The Pope's Visit

[PhotonMac]

As I was casually watching and listening to the news yesterday about the visit to the U.S. by the Pope and the celebration of Mass at the huge venue in D.C., I got to wondering. How much taxpayer money was spent on this event? The security costs had to be enormous by themselves. Did people spend money to go to it? If they did, who benefitted from the proceeds? If government i.e. taxpayer money coverd the costs it seems to be a conflict of separation of church and state. The Catholic church has more money than a lot of third world countries and probably could underwritten the costs themselves. I also noticed that only the VIP's received the Eucharist from the Pope. It all seemed very pompous (sp?) in my opinion.

[theHawk]

Please point out where in the Constitution there is a "separation of church and state".

There is only a clause saying Congress cannot make a law respecting a religion. Or are you arguing that providing security for a foreign leader is the same as passing a law through Congress respecting a religion? If so I'd like to see the vote count of yay's and nays and the bill's title.

[Hagbard Celine]

Just in case everyone wasn't aware, there is a Hitler youth occupying the office of Pope. Carry on.

[Hobbit]

As I was casually watching and listening to the news yesterday about the visit to the U.S. by the Pope and the celebration of Mass at the huge venue in D.C., I got to wondering. How much taxpayer money was spent on this event? The security costs had to be enormous by themselves. Did people spend money to go to it? If they did, who benefitted from the proceeds? If government i.e. taxpayer money coverd the costs it seems to be a conflict of separation of church and state. The Catholic church has more money than a lot of third world countries and probably could underwritten the costs themselves. I also noticed that only the VIP's received the Eucharist from the Pope. It all seemed very pompous (sp?) in my opinion.

As the leader of the independent nation of the Vatican, the Pope is a head of state and should be afforded the same courtesies of any other.

In addition, he is an important world figure and deserving of respect, even if you're not Catholic.

Lastly, I didn't see anybody pitching a fit the last time we hosted the Dalai Lama, who is also a religious leader.


Just in case everyone wasn't aware, there is a Hitler youth occupying the office of Pope. Carry on.

That's irrelevant and you know it. During the rise of Nazism, there were two kinds of children, Hitler youth and corpses, and I imagine he wanted to live.

[Abbey Marie]

As I was casually watching and listening to the news yesterday about the visit to the U.S. by the Pope and the celebration of Mass at the huge venue in D.C., I got to wondering. How much taxpayer money was spent on this event? The security costs had to be enormous by themselves. Did people spend money to go to it? If they did, who benefitted from the proceeds? If government i.e. taxpayer money coverd the costs it seems to be a conflict of separation of church and state. The Catholic church has more money than a lot of third world countries and probably could underwritten the costs themselves. I also noticed that only the VIP's received the Eucharist from the Pope. It all seemed very pompous (sp?) in my opinion.

The gov't knew full well that the crowds to see the Pope would be enormous. Would you have preferred no security and pandemonium? You are not making sense here.

[theHawk]

The gov't knew full well that the crowds to see the Pope would be enormous. Would you have preferred no security and pandemonium? You are not making sense here.

yea, I don't hear the libs complaining about the tax costs of providing security for million man marches, and large anti-war protests.

[theHawk]

Just in case everyone wasn't aware, there is a Hitler youth occupying the office of Pope. Carry on.

Yes, we're all aware of his story of being forced into Hitler's army, and we're well aware of his family's objection to Nazism. What's your point?

[Sitarro]

I wonder how much of our tax dollars are going into following around a pair of Senators that have been running for President for the last year with another 6 months to go. Who is doing their job while they go around repeating the same bullshit across the country burning thousands of gallons of fuel per hour of flight time. How many millions of dollars have Hillary and Obamessiah blown saying nothing and looking like fools. Get real, that's what Washington does, waste tax dollars and the Democrats have been doing it better than anyone for years.

[Nukeman]

I think you guys are reading more into the OP than needs to be. I think the question was only "how much tax money was spent"? I think we as a nation spend WAY too much money for security on visiting dignitaries and religious leaders.

Why not let them higher Black Water good enough for the common Iraqi why not good enough for the Pope, I hear they will take anyone out who gets in the way!!!:laugh2:

Seriously though the Catholic Church should help cover some of the expense.



As the leader of the independent nation of the Vatican,

It may meet some of the requirements/criteria to be a "state", but it doesn't meet all of them. It also could not survive without the help of the Italian people and gov't.:coffee:

[glockmail]

As I was casually watching and listening to the news yesterday about the visit to the U.S. by the Pope and the celebration of Mass at the huge venue in D.C., I got to wondering. How much taxpayer money was spent on this event? The security costs had to be enormous by themselves. Did people spend money to go to it? If they did, who benefitted from the proceeds? If government i.e. taxpayer money coverd the costs it seems to be a conflict of separation of church and state. The Catholic church has more money than a lot of third world countries and probably could underwritten the costs themselves. I also noticed that only the VIP's received the Eucharist from the Pope. It all seemed very pompous (sp?) in my opinion.

The Vatican is considered to be a nation-state, and just like Russia, or the UN for that matter, we have an ambassador to it as well as diplomatic relations. When the head of that state is visiting we provide ceremonies, security, and partake in their customs.

[Nukeman]

The Vatican is considered to be a nation-state, and just like Russia, or the UN for that matter, we have an ambassador to it as well as diplomatic relations. When the head of that state is visiting we provide ceremonies, security, and partake in their customs.What about the Mass performed in the stadium, most visiting heads of state don't do the "rock star" thing!!! Do they???:laugh2:

[FSUK]

What a stupid thread!. PLease, i hope you are joking ?

There are more important issues in the world and US- rather than moaning about tax payer contributions to the pope's security.

Why dont you complain abt the amount of tax payers money that has gone towards illegal wars? or protecting the leaders of your greatest allies?

[Nukeman]

What a stupid thread!. PLease, i hope you are joking ?

There are more important issues in the world and US- rather than moaning about tax payer contributions to the pope's security.

Why dont you complain abt the amount of tax payers money that has gone towards illegal wars? or protecting the leaders of your greatest allies?
blah..... blah..... blah.... thanks for your 2 cents worth there FU... Why don't you sitck to the politics is the UK.

Did you fail to read this was in US General Events or are you just being your usual moronic self???????

[glockmail]

What about the Mass performed in the stadium, most visiting heads of state don't do the "rock star" thing!!! Do they???:laugh2:
The mass is part of his business and the main reason for his visit.

[Nukeman]

The mass is part of his business and the main reason for his visit.I Know that I'm just messing with you guys.....:laugh2:

[jff.law]

Well first we have American companies that own the stadium, I did see that tickets were sold for this event, and there was a lot of fund raising done by Catholic school kids to attend. Security must have been expensive of course, probably a little more then for a ball game. The original intent of separation of church and state was to not have undue influence or control of the government in politics. Otherwise you could also conclude that the Bush administration's push for religious based social programs over the last few years was also in conflict. Now how do you suppose that 150,000 people could take the Eucharist from one 82 year old man?

[glockmail]

blah..... blah..... blah.... thanks for your 2 cents worth there FU... Why don't you sitck to the politics is the UK.

Did you fail to read this was in US General Events or are you just being your usual moronic self???????
No shit. Freedom of speech is a right for Americans. In fact we fought the damn Brits so we could have it, and tell the damn Brits to shut up.

[FSUK]

THE FUCKING TRUTH HURTS!. if you want to go and moan about such stupid issues- go ahead. It is the US events page- i guess- this is what some US people like to moan about.

In the UK- we actually moan about important issues.

[PhotonMac]

I didn't realize there were so many papal apologists here. My objection to the money being spent is not just limited to this topic. I too agree that that the money spent on the presidential campaigns is terrible as well. Perhaps even more ludicrous than the papal visit. Where the government decides to spend our money is a huge concern. The waste is enormous. VOTE LIBERTARIAN!

[theHawk]

THE FUCKING TRUTH HURTS!. if you want to go and moan about such stupid issues- go ahead. It is the US events page- i guess- this is what some US people like to moan about.

In the UK- we actually moan about important issues.

In case you haven't noticed, the only person who is complaining about it and making an issue out of it is a liberal who opened up the thread.

If you don't give a shit about this non-issue then why aren't you posting in other more important threads?

[theHawk]

I didn't realize there were so many papal apologists here. My objection to the money being spent is not just limited to this topic. I too agree that that the money spent on the presidential campaigns is terrible as well. Perhaps even more ludicrous than the papal visit. Where the government decides to spend our money is a huge concern. The waste is enormous. VOTE LIBERTARIAN!

The amount of money spent on such things is a drop in the bucket compared to entitlements.

[glockmail]

The amount of money spent on such things is a drop in the bucket compared to entitlements.
The total spending by all of the presidential candidates so far this cycle comes up to less than $2.50 per capita.

[Kathianne]

I didn't realize there were so many papal apologists here. My objection to the money being spent is not just limited to this topic. I too agree that that the money spent on the presidential campaigns is terrible as well. Perhaps even more ludicrous than the papal visit. Where the government decides to spend our money is a huge concern. The waste is enormous. VOTE LIBERTARIAN!

Now you are sounding like the normal 19th Century know-nothing, thanks for being such an 'enlightened' bigot.

[Sitarro]

THE FUCKING TRUTH HURTS!. if you want to go and moan about such stupid issues- go ahead. It is the US events page- i guess- this is what some US people like to moan about.

In the UK- we actually moan about important issues.

Yea, like how Diana died, figured it out yet? Need some help? The car she was in was traveling at a very high rate of speed and was forced to stop forward motion at an even higher rate upon hitting an immovable object. She was riding in the speeding car unrestrained which turned her body into a missile inside the car. She died of blunt force trauma to numerous points of her body and the rearrangement of numerous internal organs from the gravitational pull of forward motion of the car being abruptly stopped when it hit a concrete pillar
You guys can stop wondering now..

[Sitarro]

What a stupid thread!. PLease, i hope you are joking ?

There are more important issues in the world and US- rather than moaning about tax payer contributions to the pope's security.

Why dont you complain abt the amount of tax payers money that has gone towards illegal wars? or protecting the leaders of your greatest allies?

This coming from someone whose country is legendary for it's imperialistic actions across the globe, that's funny.:laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:

[82Marine89]

As I was casually watching and listening to the news yesterday about the visit to the U.S. by the Pope and the celebration of Mass at the huge venue in D.C., I got to wondering. How much taxpayer money was spent on this event? The security costs had to be enormous by themselves. Did people spend money to go to it? If they did, who benefitted from the proceeds? If government i.e. taxpayer money coverd the costs it seems to be a conflict of separation of church and state. The Catholic church has more money than a lot of third world countries and probably could underwritten the costs themselves. I also noticed that only the VIP's received the Eucharist from the Pope. It all seemed very pompous (sp?) in my opinion.

So when a democrat goes into a church and gives a speech from the pulpit, can we revoke the tax exempt status of that church? Isn't it supposed to be a house of worship? Should elected officials be allowed to talk politics in a religious venue? Isn't it what you consider a violation of the seperation of church and state?

[manu1959]

THE FUCKING TRUTH HURTS!. if you want to go and moan about such stupid issues- go ahead. It is the US events page- i guess- this is what some US people like to moan about.

In the UK- we actually moan about important issues.

yes like the size of charles ears and who killed diana....and when is the queen going to die....and which royal was in the gay video.....

[82Marine89]

THE FUCKING TRUTH HURTS!. if you want to go and moan about such stupid issues- go ahead. It is the US events page- i guess- this is what some US people like to moan about.

In the UK- we actually moan about important issues.

Like the color of your teeth?

[manu1959]

Like the color of your teeth?

given the quility of dental care in england doubt he has any....

[Kathianne]

http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/religionfromtheheart/2008/04/proud_to_be_catholic.html


Proud to Be a Catholic

I am proud.

I am proud to be a Catholic after reading Benedict XVI’s homily from the mass he celebrated yesterday. He spoke of the gift of “the hope born of love, poured into our hearts by the Holy Spirit (cf Rom 5:5). He spoke of renewal as a gift of God, of forgiveness as a gift for which we each hunger, of the work of so many in “forming the hearts and minds of the young in knowledge and love of the Lord.” I long for that hope, that love, that faith too. May I have eyes to see it and ears to hear it today and forever.

I am proud to be a Catholic after reading the report of his meeting with President Bush. According to the official release after the meeting, the two spoke of the value of human life, of the importance of marriage, of human rights, of fighting poverty, of fighting disease, of promoting peace. I long for a leader, like Benedict, who believes in all these, not just in one or two. May I have the courage in my own life to pursue them all.

I am proud to be a Catholic after listening to the Pope speak of his shame at the enormous failings of his church in responding to the sexual abuse crisis. Shame is personal, is humiliating, is full of pain. To speak publicly of such feeling is to acknowledge what we cannot explain: how people of the Church, the vast majority of whom set out to do good, found themselves party to unspeakable evil. Shame is real and I feel it. May I have the strength to do what I can to make this church heal the pride and arrogance that created such an abomination.

I am proud to be a Catholic most of all when I think of the life of prayer. I think of all those who prayed the Rosary for the Holy Father, of those who offer prayers at Mass for his mission, for those who look to his office to provide clarity in pursuit of God’s will, not our own. May I have the peace that passes all understanding so that I too might follow in prayer the centuries of holy men and women who have given their lives joyfully in service to the only thing that really matters: the love of God.

I know. It’s been a long road for the Catholic Church in this country. Sure, Catholics were once mocked and ridiculed for their hocus pocus religion and their shocking belief in the real presence of God in sacraments; for their fishy food rules, for their rampant devotions to things of all shapes and sizes: to Saint Anthony’s ability to find the lost, to St. Jude’s ability to save the hopeless, to Our Lady’s ability to appear to the unlikely, to the blessing of throats, the blessing of the fleet, the blessing of the flocks. In our country, these all seemed so clannish and old world, like strange superstitions of an ignorant age.

Those days are gone, and most Catholics have long since entered the American mainstream. Our traditions, though they remain, have become a bit more understated. There are fewer pilgrimages from American churches to Fatima, fewer novenas on Friday night to St. Jude, fewer lengthy theological articles on the real presence of Christ in the Blessed Sacrament.

But for many, this most peculiar papacy still sets Catholics apart. The Pope, of all things, would seem to stand outside our common values as Americans. The Pope is what we’re not: regal, authoritative, indifferent to polling data, able to ask that we follow without giving us a vote on the issue.

Yes, he is all that. But we live in a time hungry for unity, hungry for clarity of purpose, hungry for the presence of God—the real presence of the divine. Americans are a people on pilgrimage, always searching, always willing to reinvent ourselves as we try to find out who we might become.

So maybe just for a few days, we might all pause before this man of God: human he is, on pilgrimage like the rest of us. Sure, I wish he’d make pulpits open to women, I wish he’d eliminate “only” from his love of the church he leads, I wish he’d spend more time with the poor and less with the rich.

But he made me proud nonetheless. He brought a profound reminder of what it means to believe in a faith so grand and so humble too, a faith ultimately in nothing less than God’s love, God’s presence among us, God’s promise to be with us always.

Thank you, Holy Father. Amen.