What is your legitimate criticism of conservatism (Not the republican Party)

[actsnoblemartin]

Please refrain from overly simplistic generalization, and instead please be specific about what you dont like and why.

Thank You

[avatar4321]

we arent united enough to be effective.

[midcan5]

Repost from 'is C a Choice?'

My faults with conservatism (C) are many, chief among them is C has caused a decline in the values that used to be part of America and are at its foundation. Among these values are open government, individual freedom, a respect for law, and an decrease in social justice.

Now one of the biggest kick backs I get when I use examples is 'but they aren't conservatives.' I don't buy this excuse as it is conservatives who have supported these people and brought them to power. If conservatives had strong values that respected for instance, individual freedoms, they would be criticising many of the negatives I will put forth. They don't. Conservative politics have placed people who are either incompetent or rigid ideologues into positions of power and then gloss over unacceptable and I'll say un American behavior.

I'll give just one example at a time. The Bush administration has engaged in a government of secrecy that excludes not only media but the other branches of government. When Cheney meet to discuss energy he excluded us. The energy taskforce is just one example. Check out Waxman report. Open government is a key part of a democracy, it is constantly usurped by republican conservatives.

And if anyone's argument consists in 'but the others are worse,' or but they aren't C (you elected them) please refrain from posting. That may be my next topic.

[midcan5]

we arent united enough to be effective.

I hear that but I don't see it. Also I believe and would argue liberalism is part of the character of America and a conservative society whatever that may be does not exist except in totalitarian or dictatorial societies. I would call Iran conservative or North Korea.

[glockmail]

...I would call Iran conservative or North Korea. With this it is obvious that you have your definitions mixed up. You're trying to lump all sorts of political philosophies that you don't like into one common enemy.

Maybe you should start and think of it as less government v. more government. And stop mixing up social conservative with fiscal conservative.

[actsnoblemartin]

I would respectfully disagree, conservatism believes in limited government.

While iran and north korea, repress their people, so i would call iran and north korea repressive not conservative


I hear that but I don't see it. Also I believe and would argue liberalism is part of the character of America and a conservative society whatever that may be does not exist except in totalitarian or dictatorial societies. I would call Iran conservative or North Korea.

[actsnoblemartin]

The difference as i see it between the c is a choice and mine are.

c is a choice was a pure opinion piece, that basically wasnt too favorable and was very narrow in its question of , is it a choice. Trying to lump it with homosexuality, which i dont think is accurate.

A poster said they cant criticize conservatives, so i said ok, what are YOUR legiminate criticisms, this thread is for anyone with a legitimate gripe, its very broad, and doesnt give my opinion at all.


Repost from 'is C a Choice?'

My faults with conservatism (C) are many, chief among them is C has caused a decline in the values that used to be part of America and are at its foundation. Among these values are open government, individual freedom, a respect for law, and an decrease in social justice.

Now one of the biggest kick backs I get when I use examples is 'but they aren't conservatives.' I don't buy this excuse as it is conservatives who have supported these people and brought them to power. If conservatives had strong values that respected for instance, individual freedoms, they would be criticising many of the negatives I will put forth. They don't. Conservative politics have placed people who are either incompetent or rigid ideologues into positions of power and then gloss over unacceptable and I'll say un American behavior.

I'll give just one example at a time. The Bush administration has engaged in a government of secrecy that excludes not only media but the other branches of government. When Cheney meet to discuss energy he excluded us. The energy taskforce is just one example. Check out Waxman report. Open government is a key part of a democracy, it is constantly usurped by republican conservatives.

And if anyone's argument consists in 'but the others are worse,' or but they aren't C (you elected them) please refrain from posting. That may be my next topic.

[mundame]

Now one of the biggest kick backs I get when I use examples is 'but they aren't conservatives.' I don't buy this excuse as it is conservatives who have supported these people and brought them to power.

Yeahbut, we're sorry now.

So it's a good excuse, that they aren't conservatives.

[mundame]

I hear that but I don't see it. Also I believe and would argue liberalism is part of the character of America and a conservative society whatever that may be does not exist except in totalitarian or dictatorial societies. I would call Iran conservative or North Korea.


Now you're catching on...........................Iran is conservative back to the 8th century; North Korea at least back to the 1870s. That's the period they actually want to live in, and resent it being 2008.

American conservatives do want to slow change down; not usually by quite so many centuries, however.

[gabosaurus]

It's too conservative.

[actsnoblemartin]

i find iran and korea more fascist then conservative, because they take many if not all rights away.


It's too conservative.

[avatar4321]

I hear that but I don't see it. Also I believe and would argue liberalism is part of the character of America and a conservative society whatever that may be does not exist except in totalitarian or dictatorial societies. I would call Iran conservative or North Korea.

Except it's liberalism thats actively working for the totalitarian society. The central tenent of conservatism is keeping government out of our lives. By definition it can't be totalitarian because you can't have government controling everyones life and be out of everyones life at the same time. The two contradict each other.

You're trying to make conservatism into something it's not. I understand that you think the constitution is outdated. But rest of us enjoy the rights it protects. We like having free speech. We like having free religion. We like being able to defend ourself. We like the government not trying to regulate what we think, say, or eat. We dont like the government trying to tell us when, where, and how we can work.

We are trying to preserve the principles of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. And except in circumstances where government is used to protect those principles, the best thing for government to do is stay out of our lives.

That is conservatism. And limited government is completely contrary to totalitarian government.

Unfortunately too many people are convinced that the government needs to interfere in every aspect of life. That government needs to regulate our businesses, regulate our eating habits, regulate our health, regulate what media we can listen and watch, regulate our health care, regulate our education, regulate everything in our lives. They claim to do this because they "care". The fact is all they really want is power. They want us to give up our own power and hand it over to them. This destroys freedom. It destroys self worth. it destroys productivity. And eventually it destroys lives.

Sadly, by the years ends we will see mass starvation and a record number of people freezing to death from energy shortages thanks to government overregulation.

Conservatism hasnt been found wanting. Its been found too difficult and left untried.

[mundame]

i find iran and korea more fascist then conservative, because they take many if not all rights away.


Sure, they are totalitarian, into total control of all possible aspects of the individual's life. That's a crucial feature of fascism.