.5%. That's not a drop.

Then the rate dropped again two years after Reagan took office - faster and further than they'd dropped under Kennedy, and continued dropping for the rest of Reagan's administration.

And here we have a second direct contradiction of what you said - as Reagan entered office with a 7.5% unemployment rate, and left office with 5.4%. That's not a rise; it's a drop.

Then GHWBush took office, and the rate increased, but peaked in June of 92 and started dropping again. Then Clinton took office and the rate continued to drop until the tail end of his administration, when it went up from its nadir of 3.9% to 4.2% before GW took office. That trend continued through June of 2003 (peaking at 6.3%), then the rate started dropping again, and continued to drop until March of 2007. Since then it has increased only 0.7% over it's low of 4.4%, and is currently still at only 5.1%.

As for recessions, there were actually two under Truman - one in 1945, and one from 1948 to 1949; and there was also one under Carter in 1980. He's a Democrat.

But hey - don't let the facts confuse you.

Again, incorporating politics into an utterly useless string of facts. Trying to prove which parties President had lower unemployment rate has nothing to do with the current state of the economy... Flaming liberals and democrats doesn't make your argument any more prudent lol and its not hurting my feelings be any means considering i'm not ether and never claimed to be one. :clap:

[red states rule]

Again, incorporating politics into an utterly useless string of facts. Trying to prove which parties President had lower unemployment rate has nothing to do with the current state of the economy... Flaming liberals and democrats doesn't make your argument any more prudent lol and its not hurting my feelings be any means considering i'm not ether and never claimed to be one. :clap:

We are NOT in a recession no matter how much the liberal democrats want to think so. In addition the unemployment rate is a mere 5%. Yep, do the math, that's 95% of Americans are working.

Let the good times roll.

Democrats are sad little people and I pity them. I'd send them a Vermont Teddy-Gram to cheer them up but it would do no good at all.

[stang56k]

We are NOT in a recession no matter how much the liberal democrats want to think so. In addition the unemployment rate is a mere 5%. Yep, do the math, that's 95% of Americans are working.

Let the good times roll.

Democrats are sad little people and I pity them. I'd send them a Vermont Teddy-Gram to cheer them up but it would do no good at all.

At least we agree that democrats are repulsive. :coffee:

[red states rule]

At least we agree that democrats are repulsive. :coffee:

Maybe you can return to the real world and admit we are not in a recession

Many feel we have hit the bottom of the slow down and things will start to improve

That is the worst news the left and Bush haters can get

[Said1]

Euro and Yen.. heres is the article

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2008-04/30/content_8083804.htm

According to the article (I hope that isn't the 'best' one out there) they haven't totally stopped, nor have they committed to a date when they will. It simply states that they will use the Yen when trading in Asia, the Euro when trading with Europe and 'other' currencies.

And, I must have missed your analysis regarding present GDP, net debt ratios and inflation numbers telling the real story. Also, could you explain exactly how any positive growth measures are not relfective of DJIA growth - since that seems to be your position. And, in your analysis, please differentiate between real GDP and nominal GDP meaures and their relation to above measures. My understanding of economics is rudimentary at best, your independent commentary would help tremendously. Thanks.

[stang56k]

Maybe you can return to the real world and admit we are not in a recession

Many feel we have hit the bottom of the slow down and things will start to improve

That is the worst news the left and Bush haters can get

As I said before, I hope your right, only time will tell...Why the hell would I or anyone else want the economy to go to ruins? That is my number one concern, we loose our economic strength we become just another substandard country...

[red states rule]

As I said before, I hope your right, only time will tell...Why the hell would I or anyone else want the economy to go to ruins? That is my number one concern, we loose our economic strength we become just another substandard country...

Dems want it to win votes

[stang56k]

According to the article (I hope that isn't the 'best' one out there) they haven't totally stopped, nor have they committed to a date when they will. It simply states that they will use the Yen when trading in Asia, the Euro when trading with Europe and 'other' currencies.

And, I must have missed your analysis regarding present GDP, net debt ratios and inflation numbers telling the real story. Also, could you explain exactly how any positive growth measures are not relfective of DJIA growth - since that seems to be your position. And, in your analysis, please differentiate between real GDP and nominal GDP meaures and their relation to above measures. My understanding of economics is rudimentary at best, your independent commentary would help tremendously. Thanks.

TEHRAN, April 30 (Xinhua) -- Iran had totally removed U.S. dollars in the country's oil transactions, an Oil Ministry official said on Wednesday.

As far as the GDP, I am no official expert. I was just adding to this thread about the .6% gain which was just an initial report using an arbitrary 2.6 inflation rate to determine and its not final. More reports are to follow with the accurate inflation growth which COULD swing it into negatives which at that point we will officially be in a recession as the article I posted says. As far as the DJIA its directly connected to the value of the dollar and inflation just because the dow is up doesn't mean anything if the dollar is going down and inflation going up. DOW is not and indicator of the overall economy as it is more of an individual companies. For instance the inflation rate in Zimbabwe is 12,000% and the stock market is around 76,000,000.

[stang56k]

Dems want it to win votes

Because, then they can pump money into social programs? Thats the last fuckin thing we need at the moment lol.

[red states rule]

Because, then they can pump money into social programs? Thats the last fuckin thing we need at the moment lol.

Look at what Hillary and Obam are promising

Trillions in new taxes and over $800 billion in new spending

Pretty much what the Pelosi/Reid Congress wants to do

[stang56k]

Look at what Hillary and Obam are promising

Trillions in new taxes and over $800 billion in new spending

Pretty much what the Pelosi/Reid Congress wants to do

I loath democrats because they are useless catering tools. As far as republicans
I am HIGHLY critical of them because it seems they are the only ones that do anything regarding... well anything...so if any mistakes are made or bad policies its usually republicans just by the nature of the beast. At least thats my political observation.

[red states rule]

I loath democrats because they are useless catering tools. As far as republicans
I am HIGHLY critical of them because it seems they are the only ones that do anything regarding... well anything...so if any mistakes are made or bad policies its usually republicans just by the nature of the beast. At least thats my political observation.

Newsflash for you

Dems have been running things for a year and a half. In that time they have accomplished nothing

Of course you will still blame Pres Bush for it since it seems to be in your blood

[Said1]

TEHRAN, April 30 (Xinhua) -- Iran had totally removed U.S. dollars in the country's oil transactions, an Oil Ministry official said on Wednesday.

from the same article: Nozari was then quoted as saying. Right now it's not clear why there seems to be a contradiction between comments by the two officials over the exact time to stop dollars in Iran's oil trade'

and

'Iran has vowed to decrease the greenback in its foreign trade.'

Probably not the best source to support your arguement, although Iran is also not only country trading in other currencies.




As far as the GDP, I am no official expert. I was just adding to this thread about the .6% gain which was just an initial report using an arbitrary 2.6 inflation rate to determine and its not final. More reports are to follow with the accurate inflation growth which COULD swing it into negatives which at that point we will officially be in a recession as the article I posted says. As far as the DJIA its directly connected to the value of the dollar and inflation just because the dow is up doesn't mean anything if the dollar is going down and inflation going up. DOW is not and indicator of the overall economy as it is more of an individual companies. For instance the inflation rate in Zimbabwe is 12,000% and the stock market is around 76,000,000.

The DJIA is an overall measure of multiple firms put together - an average. The GDP is national measure of the final value of the goods and services they produce. Nominal measures do not specify how much of the difference is from changes in the price level. Real values do the opposite. These distinctions are important to your arguments, given that a firms productivity or the value of their final products/services are often reflected in their stock value. Or is it the other way around? I'm really just guessing, I have no idea - i lost my train of thought when the pizza guy showed up! :O

[LuvRPgrl]

Where do you get this bullsh*t? You're seriously warped man.

POT

KETTLE

BLACK

[LuvRPgrl]

The economy always has to go in cycles.

We will come out of this phase.

The bottom line is we need to keep production of goods to continue. We have the technology to create them faster and better than ever. The competetion still cant do it better than us.

The US still stands out as the country of opportunity, thus the entrepeneurs SP? are still attracted to come here more than anywhere else.

[red states rule]

The economy always has to go in cycles.

We will come out of this phase.

The bottom line is we need to keep production of goods to continue. We have the technology to create them faster and better than ever. The competetion still cant do it better than us.

The US still stands out as the country of opportunity, thus the entrepeneurs SP? are still attracted to come here more than anywhere else.

and how do Dems want to help thosout of work find work?

By extending unemployment benefits? Yep, that will encourage them to go out a find a job

[LuvRPgrl]

and how do Dems want to help thosout of work find work?

By extending unemployment benefits? Yep, that will encourage them to go out a find a job

Its actually pretty funny listening to the dems try to make America sound like we are in such trouble.

They bring up things like, how we are so divided on issues, etc, etc. which is basically meaningless tripe. THats all they have to offer, which is why the emptly tripe Obama bin laden spews on the campaign trail is so effective. Its no wonder that his biggest supporters are young people, they have no clue of what reality is like yet.

[red states rule]

Its actually pretty funny listening to the dems try to make America sound like we are in such trouble.

They bring up things like, how we are so divided on issues, etc, etc. which is basically meaningless tripe. THats all they have to offer, which is why the emptly tripe Obama bin laden spews on the campaign trail is so effective. Its no wonder that his biggest supporters are young people, they have no clue of what reality is like yet.

As Rush Limbaugh correctly points out, the kids have minds full of mush

[stang56k]

As Rush Limbaugh correctly points out, the kids have minds full of mush

Well i'm only 23, but you are right 99% of the people my age and below are just looking for the next beer, high and fuck. Nothing else matters.

[LuvRPgrl]

Well i'm only 23, but you are right 99% of the people my age and below are just looking for the next beer, high and fuck. Nothing else matters.

Well, they are just overly idealistic. And good for them. They dont have enough life experience yet, reality beats the idealism out of you. The best thing is to not get too cynical, yet not remain too idealistic.

Most, if not virtually all of the posistions liberals take are nobel, but simply dont work in reality.

COmmunism as an economic policy, is good in theory,

as is welfare

as is affirmative action

as is "war is never the answer"

as is gun control

as is govt control of health care

etc, etc, etc

[red states rule]

Well i'm only 23, but you are right 99% of the people my age and below are just looking for the next beer, high and fuck. Nothing else matters.

Which is why you are sucked into the fantasy of liberalism

You are promised someone else will take care of you

[mundame]

Well, they are just overly idealistic. And good for them. They dont have enough life experience yet, reality beats the idealism out of you. The best thing is to not get too cynical, yet not remain too idealistic.



Oops, too late, I'm cynical. http://macg.net/emoticons/smilebow.gif

But I agree, nothing can cure youth except years and years of experience.

About fifty years gets you started on having some perspective.

[red states rule]

Oops, too late, I'm cynical. http://macg.net/emoticons/smilebow.gif

But I agree, nothing can cure youth except years and years of experience.

About fifty years gets you started on having some perspective.


Only if you turn off the doom and gloom liberal media, and pay attention to what is happening in the real world

Dems are invested in failure and only want to spread the misery around to as many people as possible

[mundame]

Dems are invested in failure and only want to spread the misery around to as many people as possible


I'm pretty sure it's the Bush administration that is spreading around all the misery --------- they are the ones in office.

[red states rule]

I'm pretty sure it's the Bush administration that is spreading around all the misery --------- they are the ones in office.

Misery only to liberals who are pissed they lost three elections to him

I have to laugh when libs whine how bad the economy is

Look back to Pres peanut Carter - not THAT was a bad economy

[mundame]

I have to laugh when libs whine how bad the economy is

Look back to Pres peanut Carter - not THAT was a bad economy


True, it really was. It was awful.

You are right ---- it's important to keep a sense of proportion. People exaggerate for political purposes. This economy is slowing, but Bernanke has done a good job with the crunch and bank runs danger and the stimulus paybacks may well jolt us out of the slowdown. I am hopeful.

Unemployment is only 5%. That's NORMAL. I don't want it lower than that ----- when it's lower than that, it's hard to find anyone looking for work who can read, and I know because I was hiring during that 3.5% unemployment, and that was just terrible.

[red states rule]

True, it really was. It was awful.

You are right ---- it's important to keep a sense of proportion. People exaggerate for political purposes. This economy is slowing, but Bernanke has done a good job with the crunch and bank runs danger and the stimulus paybacks may well jolt us out of the slowdown. I am hopeful.

Unemployment is only 5%. That's NORMAL. I don't want it lower than that ----- when it's lower than that, it's hard to find anyone looking for work who can read, and I know because I was hiring during that 3.5% unemployment, and that was just terrible.

and to think libs want the same people who educate our kids to run our health care system

The US government

[mundame]

and to think libs want the same people who educate our kids to run our health care system

The US government



How my husband would agree with you.

Well, and so would I.

The whole point to a government-run health system is to stop health services from happening, because they are taking so much of the gross domestic product, and it's constantly growing. That is a problem. I don't know the solution, but I'd rather it were a market solution.

Allowing high-deductible interstate health insurance would be a BIG start on solving the problem, I think. And that's free market: just kill the many lobbyist-spawned laws that require local state insurance with a gazillion silly add-ons, like acupuncture.

[red states rule]

How my husband would agree with you.

Well, and so would I.

The whole point to a government-run health system is to stop health services from happening, because they are taking so much of the gross domestic product, and it's constantly growing. That is a problem. I don't know the solution, but I'd rather it were a market solution.

Allowing high-deductible interstate health insurance would be a BIG start on solving the problem, I think. And that's free market: just kill the many lobbyist-spawned laws that require local state insurance with a gazillion silly add-ons, like acupuncture.

Then why the hell are you going with Hillary? She wants to bring back Hillarycare

[mundame]

Then why the hell are you going with Hillary? She wants to bring back Hillarycare


Yes, well, nobody's perfect. http://macg.net/emoticons/peace.gif

[red states rule]

Yes, well, nobody's perfect. http://macg.net/emoticons/peace.gif

Well, she is the perfect liberal

[LuvRPgrl]

How my husband would agree with you.

Well, and so would I.

The whole point to a government-run health system is to stop health services from happening, because they are taking so much of the gross domestic product, and it's constantly growing. That is a problem. I don't know the solution, but I'd rather it were a market solution.

Allowing high-deductible interstate health insurance would be a BIG start on solving the problem, I think. And that's free market: just kill the many lobbyist-spawned laws that require local state insurance with a gazillion silly add-ons, like acupuncture.

Its taking up more and more of the GDP because the costs are rising
which is just accenuated when the GOVT requires health insurance for all.

Im not sure why you think a GOVT run system is the solution, when it is the GOVT required insurance that is causing a huge part of the problem

Fact is, people have bought into the idea that you need health insurance for every little tummy ache little johnny has.

Fact is, people would save soooo much if they paid $125 a month, instead of $700 a month for their insurance, but not have the insurance cover doctor visits that should only cost about $50-100.

I have paid cash for years now, and when the doctor knows that, he reduces my charged rate, and often gives me free meds, and ALWAYS prescribes generic equivalents.

If you think about it, those uneccesary insurance companies and almost all of their employees making billions of dollars annually, really do nothing at all except shuffle paper and money around. Get rid of em by getting rid of 85% of our insurance, and costs would go down dramatically.

[Kathianne]

This does sound a few non-hysterical warning notes, but I love the opening:

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/columnists/article3876863.ece?&EMC-Bltn=LPTEY8


From The Times
May 6, 2008
Steinbeck’s grapes lack wrath this time around
Gerard Baker: American View

Whatever happened to the Great Depression? Not the real one from 70 years ago, the lost decade of unimagined misery and Steinbeckian angst, the worst period in the history of modern capitalism. I mean the replay we were promised this year. The one we were told was the inevitable counterpart to the greatest financial crisis since a couple of medieval Italians first sat down on a Florentine bench and invented the word “bank”.

I don’t know about you but I feel a bit cheated. There we all were, led to believe by so many commentators that the sub-prime crisis was going to force the United States into a new era of dust bowls and breadlines, a slump that would call into question the very functioning of the capitalist system in the world’s largest economy. Carried away on the surging wave of their own economically dubious verbosity, the pundits even speculated that this unavoidable calamity might presage some 1930s-style global political cataclysm to match.

Well, it’s early days, to be fair, but so far the Great Depression 2008 is shaping up to be a Great Disappointment. Not so much The Grapes of Wrath as Raisins of Mild Inconvenience. Last week the Commerce Department reported that the US economy – battered by the credit crunch, pummelled by a housing market collapse and generally devastated by the wild stampede of animal spirits – actually grew in the first three months of the year...

[NATO AIR]

In the end, I'm with the liberal Paul Krugman on this. The country dodged a bullet, mostly because the Fed got lucky and partly because Barneke and Secretary Paulson did fairly well being the adults in the situation between the people, Congress, the President and Wall Street.

However, given the fact that Paulson's brilliant financial reform project has been ignored by Congress and the President alike, I feel nervous about the future, because these are reforms that needed to happen for this country to remain competitive against China, Europe and the Gulf countries economically. They had the potential to raise US profits and trade levels by the tens of billions yearly, not to mention helping to make the financial markets better regulated without strangling them.

So we have a brilliant Treasury Secretary backed up by a lameduck President and ignored by a feuding Congress. Paulson's only staunch allies on Capitol Hill are the liberal Barney Frank and the conservative Sens. Conryn and Hagel.... That ain't enough to get this package through and we need it badly as a country to stay ahead of the next financial shocks and stay competitive.

[red states rule]

The liberal media keeps pushing a dom and gloom picture. They are doing all they can to back Dems and help them in the election

ABC Adds to Parade of Hapless Economic Victims, Now No Electricity
By Brent Baker | May 6, 2008 - 22:31 ET

Four days after NBC centered a story around an elderly couple forced to move “into their van, sleeping on a mattress in the back” while “high food costs have meant” they've “gone hungry,” ABC's World News caught up Tuesday night with a nearly as silly anecdotal report on how families in Minnesota can no longer afford electricity. In the first of two families she showcased, reporter Gigi Stone relayed Julie Tkachuk's plight: “After paying for more expensive gas and groceries, Julie had no money for the heating bills left over from the winter.” Then Stone described the predicament of a family whose father “says business at his moving company is down 35 percent this year. There just wasn't enough money for the power bill.”

Referring to the Low-Income Home Energy Assistance Program (LIHEAP), Stone acknowledged that “there's federal assistance for people who can't afford their utility bills,” but she ominously intoned, “the number of applicants reached the highest point in 16 years.” ABC then aired a soundbite from Mark Wolfe of the National Energy Assistance Director's Association, an advocacy group for LIHEAP spending. The group's April 25 press release (PDF) hyping “the number of households receiving LIHEAP funds this year is the highest in 16 years” also, however, disclosed a fact ABC didn't mention -- that increase is merely 3.8 percent over fiscal year 2007 with the number of households on the dole in Minnesota rising from 120,765 to 126,500, hardly a huge jump.

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/brent-baker/2008/05/06/abc-adds-parade-hapless-economic-victims-now-no-electricity

[red states rule]

More bad news for the Dems. Much to their dismay the US economy is rolling right along


Jobless claims, retail sales show resilience

By Nancy Waitz


WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The number of U.S. workers filing claims for initial jobless benefits fell last week and retail sales rebounded last month from a dismal March, suggesting the economy, while soft, was not crumbling rapidly.

Many economists have concluded the U.S. economy is in recession. However, a string of recent data, including reports on Thursday, has strengthened the hand of analysts who argue the United States economy may be able to avoid contraction.

Initial claims for state unemployment benefits fell to 365,000 last week from 383,000 in the prior week, the Labor Department said. The level was slightly lower than Wall Street had expected.

The number of people still on the benefit rolls after drawing an initial week of aid fell 10,000 to 3.02 million in the week ended April 26, the latest period for which figures were available. Continued claims remained above 3 million for the second straight week, a level not seen since April 2004.

http://www.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idUSN0835298120080508?feedType=RSS&feedName=businessNews

[mundame]

[quote=NATO AIR;240921The country dodged a bullet, mostly because the Fed got lucky and partly because Barneke and Secretary Paulson did fairly well being the adults in the situation between the people, Congress, the President and Wall Street.
[/quote]


You speak as if it's all over, Nato Air, but yesterday oil went above $125 a barrel, and Citibank is writing off between $400 billion and $500 billion of bad mortgage securities.....

I agree Bernanke is doing well, but I am worried about this weak dollar that is causing high oil and high commodities of all kinds.

I don't think we are out of the woods.

[mundame]

Oil's too rapid rise inflicts pain (http://www.reuters.com/article/reutersEdge/idUSL0818364020080509) 9:10am ET Reuters

From the poorest of Africa to the United States and big business, a breakneck rally that could take oil to $200 a barrel is likely to inflict pain on everyone.
*************************************************

This is the Reuters headline today.......................not a good sign.

I tell you what, if oil DOES go anywhere close to $200 a barrel, I expect a lot of changes in a lot of lives.

[red states rule]

Oil's too rapid rise inflicts pain (http://www.reuters.com/article/reutersEdge/idUSL0818364020080509) 9:10am ET Reuters

From the poorest of Africa to the United States and big business, a breakneck rally that could take oil to $200 a barrel is likely to inflict pain on everyone.
*************************************************

This is the Reuters headline today.......................not a good sign.

I tell you what, if oil DOES go anywhere close to $200 a barrel, I expect a lot of changes in a lot of lives.



The market will not allow oil to hit that price. The market will decide the price

Of course if Dems would pull their head out of their ass and let oil companies start drilling for the oil we have here in the US, proces would start to fall

[mundame]

The market will not allow oil to hit that price. The market will decide the price


Yeah, well, today the market decided the price would be over $126 per barrel, so I'm worried.

Were you saying it would never hit $100 last year?

[red states rule]

Yeah, well, today the market decided the price would be over $126 per barrel, so I'm worried.

Were you saying it would never hit $100 last year?

There is a limit to what people wil pay for oil, as there are limits to what people will pays for other things

If the price gets to high, they will reduce the amiount of oil they will buy

It is basic economics

Of course, if Dems would not be so damn stupid and stiop doing the bidding of the enviro wackos, we have oil we could be drilling for right now

[mundame]

If the price gets to high, they will reduce the amiount of oil they will buy

It is basic economics



That's right, and our whole economy and way of life will be whacked out of kilter. Commuting will become a problem. Transport of goods.

Not to mention the fuel-based food supplies going up so much all over the world: things are changing very fast. So far we aren't noticing, but if gas keeps going up, soon people will notice something serious is going on.

[red states rule]

That's right, and our whole economy and way of life will be whacked out of kilter. Commuting will become a problem. Transport of goods.

Not to mention the fuel-based food supplies going up so much all over the world: things are changing very fast. So far we aren't noticing, but if gas keeps going up, soon people will notice something serious is going on.

Meanwhile, Dems block all attemtps to drill for the oil we have within the US.

This from the party that claims to care about the middle class

[LuvRPgrl]

That's right, and our whole economy and way of life will be whacked out of kilter. Commuting will become a problem. Transport of goods.

Not to mention the fuel-based food supplies going up so much all over the world: things are changing very fast. So far we aren't noticing, but if gas keeps going up, soon people will notice something serious is going on.

If oil gets too high, people will cut back on their driving, plain and simple.

I wonder how the libecrats can always scream at Pres Bush like he has control over WORLD oil prices, or something.

Actually, price of fuel hadnt been keeping up with inflation, this is a bit of a correction.

1965 candy bar = .05 cents
gallon gas = .29 cents

2003 candy bar = .85 cents 17x factor
gal gas = less than $2 a gallon. Less than a 7X factor.

AS FOR FUEL BASED FOOD PRODUCTION, WE CURRENTLY PAY MILLIONS IF NOT BILLIONS TO FARMERS TO NOT GROWcrops and leave fields bare. If prices started getting too high, we could cut taxes and start plowing those fields.

[red states rule]

If oil gets too high, people will cut back on their driving, plain and simple.

I wonder how the libecrats can always scream at Pres Bush like he has control over WORLD oil prices, or something.

Actually, price of fuel hadnt been keeping up with inflation, this is a bit of a correction.

1965 candy bar = .05 cents
gallon gas = .29 cents

2003 candy bar = .85 cents 17x factor
gal gas = less than $2 a gallon. Less than a 7X factor.

AS FOR FUEL BASED FOOD PRODUCTION, WE CURRENTLY PAY MILLIONS IF NOT BILLIONS TO FARMERS TO NOT GROWcrops and leave fields bare. If prices started getting too high, we could cut taxes and start plowing those fields.

and how much has gas gone up since Reid and Pelsoi took over Congress? I do rememebr Dems promising to lower gas prices if they were elected in 06

I do believe gas has nearly doubled in price since Dems took over Congress