What Obama Failed to Mention: Racist Black Grandfather

[Yurt]

for all obama's hype about his white grandmother being racist and throwing her under the bus to deflect from his racist preacher, here is what he says in his book about his black grandfather:


When the two of us got married, your grandparents weren’t happy with the idea. But they said okay-they probably couldn’t have stopped us anyway, and they eventually came around to the idea that it was the right thing to do. Then Barack’s father-your grandfather Hussein-wrote Gramps this long, nasty letter saying that he didn’t approve of the marriage. He didn’t want the Obama blood sullied by a white woman, he said. Well, you can imagine how Gramps reacted to that. And then there was a problem with your father’s first wife…he had told me they were separated, but it was a village wedding, so there was no legal document that could show a divorce….” [93]

Dreams of my father....

how convenient that is never mentioned in his race speech....this guy is a narcissistic danger....

[retiredman]

for all obama's hype about his white grandmother being racist and throwing her under the bus to deflect from his racist preacher, here is what he says in his book about his black grandfather:



Dreams of my father....

how convenient that is never mentioned in his race speech....this guy is a narcissistic danger....


did you get that quote from actually reading the book or from one of your anti-Obama websites?

[Yurt]

did you get that quote from actually reading the book or from one of your anti-Obama websites?

from a democrat site that quoted directly from the book. if you are going to claim the quote is false, provide proof, else shut it. you haven't even read the whole book.

[retiredman]

from a democrat site that quoted directly from the book. if you are going to claim the quote is false, provide proof, else shut it. you haven't even read the whole book.

liar. I read the whole book two years ago.

Again....wouldn't it be much more fitting if you actually read a book before lambasting it?

[Yurt]

liar. I read the whole book two years ago.

Again....wouldn't it be much more fitting if you actually read a book before lambasting it?

i see... so when i make a claim (i thought you denied reading it in another thread) i am a liar, but when you do it...its ok...hypocrite....

have you read the entire bible, cover to cover? did your father read every single case/statute out there for everything he argued?

[manu1959]

liar. I read the whole book two years ago.

Again....wouldn't it be much more fitting if you actually read a book before lambasting it?

so does the book say this or no....When the two of us got married, your grandparents weren’t happy with the idea. But they said okay-they probably couldn’t have stopped us anyway, and they eventually came around to the idea that it was the right thing to do. Then Barack’s father-your grandfather Hussein-wrote Gramps this long, nasty letter saying that he didn’t approve of the marriage. He didn’t want the Obama blood sullied by a white woman, he said. Well, you can imagine how Gramps reacted to that. And then there was a problem with your father’s first wife…he had told me they were separated, but it was a village wedding, so there was no legal document that could show a divorce….” [93]

[Yurt]

so does the book say this or no....When the two of us got married, your grandparents weren’t happy with the idea. But they said okay-they probably couldn’t have stopped us anyway, and they eventually came around to the idea that it was the right thing to do. Then Barack’s father-your grandfather Hussein-wrote Gramps this long, nasty letter saying that he didn’t approve of the marriage. He didn’t want the Obama blood sullied by a white woman, he said. Well, you can imagine how Gramps reacted to that. And then there was a problem with your father’s first wife…he had told me they were separated, but it was a village wedding, so there was no legal document that could show a divorce….” [93]

good point

[actsnoblemartin]

you didnt pass the liberal litmus test for debate:

only correct answer: you must be a liberal to debate :laugh2:


i see... so when i make a claim (i thought you denied reading it in another thread) i am a liar, but when you do it...its ok...hypocrite....

have you read the entire bible, cover to cover? did your father read every single case/statute out there for everything he argued?

[Pale Rider]

so does the book say this or no....When the two of us got married, your grandparents weren’t happy with the idea. But they said okay-they probably couldn’t have stopped us anyway, and they eventually came around to the idea that it was the right thing to do. Then Barack’s father-your grandfather Hussein-wrote Gramps this long, nasty letter saying that he didn’t approve of the marriage. He didn’t want the Obama blood sullied by a white woman, he said. Well, you can imagine how Gramps reacted to that. And then there was a problem with your father’s first wife…he had told me they were separated, but it was a village wedding, so there was no legal document that could show a divorce….” [93]


good point

Still waiting...

[Yurt]

Still waiting...

it will be a long time, if at all...manu asked a very good question...

[red states rule]

it will be a long time, if at all...manu asked a very good question...

MFM must have "redeployed" to another thread

Or if we are lucky, to another board

[DragonStryk72]

for all obama's hype about his white grandmother being racist and throwing her under the bus to deflect from his racist preacher, here is what he says in his book about his black grandfather:



Dreams of my father....

how convenient that is never mentioned in his race speech....this guy is a narcissistic danger....


Does it matter? really, truly and honestly, do you really think that the black father who married a white woman passed racism to his half-white. half-black son? Fucking Christ Yurt, Jesus couldn't get elected to office on your standards.

I mean, god forbid that an old black man might have been a racist in the 50s-60s era, I mean it's not like whites were burning crosses on their lawn, or doing other such racist things back then like making them uses separate facilities, or sit at the back of the bus. I mean, really, just completely unthinkable there might be some fallout that black people of the would have had against white folks.

Next, has Anyone, anyone at all, switched sides during all your posts? Even one? Stop posting the same stupid tired crap, and find something new Yurt. This isn't going anywhere, it isn't going to end, it isn't going to work at convincing anyone of anything. So what the hell is the point of the thread?

[theHawk]

Does it matter? really, truly and honestly, do you really think that the black father who married a white woman passed racism to his half-white. half-black son? Fucking Christ Yurt, Jesus couldn't get elected to office on your standards.

I mean, god forbid that an old black man might have been a racist in the 50s-60s era, I mean it's not like whites were burning crosses on their lawn, or doing other such racist things back then like making them uses separate facilities, or sit at the back of the bus. I mean, really, just completely unthinkable there might be some fallout that black people of the would have had against white folks.

Next, has Anyone, anyone at all, switched sides during all your posts? Even one? Stop posting the same stupid tired crap, and find something new Yurt. This isn't going anywhere, it isn't going to end, it isn't going to work at convincing anyone of anything. So what the hell is the point of the thread?


Wow, Yurt must of really hit a sore spot here.

Looks like the liberals are being driven insane with all these facts about Obama and his screwed up life coming out of the woodworks.

[DragonStryk72]

Wow, Yurt must of really hit a sore spot here.

Looks like the liberals are being driven insane with all these facts about Obama and his screwed up life coming out of the woodworks.

Conservative Libertarian, actually. I'm just sick of the whole damn thing. Obama's granddad's words before he was even conceived have absolutely nothing to do with his candidacy now.

I said the same thing when Gore made that bullshit swipe at Bush in 2000, about the DUI Bush got when he was 25, two decades prior to his candidacy.

this isn't a matter of "liberal vs. conservative", this is a matter of "Obama is not responsible for people having somewhere in their lives having said something racist". I do not judge him by the most asshole people who know him, he's a politician, that list would get too long too fast. Am I voting for? Not a chance in hell, he's going to increase the size of the oversized government even more, so that's not happening.

"You are my enemy now, but we can still respect one another"

Wayne Root for President!!!

[glockmail]

Does it matter? really, truly and honestly, do you really think that the black father who married a white woman passed racism to his half-white. half-black son? Fucking Christ Yurt, Jesus couldn't get elected to office on your standards.

I mean, god forbid that an old black man might have been a racist in the 50s-60s era, I mean it's not like whites were burning crosses on their lawn, or doing other such racist things back then like making them uses separate facilities, or sit at the back of the bus. I mean, really, just completely unthinkable there might be some fallout that black people of the would have had against white folks.

Next, has Anyone, anyone at all, switched sides during all your posts? Even one? Stop posting the same stupid tired crap, and find something new Yurt. This isn't going anywhere, it isn't going to end, it isn't going to work at convincing anyone of anything. So what the hell is the point of the thread? Obviously you missed the point. Obama threw his white grandmother under the bus to defend his black preacher's racism. Why didn't he also mention his racist grandfather in the same explanation? What his grandmother said was a casual remark (and cannot be proven). His grandfather's words were written to try and convince someone to abandon a love affair, and therefore would have been chosen more carefully, and Obama has documented those statements.

[Yurt]

MFM must have "redeployed" to another thread

Or if we are lucky, to another board

nah, its good to have MFM around, provides counter points to debates, i would be bored with solely like minds...


DragonStryk72;229556]Does it matter? really, truly and honestly, do you really think that the black father who married a white woman passed racism to his half-white. half-black son? Fucking Christ Yurt, Jesus couldn't get elected to office on your standards.

Jesus wouldn't run for office....

obama said in his race speech:


But race is an issue that I believe this nation cannot afford to ignore right now

so according to him, yes it does matter and he made that speech an integral part of his platform for office.


I mean, god forbid that an old black man might have been a racist in the 50s-60s era, I mean it's not like whites were burning crosses on their lawn, or doing other such racist things back then like making them uses separate facilities, or sit at the back of the bus. I mean, really, just completely unthinkable there might be some fallout that black people of the would have had against white folks.

so then it was ok to disparage solely his white grandmother without mentioning his racist black grandfather?



Next, has Anyone, anyone at all, switched sides during all your posts? Even one? Stop posting the same stupid tired crap, and find something new Yurt. This isn't going anywhere, it isn't going to end, it isn't going to work at convincing anyone of anything. So what the hell is the point of the thread?

i have no idea if anyone has switched sides, many guests read the forum, and many members might not say. as to what i post, pound sand... i post on many issues and if i hit the issue that obama says we cannot afford to ignore right now, don't worry your little head about it...

so you think we should ignore race? if a KKK member was running for president, we should ignore the fact he is KKK?


edit: this guy has a strong potential to be the next president and yet stryker thinks this stuff is no big deal.....

[Yurt]

manu pwned mfm, he hasn't bothered to reply because he knows manu called his bluff.

[red states rule]

manu pwned mfm, he hasn't bothered to reply because he knows manu called his bluff.

MFM is to busy melting down on other threads

Are you sure it would not be better if he "redeployed"? We do have other libs here

[DragonStryk72]

nah, its good to have MFM around, provides counter points to debates, i would be bored with solely like minds...



Jesus wouldn't run for office....

obama said in his race speech:

He couldn't, he hung with prostitutes and tax collectors. He's already a dead duck right there, the way that you've put it.

so according to him, yes it does matter and he made that speech an integral part of his platform for office.

How does his Grandfather whom he has absolutely no control over, given the comment was made prior to his birth matter in his bid for presidency?

So now, by your standard, Yurt, a candidate must be premade prior to their birth, have no one, not one in their entire family line that has ever said anything bad, in order to run for office? Well, there goes all public office.

so then it was ok to disparage solely his white grandmother without mentioning his racist black grandfather?

He wasn't "disparaging" either of them, that's your bent on it, because you entered that speech looking for something wrong with him, period. And yes, for the period, his grandmother, and his grandfather's opinion were pretty much the normal. That's how we ended up with that whole civil rights movement in the 60s and 70s. Obviously, things were not exactly smooth in those days.


i have no idea if anyone has switched sides, many guests read the forum, and many members might not say. as to what i post, pound sand... i post on many issues and if i hit the issue that obama says we cannot afford to ignore right now, don't worry your little head about it...

you didn't hit the issue, you hit his grandfather before the time of Obama's birth. Do you hold yourself by the most idiotic remark your grandparents have ever said?

so you think we should ignore race? if a KKK member was running for president, we should ignore the fact he is KKK?

Wow, surprised you didn't jump straight to Hitler to go so far off point. His grandfather said one thing, one, that had a racist slant to it, and Obama was open about it. His grandmother and his grandfather, black and white both, were in a time where, yes, those opinions were the norm, not the horribly racist comments that they are being hailed as today. that's the whole thing of things having progressed since then, is that both comments were snapshots of a time prior to affirmative action, hell prior to black being allowed into the same schools, and the same restaurants.

If you showed up at IHOP tomorrow, and you saw a sign that said, "Whites only", you would be horrified to see something like that, but back then, most whites treated it with the same amount of notice as we treat "Push" and "Pull" signs. Again, things have changed since that time, and you may want to start applying context when you read things.


edit: this guy has a strong potential to be the next president and yet stryker thinks this stuff is no big deal.....

Only because it doesn't, it's a dog & pony show item. Name one point where I have argued in favor of one of his issues. Yes, I campaign avidly about turning three words that are only offensive if viewed alone, and warped for their use, and yes, I see that as a weak stance.

Do I also figure that the years of Civil Rights progress might have altered their opinions? Yes, I do, and therefore, their opinions backs in the late 50s to early 60s really don't matter for a damn to me. He used them to illustrate a point he was making, that's all. It doesn't effect his candidacy now.

[retiredman]

i see... so when i make a claim (i thought you denied reading it in another thread) i am a liar, but when you do it...its ok...hypocrite....

have you read the entire bible, cover to cover? did your father read every single case/statute out there for everything he argued?

I have read the entire bible cover to cover. I have no idea what my father read. And given the fact that he's been dead now for just over a year, I really won't have the opportunity to get an answer from him on that anytime soon.

[retiredman]

regarding the quote that is supposedly from Obama's book. Get real. If you told me that you had read any book two years ago and I posted a single paragraph and asked you whether or not that paragraph was in the book, is anyone hear going to honestly say that they could say one way or the other?

Could Obama's paternal grandfather have written such a paragraph? I suppose so. Does that have ANY bearing on who Barack Obama is or what his views on race are in America? I don't think so, but clearly, there are those here who do.

Interesting that republicans want to make some incredibly intimate connection between Barack Obama and the words of a grandfather he never knew, yet refuse to allow any connection between the current president and his grandfather who was in cahoots with nazi germany.

[Yurt]

its interesting that those defending obama here seem so focused on what the grandfather said....when in reality the point of this thread is what obama "failed" to say. it has everything to do with his character, he made it an issue by bringing his grandmother into the political forum in order to defend his racist pastor. he said race is something we cannot ignore, but his defenders are telling us to ignore it and that it is no big deal.

obama could call you guys honkies and you'd probably say it was justified and that it doesn't really affect his candicy for president....

"typical"

[red states rule]

its interesting that those defending obama here seem so focused on what the grandfather said....when in reality the point of this thread is what obama "failed" to say. it has everything to do with his character, he made it an issue by bringing his grandmother into the political forum in order to defend his racist pastor. he said race is something we cannot ignore, but his defenders are telling us to ignore it and that it is no big deal.

obama could call you guys honkies and you'd probably say it was justified and that it doesn't really affect his candicy for president....

"typical"

Liberals are willing to sell their soul for Barry - as they did for Bill Clinton

Glasses may help them with their problem

[retiredman]

its interesting that those defending obama here seem so focused on what the grandfather said....when in reality the point of this thread is what obama "failed" to say. it has everything to do with his character, he made it an issue by bringing his grandmother into the political forum in order to defend his racist pastor. he said race is something we cannot ignore, but his defenders are telling us to ignore it and that it is no big deal.

obama could call you guys honkies and you'd probably say it was justified and that it doesn't really affect his candicy for president....

"typical"
I guess that if Obama were running for president of Kenya, the ingrained attitudes of his resident grandfather would be of some value to the debate. He is not talking about racism in Kenya, or sexism in Indonesia.... his grandmother's comments were germane to the topic. His paternal grandfather's were not.

[red states rule]

I guess that if Obama were running for president of Kenya, the ingrained attitudes of his resident grandfather would be of some value to the debate. He is not talking about racism in Kenya, or sexism in Indonesia.... his grandmother's comments were germane to the topic. His paternal grandfather's were not.

We are talking about Barry's racism, his wife's, and those in his inner circle

Something you do not want to talk about and are attempting to duck

[retiredman]

We are talking about Barry's racism, his wife's, and those in his inner circle

Something you do not want to talk about and are attempting to duck


check out the topic of the thread.

[red states rule]

check out the topic of the thread.

Well, we know where Barry got his racist views. It has handed down in the family, and reenforced by his wife and pastor

[Yurt]

I guess that if Obama were running for president of Kenya, the ingrained attitudes of his resident grandfather would be of some value to the debate. He is not talking about racism in Kenya, or sexism in Indonesia.... his grandmother's comments were germane to the topic. His paternal grandfather's were not.


am the son of a black man from Kenya and a white woman from Kansas. I was raised with the help of a white grandfather who survived a Depression to serve in Patton's Army during World War II and a white grandmother who worked on a bomber assembly line at Fort Leavenworth while he was overseas. I've gone to some of the best schools in America and lived in one of the world's poorest nations. I am married to a black American who carries within her the blood of slaves and slaveowners - an inheritance we pass on to our two precious daughters.

...

can no more disown him than I can disown the black community. I can no more disown him than I can my white grandmother - a woman who helped raise me, a woman who sacrificed again and again for me, a woman who loves me as much as she loves anything in this world, but a woman who once confessed her fear of black men who passed by her on the street, and who on more than one occasion has uttered racial or ethnic stereotypes that made me cringe.


These people are a part of me. And they are a part of America, this country that I love.

wrong again. :poke:

[red states rule]

wrong again. :poke:

MFM's streak continues

[retiredman]

wrong again. :poke:

I still do not see where his completely absent grandfather's comments are germane to the debate.

These people are a part of me. And they are a part of America, this country that I love.

His paternal grandfather is not a part of America and it not a part of the country that Obama loves.

Sorry.

[Yurt]

I still do not see where his completely absent grandfather's comments are germane to the debate.

These people are a part of me. And they are a part of America, this country that I love.

His paternal grandfather is not a part of America and it not a part of the country that Obama loves.

Sorry.

was his father around? and he specifically said he was apart of him. the blood of slaves is passed down to his daughters, yet you somehow think nothing from his grandfather was passed down. if he was so absent, why then did he write the letter about sullying the blood with a white woman?

you also are again missing the point. it wasn't about the grandmother being around (he mentioned the black community as well and you cannot say he "grew up" with the black community) more than his grandfather, he used her comments to justify wright's comments. it is the height of hypocrisy to publically condemn your grandmother like that and then wholly ingore your racist grandfather.

[retiredman]

was his father around? and he specifically said he was apart of him. the blood of slaves is passed down to his daughters, yet you somehow think nothing from his grandfather was passed down. if he was so absent, why then did he write the letter about sullying the blood with a white woman?

you also are again missing the point. it wasn't about the grandmother being around (he mentioned the black community as well and you cannot say he "grew up" with the black community) more than his grandfather, he used her comments to justify wright's comments. it is the height of hypocrisy to publically condemn your grandmother like that and then wholly ingore your racist grandfather.

the topic of discussion in which his grandmother was mentioned concerned racial attitudes in America. His paternal grandfather has nothing to do with that topic.

[Yurt]

am the son of a black man from Kenya and a white woman from Kansas

is the light coming on yet? the paragraph was about disowning people who are apart of him.... think real hard mfm, it may just come to you someday

[glockmail]

the topic of discussion in which his grandmother was mentioned concerned racial attitudes in America. His paternal grandfather has nothing to do with that topic. So the racial attitude of gramps wasn't worth mentioning then, even though it was the same thing?

[mundame]

So the racial attitude of gramps wasn't worth mentioning then, even though it was the same thing?

You know, that's a good point, really. It seems to mean Obama is prejudiced against his white grandmother who raised him because she is afraid of young black men roaming around acting dangerous, and he'll hold her up to public scorn, but he's not going to mention his black Kenyan grandfather who abandoned him and who is grossly prejudiced against whites.

I think that's a double standard. It's supposed to be okay always to resent whatever whites say, but Obama's supposed to excuse whatever a black says --- that's always just fine, even if it's very extreme, like his grandfather and his pastor's talk.

[red states rule]

but Obama's supposed to excuse whatever a black says --- that's always just fine, even if it's very extreme, like his grandfather and his pastor's talk.

and his wife, and inner circle of advisors

[glockmail]

You know, that's a good point, really. It seems to mean Obama is prejudiced against his white grandmother who raised him because she is afraid of young black men roaming around acting dangerous, and he'll hold her up to public scorn, but he's not going to mention his black Kenyan grandfather who abandoned him and who is grossly prejudiced against whites.

I think that's a double standard. It's supposed to be okay always to resent whatever whites say, but Obama's supposed to excuse whatever a black says --- that's always just fine, even if it's very extreme, like his grandfather and his pastor's talk.The only reasonable conclusion that I can come up with is that Obama is racist.

[retiredman]

So the racial attitude of gramps wasn't worth mentioning then, even though it was the same thing?

why would a candidate for president of the united states, in a speech about the racial issues that divide THIS country, feel compelled to mention the racist attitudes of an ancestor who have never even been to America and who he had never even met? Clearly it is NOT the "same thing".

[retiredman]

The only reasonable conclusion that I can come up with is that Obama is racist.


please realize that other reasonable people might, in fact, be able to come arrive at other possible alternatives.

[red states rule]

why would a candidate for president of the united states, in a speech about the racial issues that divide THIS country, feel compelled to mention the racist attitudes of an ancestor who have never even been to America and who he had never even met? Clearly it is NOT the "same thing".

We can all see now how a Pres Barry will "unite" the nation

Better then how he uniting his party

[red states rule]

please realize that other reasonable people might, in fact, be able to come arrive at other possible alternatives.

Only if they ignore what he says, what he does, and who is considers his friends

[glockmail]

why would a candidate for president of the united states, in a speech about the racial issues that divide THIS country, feel compelled to mention the racist attitudes of an ancestor who have never even been to America and who he had never even met? Clearly it is NOT the "same thing".


please realize that other reasonable people might, in fact, be able to come arrive at other possible alternatives.
As I said before:
Obama threw his white grandmother under the bus to defend his black preacher's racism. Why didn't he also mention his racist grandfather in the same explanation? What his grandmother said was a casual remark (and cannot be proven). His grandfather's words were written to try and convince someone to abandon a love affair, and therefore would have been chosen more carefully, and Obama has documented those statements.

Any reasonable, intellectually honest person would conclude that Obama is therefore racist.

[retiredman]

As I said before:

Any reasonable, intellectually honest person would conclude that Obama is therefore racist.

That is certainly your opinion. thank you for expressing it. I happen to disagree with it. I am quite certain that many reasonable intellectually honest people would conclude that Obama is not a racist.

[red states rule]

That is certainly your opinion. thank you for expressing it. I happen to disagree with it. I am quite certain that many reasonable intellectually honest people would conclude that Obama is not a racist.

When did you, and other Obama manics become intellectually honest?

All of you ignore what Barry has said, done, and the racists he hangs out with

[retiredman]

When did you, and other Obama manics become intellectually honest?

All of you ignore what Barry has said, done, and the racists he hangs out with

I disagree with your opinion of me, of Obama and of his associates.

[red states rule]

I disagree with your opinion of me, of Obama and of his associates.

Why would you admit you support racists now after all your lame defenses of their racism?

You are showing your intellectually dishonesty once again

[retiredman]

Why would you admit you support racists now after all your lame defenses of their racism?

You are showing your intellectually dishonesty once again

because I disagree with your opinion does not make me intellectually dishonest, RSR. I do not happen to believe that Obama is a racist. Many smart and well meaning people of good will agree with my assessment.

[REDWHITEBLUE2]

because I disagree with your opinion does not make me intellectually dishonest, RSR. I do not happen to believe that Obama is a racist. Many smart and well meaning people of good will agree with my assessment. Wrong most god fearing christians have seen and heard Barrick the Racist Negro spew his hate and discontent towards America and white people. only a very small group of Liberals FALL for his Racist BS

[red states rule]

Wrong most god fearing christians have seen and heard Barrick the Racist Negro spew his hate and discontent towards America and white people. only a very small group of Liberals FALL for his Racist BS

Even Dems are getting pissed at Barry

A new poll came out today showing Hillary back up to a 20 point lead in PA

[glockmail]

That is certainly your opinion. thank you for expressing it. I happen to disagree with it. I am quite certain that many reasonable intellectually honest people would conclude that Obama is not a racist.Well I have a simple test for that. Have a white person say the exact same thing, except substitute "white" for "black" and vice-versa, to a black audience, and see if they get offended. By that reasonable, intellectually honest test, you would be wrong.:poke:

[red states rule]

Well I have a simple test for that. Have a white person say the exact same thing, except substitute "white" for "black" and vice-versa, to a black audience, and see if they get offended. By that reasonable, intellectually honest test, you would be wrong.:poke:

Is the white person a Republican or a Dem? That would make a difference in the liberal world of Oz

[glockmail]

Is the white person a Republican or a Dem? That would make a difference in the liberal world of Oz
Yes it would, but in this case lets just say that the black audience is open minded and reasonable, and doesn't know what the politics of the white speaker are.

[retiredman]

Wrong most god fearing christians have seen and heard Barrick the Racist Negro spew his hate and discontent towards America and white people. only a very small group of Liberals FALL for his Racist BS

got a link to some survey of "most God fearing Christians?, or am I just supposed to believe that God told you so in a vision?:fu:

[retiredman]

Well I have a simple test for that. Have a white person say the exact same thing, except substitute "white" for "black" and vice-versa, to a black audience, and see if they get offended. By that reasonable, intellectually honest test, you would be wrong.:poke:

I disagree that such a test would prove your point.

And your opinion as to what is reasonable and intellectually honest is, not only an opinion, it is self serving.

[red states rule]

I disagree that such a test would prove your point.

And your opinion as to what is reasonable and intellectually honest is, not only an opinion, it is self serving.

You all about being self serving

[retiredman]

You all about being self serving

are you really just posting with nothing other than insults for content? pretty lame

[red states rule]

are you really just posting with nothing other than insults for content? pretty lame

You whining about insults? That is a hoot!

[retiredman]

You whining about insults? That is a hoot!


I am not whining. I am commenting. I am commenting on the lack of intellectual content in your posts.... it is far from a whine...it is more like a chuckle!:lol:

[red states rule]

I am not whining. I am commenting. I am commenting on the lack of intellectual content in your posts.... it is far from a whine...it is more like a chuckle!:lol:

What would you know about intellectual content in posts?

Try commenting about things you know best

Like being an anti semitic bigot

[DragonStryk72]

its interesting that those defending obama here seem so focused on what the grandfather said....when in reality the point of this thread is what obama "failed" to say. it has everything to do with his character, he made it an issue by bringing his grandmother into the political forum in order to defend his racist pastor. he said race is something we cannot ignore, but his defenders are telling us to ignore it and that it is no big deal.

obama could call you guys honkies and you'd probably say it was justified and that it doesn't really affect his candicy for president....

"typical"

Okay, neither I, nor anyone else for that matter, is going through a fucking ten hour long lecture on race and politics. I would rather be beaten to death with a nerf bat. He made his point with a single example, instead of using every possible instance. Big Whoop.

you want to attack his actual issues, go right ahead. Again, I have not once defended those, but these bs threads about his grandmother, his grandfather, what's next, his ancestral tribal chief was once bitter over England taking over everything?

His grandfather is not him, unless you can prove otherwise, and I would seriously like to know just when it will be that he gets the time machine to go back and conceive his father.

[Yurt]

Okay, neither I, nor anyone else for that matter, is going through a fucking ten hour long lecture on race and politics. I would rather be beaten to death with a nerf bat. He made his point with a single example, instead of using every possible instance. Big Whoop.

you want to attack his actual issues, go right ahead. Again, I have not once defended those, but these bs threads about his grandmother, his grandfather, what's next, his ancestral tribal chief was once bitter over England taking over everything?

His grandfather is not him, unless you can prove otherwise, and I would seriously like to know just when it will be that he gets the time machine to go back and conceive his father.

you sure spent a lot of time defending his lack of mentioning his grandfather.... :clap:

[Abbey Marie]

you sure spent a lot of time defending his lack of mentioning his grandfather.... :clap:

If his grandfather is "not him", then why is his grandmother, "us"?

[Yurt]

If his grandfather is "not him", then why is his grandmother, "us"?

thats a head scratcher...i tried to explain it to mfm up above, but it fell on deaf ears...especially when i mentioned that obama says his daughters have inherited the blood of slaves

[retiredman]

thats a head scratcher...i tried to explain it to mfm up above, but it fell on deaf ears...especially when i mentioned that obama says his daughters have inherited the blood of slaves


Obama's grandfather did not pass on any of that slave blood to Obama's kids... Obama's speech was about American racism experienced by blacks in America, and about how whites in America are struggling with the remedies. Barack's paternal grandfather was not a part of the narrative.

[mundame]

thats a head scratcher...i tried to explain it to mfm up above, but it fell on deaf ears...especially when i mentioned that obama says his daughters have inherited the blood of slaves


Either Obama is delusional, or else he thinks his wife cheated on him with some other black man.

[mundame]

I guess he COULD be using the words "blacks" and "slaves" interchangably, but that doesn't sound very Black Pride, somehow.

I can't figure out how Oobleck can say his daughters have slave blood --- if he did say that. http://macg.net/emoticons/scratchhead1.gif

[retiredman]

I guess he COULD be using the words "blacks" and "slaves" interchangably, but that doesn't sound very Black Pride, somehow.

I can't figure out how Oobleck can say his daughters have slave blood --- if he did say that. http://macg.net/emoticons/scratchhead1.gif


you don't think that Michelle Robinson Obama can trace her family tree to slaves in America?

[mundame]

you don't think that Michelle Robinson Obama can trace her family tree to slaves in America?


Omigod!! You are right!! Silly me, I forgot the wife. http://bestsmileys.com/signs11/7.gif

Thanx for solving that puzzle!

[Yurt]

Obama's grandfather did not pass on any of that slave blood to Obama's kids... Obama's speech was about American racism experienced by blacks in America, and about how whites in America are struggling with the remedies. Barack's paternal grandfather was not a part of the narrative.

i already pointed out where he mentioned his kenyan father and that these people are "apart" of him...ergo genius, his grandfather is as well and if you actually go back and read the OP, the paragraph entwines his grandfather with race in america.

you've lost this argument, just let it go

[retiredman]

i already pointed out where he mentioned his kenyan father and that these people are "apart" of him...ergo genius, his grandfather is as well and if you actually go back and read the OP, the paragraph entwines his grandfather with race in america.

you've lost this argument, just let it go

he mentioned that his father was a part of him. He did not mention that his paternal grandfather - who he never even met - was a part of him, and he certainly wasn't a part of his experiences with racism in America...which was the topic of the speech.

But Gosh Yurt. I must have missed the announcement from Jimmy where he appointed you as the judge and arbiter for all threads and arguments. Could you link me to that post because it certainly sounds, from your sort of matter of fact - (some might say "pompous" if they didn't know that you were really the blameless super swell guy that I know you to be) - sounding pronouncements as to the results of the argument and your assertive direction to me as to what I should do about that loss.

I am sure such a post from Jimmy must exist so just give me a link to it so that I can get some closure and begin to get used to your new judicial arbitration role here. It seems almost like you have been elevated to some form of minor DP deity, and I, for one, can't think of a more blameless, pure, super swell guy than you to become our conscience and our judge.

[red states rule]

Either Obama is delusional, or else he thinks his wife cheated on him with some other black man.

No, he is just a racist who hates whitey, and has a very low opinion of Amercia

[red states rule]

you don't think that Michelle Robinson Obama can trace her family tree to slaves in America?

Yes, and she is in the fruit section of her family tree

[retiredman]

I would be proud were my daughter to become a sucessful corporate attorney. but again.... your post avoids the issue and dodges from the direction of the thread to resort to insults.

[red states rule]

I would be proud were my daughter to become a sucessful corporate attorney. but again.... your post avoids the issue and dodges from the direction of the thread to resort to insults.

She is a racist liberal who goes out of her way to smear her country

A country that gave her the opprotunity to attend the best schools, earn a huge income, buy a $1 plus home, and have her husband elected to the US Senate

Yet all she rants about is how lousy a country America is

[retiredman]

She is a racist liberal who goes out of her way to smear her country

A country that gave her the opprotunity to attend the best schools, earn a huge income, buy a $1 plus home, and have her husband elected to the US Senate

Yet all she rants about is how lousy a country America is

She has never said that America is a lousy country.

And the thread is about Obama's grandfather and why he did not feel the need to mention HIM in his speech from Phildelphia on race. Try not to dodge it.

[red states rule]

She has never said that America is a lousy country.

And the thread is about Obama's grandfather and why he did not feel the need to mention HIM in his speech from Phildelphia on race. Try not to dodge it.

Bullshit

Ms Obama has called America a mean country. She called Americans ignorant. She called her white classmates black oppressors

Like her husband she has a severe case of hate whitey syndrome

[glockmail]

I disagree that such a test would prove your point.

And your opinion as to what is reasonable and intellectually honest is, not only an opinion, it is self serving. Then perhaps you could come up with a better test. I'll wait.

[retiredman]

Then perhaps you could come up with a better test. I'll wait.

I have no need to.

[glockmail]

I have no need to.That's because you are unable to. As usual your "opinion" is baseless.

[red states rule]

That's because you are unable to. As usual your "opinion" is baseless.

He is ducking Ms Obama's commenting smearing America as well

[red states rule]

Hey MFM, here is Ms Obama showing her socialist side

The latest example was Mrs. Obama's appearance in Harrisburg, Pa., where she told a group of mothers: "If we don't wake up as a nation with a new kind of leadership, for how we want this country to work, then we won't get universal health care. The truth is, in order to get things like universal health care and a revamped education system, then someone is going to have to give up a piece of their pie so that someone else can have more."


http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2001271/posts
__________________

[retiredman]

That's because you are unable to. As usual your "opinion" is baseless.

no. your opinion of my opinion is not all that important to me. I think that Obama's views on race are wise. I think to pretend to look at America as homogenous and to consider the history of race as irrelevant to the way we interract today is silly. Your opinion is based in your beliefs and prejudices, just as mine is in mine.

[red states rule]

no. your opinion of my opinion is not all that important to me. I think that Obama's views on race are wise. I think to pretend to look at America as homogenous and to consider the history of race as irrelevant to the way we interract today is silly. Your opinion is based in your beliefs and prejudices, just as mine is in mine.

So being a guilt ridden white liberal, you give him the racist Obama, and his wife, a pass

What a shocker!

[retiredman]

Hey MFM, here is Ms Obama showing her socialist side

The latest example was Mrs. Obama's appearance in Harrisburg, Pa., where she told a group of mothers: "If we don't wake up as a nation with a new kind of leadership, for how we want this country to work, then we won't get universal health care. The truth is, in order to get things like universal health care and a revamped education system, then someone is going to have to give up a piece of their pie so that someone else can have more."


http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2001271/posts
__________________

I am waiting for you to discuss the topic of this thread. Why do you think that the attitudes ofObama's paternal grandfather, who Obama never knew, who never even set foot in America, are somehow relevant to the discussion of race relations in the United States.

And then, after you discuss the thread topic, you might find me a quote from Michelle Obama where she called America a - quote - lousy country - unquote.

[red states rule]

I am waiting for you to discuss the topic of this thread. Why do you think that the attitudes ofObama's paternal grandfather, who Obama never knew, who never even set foot in America, are somehow relevant to the discussion of race relations in the United States.

And then, after you discuss the thread topic, you might find me a quote from Michelle Obama where she called America a - quote - lousy country - unquote.

Nice dodge. You can't defend her socialist views

I told you what she said about America, and you ignored those quotes as well

As far as her socialist comment

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?t=13591

[retiredman]

Nice dodge. You can't defend her socialist views

I told you what she said about America, and you ignored those quotes as well

As far as her socialist comment

http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?t=13591


dodge? what is the topic of this thread?:laugh2:

I have ZERO problems with her statements about universal health care and her statements about giving up a piece of the pie is completely in line with the progressive tax structure that has been the hallmark of the income tax system in America since its inception.

NO quotes yet from Michelle where she called America a quote lousy country unquote?

Or do you want to revise that?

[retiredman]

and do you understand what the phrase "pure socialism" REALLY means, or are you relying on Rush talking points again?

[DragonStryk72]

i already pointed out where he mentioned his kenyan father and that these people are "apart" of him...ergo genius, his grandfather is as well and if you actually go back and read the OP, the paragraph entwines his grandfather with race in america.

you've lost this argument, just let it go

I got a buddy, Josh, who was physically abused growing up. His father who beat him is still "a part" of him, even though obviously Josh is against Josh getting beaten by his dad, and child abuse in general. Same thing here, just cause your parents, or your grandparents, did something that was dickheaded, does not mean that you are bound to do so yourself. Amazing how that works, isn't it, where we actually become our own entity, greater than the sum of our "parts"?

[red states rule]

dodge? what is the topic of this thread?:laugh2:

I have ZERO problems with her statements about universal health care and her statements about giving up a piece of the pie is completely in line with the progressive tax structure that has been the hallmark of the income tax system in America since its inception.

NO quotes yet from Michelle where she called America a quote lousy country unquote?

Or do you want to revise that?

It is part of her socialist mindset. Redistribute the wealth

As far as her quotes

Obama begins with a broad assessment of life in America in 2008, and life is not good: we're a divided country, we're a country that is "just downright mean," we are "guided by fear," we're a nation of cynics, sloths, and complacents. "We have become a nation of struggling folks who are barely making it every day," she said, as heads bobbed in the pews. "Folks are just jammed up, and it's gotten worse over

http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2008/03/05/michelle-obama-america-just-downright-mean


It is possible that Black individuals chose to or felt pressured to come together. . . because of the belief that Blacks must join in solidarity to combat a White oppressor," she wrote.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1978284/posts


MICHELLE OBAMA CALLING AMERICANS IGNORANT

“Because sometimes it’s easier to hold on to your own stereotypes and misconceptions. It makes you feel justified in your own ignorance… That’s America. So the challenge for us is are we ready for change?”

http://mpinkeyes.wordpress.com/2008/03/28/michelle-obama-calls-americans-ignorant/


and she tells her supporters one thing while doing another

"We left corporate America, which is a lot of what we're asking young people to do. Don't go into corporate America. You know, become teachers. Work for the community. Be social workers. Be a nurse. Those are the careers that we need, and we're encouraging our young people to do that. But if you make that choice, as we did, to move out of the money-making industry into the helping industry, then your salaries respond and many of our bright stars are going into corporate law or hedge-fund management."

[DragonStryk72]

dodge? what is the topic of this thread?:laugh2:

I have ZERO problems with her statements about universal health care and her statements about giving up a piece of the pie is completely in line with the progressive tax structure that has been the hallmark of the income tax system in America since its inception.

NO quotes yet from Michelle where she called America a quote lousy country unquote?

Or do you want to revise that?

Wait, gonna have to rein you in there. It was a flat tax at inception, not a progressive tax. That came later on, about the early 30s.

[retiredman]

I got a buddy, Josh, who was physically abused growing up. His father who beat him is still "a part" of him, even though obviously Josh is against Josh getting beaten by his dad, and child abuse in general. Same thing here, just cause your parents, or your grandparents, did something that was dickheaded, does not mean that you are bound to do so yourself. Amazing how that works, isn't it, where we actually become our own entity, greater than the sum of our "parts"?


PRECISELY! And Obama's speech had to do with race issues in AMERICA! What his paternal grandfather from Kenya - who had never met his grandson nor never travelled to America - said is of ZERO relevance to the discussion. The "counselor" just wants to continue to throw mud at Obama and hopes that some of it sticks.

[glockmail]

no. your opinion of my opinion is not all that important to me. I think that Obama's views on race are wise. I think to pretend to look at America as homogenous and to consider the history of race as irrelevant to the way we interract today is silly. Your opinion is based in your beliefs and prejudices, just as mine is in mine.

Sure. That's why you continue to respond. :rolleyes:

Obama's views are very wise, although self-serving, as his race is the only reason why he is popular, all else being equal, over another Liberal Democrat. He is the beneficiary of years of race-baiting and resultant white guilt. I'm smart enough not to buy into that.

Again you refer to my opinion, but what we are really talking about is the test for racism that I proposed. It’s not my test, as I've heard similar tests exposed by many. Since you are unable to argue against the test, or propose a reasonable alternate, I’m calling your cowering into “my opinion, your opinion” mode as your loss of an argument without the manliness to admit it.

[retiredman]

RSR.... I still don't see the quote from Mrs. Obama where she calls America a "lousy country". Have you not found that one yet?

[red states rule]

RSR.... I still don't see the quote from Mrs. Obama where she calls America a "lousy country". Have you not found that one yet?

Nice tapdance

All she has done is rant about how lousy the US is. I guess you feel she is signing the praises of the country that gave her all the tools to have a successful life

[retiredman]

Sure. That's why you continue to respond. :rolleyes:

Obama's views are very wise, although self-serving, as his race is the only reason why he is popular, all else being equal, over another Liberal Democrat. He is the beneficiary of years of race-baiting and resultant white guilt. I'm smart enough not to buy into that.

Again you refer to my opinion, but what we are really talking about is the test for racism that I proposed. It’s not my test, as I've heard similar tests exposed by many. Since you are unable to argue against the test, or propose a reasonable alternate, I’m calling your cowering into “my opinion, your opinion” mode as your loss of an argument without the manliness to admit it.

I think that the "test for racism" that you have contrived is not valid. I am not sure that there can or ought to be a simple test for racism. It is a much more complex and multifaceted issue than one that can be determined in such a simplistic fashion. And I find your cyber macho puffery where you call my "manliness" into question to be simultaneously funny and pathetic.

[glockmail]

I think that the "test for racism" that you have contrived is not valid. I am not sure that there can or ought to be a simple test for racism. It is a much more complex and multifaceted issue than one that can be determined in such a simplistic fashion. And I find your cyber macho puffery where you call my "manliness" into question to be simultaneously funny and pathetic. People make a decision if a comment is racist intuitively and rapid, so a test for it should be the same. I realize you Liberal Elites want to make a college course out of it but as usual that's not necessary or wise.

There’s no puffing on my part. You can man up and admit that this test is reasonable, make up your own, or wimp out and use your opinion excuse again. Personally I hope you fall back on the opinion thing again as that’s what I expect, and I’ll get my victory that way.

[red states rule]

I think that the "test for racism" that you have contrived is not valid. I am not sure that there can or ought to be a simple test for racism. It is a much more complex and multifaceted issue than one that can be determined in such a simplistic fashion. And I find your cyber macho puffery where you call my "manliness" into question to be simultaneously funny and pathetic.

Obama's slurs on rural voters, his racism, his moonbat wife, and hate filled pastor is finally taking its toll

Barry is now down by 20 points in PA

http://americanresearchgroup.com/

[glockmail]

Obama's slurs on rural voters, his racism, his moonbat wife, and hate filled pastor is finally taking its toll

Barry is now down by 20 points in PA

http://americanresearchgroup.com/
This contest is the most fun that I've had with my clothes on. It will be great when Hillary is 49% to Barry's 50 on pledged delegates, and she "miraculously" gets enough Super Delegates to win the nom. I can just see the look of false surprise on her face, with that little smirk that she does with a nod to Bill, and the total look of shock on the faces of black voters.

I'll be glued to the TV with my doors locked, my beer drawer full.

[retiredman]

People make a decision if a comment is racist intuitively and rapid, so a test for it should be the same. I realize you Liberal Elites want to make a college course out of it but as usual that's not necessary or wise.

There’s no puffing on my part. You can man up and admit that this test is reasonable, make up your own, or wimp out and use your opinion excuse again. Personally I hope you fall back on the opinion thing again as that’s what I expect, and I’ll get my victory that way.

snap decisions about such things are unwise, IMHO. I think the test is UNreasonable. I have no need to make up my own and feel that any such test would be inaccurate simply by nature of its forced brevity. And again...you - of all people - discussing my "manliness" is really quite funny.

[retiredman]

Obama's slurs on rural voters, his racism, his moonbat wife, and hate filled pastor is finally taking its toll

Barry is now down by 20 points in PA

http://americanresearchgroup.com/

what does your favorite site, RCP, think about the race in PA?

[red states rule]

what does your favorite site, RCP, think about the race in PA?

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/pa/pennsylvania_democratic_primary-240.html

The current poll is not included in the AVERAGE poll number MFM

Your boy may be tanking and you do not want to admit it

[retiredman]

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/pa/pennsylvania_democratic_primary-240.html

Your boy may be tanking


maybe. we'll see soon enough, won't we?:coffee:

[red states rule]

maybe. we'll see soon enough, won't we?:coffee:

As long as the Obama's keep talking, you can count on it

[mundame]

Barry is now down by 20 points in PA


Twenty points down is a LOT. It's hard to believe that could come true.

If it's anything like Hillary leading by that much, however, I would think the Dems had better consider if there is likely to be a population "surge" away from Obama in the general election, leaving them losers yet again despite this being the year they can hardly help winning the White House.

[red states rule]

Twenty points down is a LOT. It's hard to believe that could come true.

If it's anything like Hillary leading by that much, however, I would think the Dems had better consider if there is likely to be a population "surge" away from Obama in the general election, leaving them losers yet again despite this being the year they can hardly help winning the White House.

I do not care if it is Barry or Hillary

Both will have a hard time winning in November. One is a black racist, and the other is a serial liar

Both are typical tax and spend liberals

[retiredman]

As long as the Obama's keep talking, you can count on it

that is certainly your opinion. thanks for sharing.

[retiredman]

I do not care if it is Barry or Hillary

Both will have a hard time winning in November. One is a black racist, and the other is a serial liar

Both are typical tax and spend liberals


if you don't care, why, as a republican, do you feel compelled to attempt to sababtoge the democrat's primary process, especially when you claim you won't even be voting for the republican candidate?

[iraqwarvet]

After this whole issue of Barak Obama's Racist Pastor came out, everyone started to point fingers at Barak and say that they cannot believe he would raise his children in that church, and many have talked about the other racists in his life. To that I have to say just a few things. About 5 years ago the Catholic Church came into some major trouble when it came out in the press that they had been moving Priests from church to church in order to hide child molestation that was occuring. It all became too much for the church to keep quiet, and the media grabbed it up like candy.

When certain priests came under fire, the church would move them out of the country to avoid prosecution, and the church, knowing about the child molestation, allowed these priests to continue preaching in church. Hundreds of millions of dollars have been paid out by the church over the past few years to settle just some of these cases out of court, and the problems are no where near over for the church.

Having said that, there are millions of people world-wide who continue to take their families to the Catholic Church, well knowing that it is an organization that allowed these horrible things to happen, and then tried everything in their power to protect the priests who performed these horrible acts. Why do they take their families to the church?; because they don't go because of the priest, they go to worship God, and they are willing to look past all of those horrible things to support the church they believe in.

Having said that, I denounce these people who have called Barak a racist, because he simply is not. Just because his preacher occasionally preached racist comments from the pulpit does not mean that Barak is racist and is raising rasict children. That is simply proposterous.

The point I would like to make is that Barak is religious, elloquent, very intelligent, has continually fought for the underdog throughout his entire career, and is a great person. We need to stop talking about his race, just as we need to stop talking about Clinton's gender. We need to look at the fact that our nation is in economic trouble and we need a person, male or female, black or white, to come in and pick us back up and bring us back to the top again. Am I saying Barak is the answer...no, but I am saying that I feel he is getting improperly flogged on the above issues.

[Trigg]

After this whole issue of Barak Obama's Racist Pastor came out, everyone started to point fingers at Barak and say that they cannot believe he would raise his children in that church, and many have talked about the other racists in his life. To that I have to say just a few things. About 5 years ago the Catholic Church came into some major trouble when it came out in the press that they had been moving Priests from church to church in order to hide child molestation that was occuring. It all became too much for the church to keep quiet, and the media grabbed it up like candy.

When certain priests came under fire, the church would move them out of the country to avoid prosecution, and the church, knowing about the child molestation, allowed these priests to continue preaching in church. Hundreds of millions of dollars have been paid out by the church over the past few years to settle just some of these cases out of court, and the problems are no where near over for the church.

Having said that, there are millions of people world-wide who continue to take their families to the Catholic Church, well knowing that it is an organization that allowed these horrible things to happen, and then tried everything in their power to protect the priests who performed these horrible acts. Why do they take their families to the church?; because they don't go because of the priest, they go to worship God, and they are willing to look past all of those horrible things to support the church they believe in.

Having said that, I denounce these people who have called Barak a racist, because he simply is not. Just because his preacher occasionally preached racist comments from the pulpit does not mean that Barak is racist and is raising rasict children. That is simply proposterous.

The point I would like to make is that Barak is religious, elloquent, very intelligent, has continually fought for the underdog throughout his entire career, and is a great person. We need to stop talking about his race, just as we need to stop talking about Clinton's gender. We need to look at the fact that our nation is in economic trouble and we need a person, male or female, black or white, to come in and pick us back up and bring us back to the top again. Am I saying Barak is the answer...no, but I am saying that I feel he is getting improperly flogged on the above issues.

Obama's situation is different. He chose to attend a church with a racist anti-semite as the preacher. He could have chosen to attend a different church in the same city and the same denomination.

No one is asking him to change religions. You're emplying Catholics leave the religion en mass, which is assinine. If I'm not mistaken the Cathloics themselves outed the churches practices. Did Obama stand up and scold this man for his racist views? No, he called him an uncle.

See the difference?

[glockmail]

snap decisions about such things are unwise, IMHO. I think the test is UNreasonable. I have no need to make up my own and feel that any such test would be inaccurate simply by nature of its forced brevity. And again...you - of all people - discussing my "manliness" is really quite funny.


Its not that you have no need to make up your own, but that you can't make up a better one, therefore you have been pwned yet again. Thus your insult, as an attempt to draw attention away from that. :lol:

[retiredman]

Its not that you have no need to make up your own, but that you can't make up a better one, therefore you have been pwned yet again. Thus your insult, as an attempt to draw attention away from that. :lol:

no. I have no need to attempt to create a simple test for a complex issue.

I am not "insulting" you, I am laughing at you for your silly references to manliness in the context of a difference of opinion.

your obsession with "pwning" is really quite adolescent, by the way. Let's try to discuss things like adults. Would you like to try that for a change?

[glockmail]

no. I have no need to attempt to create a simple test for a complex issue.

I am not "insulting" you, I am laughing at you for your silly references to manliness in the context of a difference of opinion.

your obsession with "pwning" is really quite adolescent, by the way. Let's try to discuss things like adults. Would you like to try that for a change?

Actually racism is very simple: simple minded people fear things that they are unfamiliar with or do not understand. That's why so many Democrats are racist.

As I expected, you can't even man-up to your insult. Score another one for me.

Adults don't toss out insults to avoid admitting that they lost an argument. Instead thay simply admit when they are wrong or have been bested. Shit it took nearly a year for you to admit you insulted my young son and I with a pedophile remark. No I've given up treating you as an adult long ago. :lol:

[red states rule]

if you don't care, why, as a republican, do you feel compelled to attempt to sababtoge the democrat's primary process, especially when you claim you won't even be voting for the republican candidate?

You CLAIM to listen to Rush, but you do not have a clue to what the goals of Operation Chaos is all about

The objectives are:

to prolong the Dems civil war

to give the Clintons time to bloody up Obama

drain the DNC and the candidates of cash

pluck the nerves of the liberal media

and enjoy watching the Dems rip each other apart

So far Operation Chaos is esceeding all goals!!!!!!

[retiredman]

You CLAIM to listen to Rush, but you do not have a clue to what the goals of Operation Chaos is all about

The objectives are:

to prolong the Dems civil war

to give the Clintons time to bloody up Obama

drain the DNC and the candidates of cash

pluck the nerves of the liberal media

and enjoy watching the Dems rip each other apart

So far Operation Chaos is esceeding all goals!!!!!!

all in an effort to elect McCain...a guy you can't bring yourself to vote for.

that makes a lot of sense!

[red states rule]

all in an effort to elect McCain...a guy you can't bring yourself to vote for.

that makes a lot of sense!

You really do have a reading comprehension problem. The obejectives do not state a preference on who is elected

Just to play havoc witht he Dem

Which is working perfectly :laugh2:

[Yurt]

I got a buddy, Josh, who was physically abused growing up. His father who beat him is still "a part" of him, even though obviously Josh is against Josh getting beaten by his dad, and child abuse in general. Same thing here, just cause your parents, or your grandparents, did something that was dickheaded, does not mean that you are bound to do so yourself. Amazing how that works, isn't it, where we actually become our own entity, greater than the sum of our "parts"?


it appears you do not understand the OP point, that is, why did he throw his white grandmother under the bus, so as to justify his pastor, and intentionally leave out his grandfather who also made racist comments....he brought up his kenyan heritage in the speech...yet to you and mfm his kenyan grandfather should be excluded from the topic of race. that is too narrow a view of his speech. and, according to obama, his daughters have "slave blood" in them, so yes, according to obama, the abusive blood would run to him.

i suggest you read his speech, if not the speech, at least the quotations i provide more carefully.

are you both claiming that obama only cares about race in america and no where else? i have a feeling it really doesn't matter to you both as you will find any justification for his pastor and his racism.....and you will denounce those who call them on their racist BS. fact is, if they were white, you both would think very, very different.

obama even brought up his first book in the speech, so fair game to bring in the book. he also talked about the message of taking the race message into the wider world:


Those stories - of survival, and freedom, and hope - became our story, my story; the blood that had spilled was our blood, the tears our tears; until this black church, on this bright day, seemed once more a vessel carrying the story of a people into future generations and into a larger world. Our trials and triumphs became at once unique and universal,

his grandfather also made racist remarks in the 50's and 60's and thus relevant to his race speech:


This is the reality in which Reverend Wright and other African-Americans of his generation grew up. They came of age in the late fifties and early sixties, a time when segregation was still the law of the land and opportunity was systematically constricted.

yet you think just because he is kenyan that it excuses his failure to address that racism, NOT only existed among white americans, BUT among black kenyans. that is the broader picture, not the narrow view that you espouse.

you should both carefully read the speech. it is obtuse for you to claim i have an obsession with the speech, given obama's proclamation that RACE is not something we can ignore right now.

[retiredman]

and, according to obama, his daughters have "slave blood" in them, so yes, according to obama, the abusive blood would run to him.
again, are you suggesting that Michelle Obama is not the descendant of slaves? Barack Obama is not.

are you both claiming that obama only cares about race in america and no where else? i have a feeling it really doesn't matter to you both as you will find any justification for his pastor and his racism.....and you will denounce those who call them on their racist BS. fact is, if they were white, you both would think very, very different.

I am claiming that he is running for president of the United States and not Kenya. I recommend you read http://www.christiancentury.org/article.lasso?id=4676 the editor's page from The Christian Century, and go back and visit their webpage again later on this week when the April 22nd edition, which I have in print, is published online and read articles entitled "The Wright Context" and "The Rest of the Story" which might give you a broader perspective on the Reverend Wright controversy....but we both know you won't do that because you really don't want to UNDERSTAND Reverend Wright OR Barack Obama, but only denigrate and denounce them. One cannot say, however, that I did not try to enlighten you.

yet you think just because he is kenyan that it excuses his failure to address that racism, NOT only existed among white americans, BUT among black kenyans. that is the broader picture, not the narrow view that you espouse.

when the topic of the speech was racial problems in AMERICA, I really am quite comfortable "narrowing" my view to AMERICA.

you should both carefully read the speech. it is obtuse for you to claim i have an obsession with the speech, given obama's proclamation that RACE is not something we can ignore right now.

I am not obtuse to claim that your obsession with comments from a man who Obama never met and who never has set foot in America are irrelevant to a discussion by Obama of race relations IN AMERICA. We both know why you are obsessed with this, and the answer, sadly enough, is not very pretty.

[Yurt]

you can keep your narrowminded enlightenment....last time you told me that if i "stuck with you" i would learn about the bible....only to be called a christ killer

fact remains very clear - he made race a much broader issue than just america in his speech, of course he "tailored" his speech for americans, however, as i clearly delineated from his speech .... his story is going to be told to the world and the message is universal.

your choice to ignore facts

[retiredman]

you can keep your narrowminded enlightenment....last time you told me that if i "stuck with you" i would learn about the bible....only to be called a christ killer

fact remains very clear - he made race a much broader issue than just america in his speech, of course he "tailored" his speech for americans, however, as i clearly delineated from his speech .... his story is going to be told to the world and the message is universal.

your choice to ignore facts

and clearly, you did NOT "stick with me" but went right back to insulting me and then threw your typical hissy fit when I retaliated. Cry me a fucking river, you pussy.

have you read the editor's page yet? Why, of course not...because we both know the basis for your obsession with Obama and his preacher...and as I said, it ain't pretty.

[red states rule]

and clearly, you did NOT "stick with me" but went right back to insulting me and then threw your typical hissy fit when I retaliated. Cry me a fucking river, you pussy.

have you read the editor's page yet? Why, of course not...because we both know the basis for your obsession with Obama and his preacher...and as I said, it ain't pretty.

You are such a bitter man MFM. Just another typical white person

[retiredman]

You are such a bitter man MFM. Just another typical white person

what do you have to say about this issue of whether or not Obama needed to discuss his Kenyan paternal grandfather - who he had never met and who had never been to America - in his speech about race issues IN AMERICA?

[red states rule]

what do you have to say about this issue of whether or not Obama needed to discuss his Kenyan paternal grandfather - who he had never met and who had never been to America - in his speech about race issues IN AMERICA?

Racism runs in his family

[retiredman]

Racism runs in his family

that wasn't my question. try again:

what do you have to say about this issue of whether or not Obama needed to discuss his Kenyan paternal grandfather - who he had never met and who had never been to America - in his speech about race issues IN AMERICA?

[red states rule]

that wasn't my question. try again:

what do you have to say about this issue of whether or not Obama needed to discuss his Kenyan paternal grandfather - who he had never met and who had never been to America - in his speech about race issues IN AMERICA?

Trying to duck the issue Barry is a black racist, who surrounds himself with other racists?

[retiredman]

Trying to duck the issue Barry is a black racist, who surrounds himself with other racists?

the thread is about his grandfather. I ma trying to have a discussion with you about the topic of the thread. Who's ducking????:lol:

[red states rule]

the thread is about his grandfather. I ma trying to have a discussion with you about the topic of the thread. Who's ducking????:lol:

The first post said it all


When the two of us got married, your grandparents weren’t happy with the idea. But they said okay-they probably couldn’t have stopped us anyway, and they eventually came around to the idea that it was the right thing to do. Then Barack’s father-your grandfather Hussein-wrote Gramps this long, nasty letter saying that he didn’t approve of the marriage. He didn’t want the Obama blood sullied by a white woman, he said. Well, you can imagine how Gramps reacted to that. And then there was a problem with your father’s first wife…he had told me they were separated, but it was a village wedding, so there was no legal document that could show a divorce….” [93]

Out of Barry's own book

GIven his racist friends and his own views on whites, I am not surprised how racism has been handed down from one generation to another

[retiredman]

The first post said it all


When the two of us got married, your grandparents weren’t happy with the idea. But they said okay-they probably couldn’t have stopped us anyway, and they eventually came around to the idea that it was the right thing to do. Then Barack’s father-your grandfather Hussein-wrote Gramps this long, nasty letter saying that he didn’t approve of the marriage. He didn’t want the Obama blood sullied by a white woman, he said. Well, you can imagine how Gramps reacted to that. And then there was a problem with your father’s first wife…he had told me they were separated, but it was a village wedding, so there was no legal document that could show a divorce….” [93]

Out of Barry's own book

GIven his racist friends and his own views on whites, I am not surprised how racism has been handed down from one generation to another

I asked you to use your own words and explain why, in a speech about racial issues in America, Barack Obama ought to have mentioned his paternal grandfather who he had never met and who had never been to America. Can you do that?

[red states rule]

I asked you to use your own words and explain why, in a speech about racial issues in America, Barack Obama ought to have mentioned his paternal grandfather who he had never met and who had never been to America. Can you do that?

Using Barrry's own words is better

Of course you want to ignore them since it shows he comes from a racist family, where he picked up his own white hating beliefs

It is from his own book MFM.

[retiredman]

Using Barrry's own words is better

Of course you want to ignore them since it shows he comes from a racist family, where he picked up his own white hating beliefs

It is from his own book MFM.


his words do not answer the question that I posed to you. Can you try to answer it? It requires actually formulating an intelligent answer in your head and then typing it into the reply box. Can you do that?

[red states rule]

his words do not answer the question that I posed to you. Can you try to answer it? It requires actually formulating an intelligent answer in your head and then typing it into the reply box. Can you do that?

You are something else. You can't bring yourself to admit what a racist your guy is. You ignore all his comments, you defend his racist pastor, you dismiss his wifes stupid comments - all for political reasons

Nothing will ever change you since your only goal is getting more political power for the Dems. Barry's rascim be damned

[retiredman]

You are something else. You can't bring yourself to admit what a racist your guy is. You ignore all his comments, you defend his racist pastor, you dismiss his wifes stupid comments - all for political reasons

Nothing will ever change you since your only goal is getting more political power for the Dems. Barry's rascim be damned



why can't you carry on an intelligent discussion about the subject of this thread? why is that so hard for you?:laugh2:

What Obama Failed to Mention: Racist Black Grandfather

what does a grandfather who Obama has never met and who has never been to America have to do with racism in America?

[red states rule]

why can't you carry on an intelligent discussion about the subject of this thread? why is that so hard for you?:laugh2:

If Barry's own words are not good enough for you - nobody's words would be good enough for you

It keeps getting worse for your racist candidate. That is your problem, not mine

[retiredman]

If Barry's own words are not good enough for you - nobody's words would be good enough for you

It keeps getting worse for your racist candidate. That is your problem, not mine


Obasma's words do not - in any way - address my question to you. Please try to do so yourself.

[red states rule]

Obasma's words do not - in any way - address my question to you. Please try to do so yourself.

Barry shares his Grandfathers views MFM -something you refuse to admit

That is why it is important

[retiredman]

Barry shares his Grandfathers views MFM -something you refuse to admit

That is why it is important


where has he ever said that he felt that his parents should not have gotten married?

What does a grandfather who he has never met and who has never been to America have to do with race in America?

[glockmail]

.....

what does a grandfather who Obama has never met and who has never been to America have to do with racism in America? If the old racist has nothing to do with racism then why did Barry mention him in his book?

Perhaps Barry was trying to influence Kenyan politics.

[red states rule]

If the old racist has nothing to do with racism then why did Barry mention him in his book?

Perhaps Barry was trying to influence Kenyan politics.

Perhaps Barry shared his views, and admired him?

[glockmail]

Perhaps Barry shared his views, and admired him? I don't agree with that, as the old geezer wrote about how his dad should not marry his mom. But that is ancillary to the issue being discussed. The issue is why Barry tossed his white grandma under the bus to deflect his racist tendencies, but not his black grandpap? It's obvious that he is playing victim politics, and in the case of his grandpap, his mom was the victim of racism.

[retiredman]

If the old racist has nothing to do with racism then why did Barry mention him in his book?

Perhaps Barry was trying to influence Kenyan politics.

I said he had nothing to do with racism in America and did not need to be mentioned in a speech about that topic.

[glockmail]

I said he had nothing to do with racism in America and did not need to be mentioned in a speech about that topic.
Then you would be wrong, as the old geezer was racist against Obama's mom, who was living in the US.

[red states rule]

I said he had nothing to do with racism in America and did not need to be mentioned in a speech about that topic.

The racism is coming from Barry and his inner circle

[retiredman]

Then you would be wrong, as the old geezer was racist against Obama's mom, who was living in the US.


The attitudes of Obama's long dead grandfather havenothing to do with racial attitudes in America today.

I will say that if my grandchild were running for President someday and, in that campaign, spoke truthfully about me in connection with some issue, I would not feel as if I had been "thrown under the bus". I would be proud of the integrity of my descendant. I am sure that Obama's grandmother is proud of him.

[red states rule]

The attitudes of Obama's long dead grandfather havenothing to do with racial attitudes in America today.

I will say that if my grandchild were running for President someday and, in that campaign, spoke truthfully about me in connection with some issue, I would not feel as if I had been "thrown under the bus". I would be proud of the integrity of my descendant. I am sure that Obama's grandmother is proud of him.

Considering Barry and Co share the racist views of of his long dead grandfather, is an issue

I am sure you would be proud of your defense of the racist liberals,no matter how it would harm your grandchilds campaign

[retiredman]

Considering Barry and Co share the racist views of of his long dead grandfather, is an issue

I am sure you would be proud of your defense of the racist liberals,no matter how it would harm your grandchilds campaign

where does Barack Obama share the view that his parents ought not to have gotten married?

I would be proud if my grandchild spoke the truth about me.

[glockmail]

The attitudes of Obama's long dead grandfather havenothing to do with racial attitudes in America today.

I will say that if my grandchild were running for President someday and, in that campaign, spoke truthfully about me in connection with some issue, I would not feel as if I had been "thrown under the bus". I would be proud of the integrity of my descendant. I am sure that Obama's grandmother is proud of him.

That's great man. So why didn't Barry "speak truthfully" about his black grandparent at the same time that he spoke about his white grandparent, when the black one actually thought carefully about and penned his racism, while we have to take Barry's word on what the white one casually said?

[red states rule]

where does Barack Obama share the view that his parents ought not to have gotten married?

I would be proud if my grandchild spoke the truth about me.

Like his grandfather, Barry does not like white people. That has shown thrui via his own words

I am sure you would be proud if some of your posts from here would be used by your grandchilds opponent, and your grandchild had to spin them

Much like Barry is doing with the comments of his inner circle

[retiredman]

Like his grandfather, Barry does not like white people. That has shown thrui via his own words

I am sure you would be proud if some of your posts from here would be used by your grandchilds opponent, and your grandchild had to spin them

Much like Barry is doing with the comments of his inner circle


Please show me one quote from Obama where he says he does not like white people.

[retiredman]

That's great man. So why didn't Barry "speak truthfully" about his black grandparent at the same time that he spoke about his white grandparent, when the black one actually thought carefully about and penned his racism, while we have to take Barry's word on what the white one casually said?

because his black grandparent's attitudes have nothing to do with racist attitudes in America.

I would suggest that you have no reason NOT to take Obama's word on what his grandmother said.

[red states rule]

Please show me one quote from Obama where he says he does not like white people.

Please MFM, stop being a typical white person

[retiredman]

Please MFM, stop being a typical white person

is saying that an example of your hatred for me?

are you a typical Phillies fan?

[red states rule]

is saying that an example of your hatred for me?

are you a typical Phillies fan?

Those are Barry's words - not mine

I do not follow baseball BTY. Football is my favorite sport

[retiredman]

Those are Barry's words - not mine

I do not follow baseball BTY. Football is my favorite sport

I don't think calling someone a typical white person shows HATRED any more than calling someone a typical Eagles fan shows HATRED. If you called me a typical Patriots fan, would that mean that you HATED me?

[red states rule]

I don't think calling someone a typical white person shows HATRED any more than calling someone a typical Eagles fan shows HATRED. If you called me a typical Patriots fan, would that mean that you HATED me?

I knw you well enough (even thiugh you will deny it) if John McCain; or any other Republican; called say Ms Obama a typical black person, you would be in a state of mouth frothing hysteria over his blatant racism

[retiredman]

I knw you well enough (even thiugh you will deny it) if John McCain; or any other Republican; called say Ms Obama a typical black person, you would be in a state of mouth frothing hysteria over his blatant racism

If John McCain called Mrs. Obama a typical black person in America, I would laugh, because she is far from typical, but nonetheless, I would not say that his calling her that was an indication that he HATED her or HATED black people in general. Would YOU?

[red states rule]

If John McCain called Mrs. Obama a typical black person in America, I would laugh, because she is far from typical, but nonetheless, I would not say that his calling her that was an indication that he HATED her or HATED black people in general. Would YOU?

Bullsnit, You play the race card as often as Jackson and Sharpton

The Obama's are racists. They learned well from Wright ther mentor

[retiredman]

Bullsnit, You play the race card as often as Jackson and Sharpton

The Obama's are racists. They learned well from Wright ther mentor

Nothing Obama has said has shown HATRED for whites as you said. I am still waiting. And why can't you answer my question??

[Yurt]

after telling MFM no less than two times that obama crafted his speech for the world...telling them his story is to be shared with the world and is universal...while of course "tailoring" it to speak to americans, one cannot rationally say that obama limited his speech to solely america.

mfm just continues to be intellectually dishonest....he has no proof at all that obama intended to limit his speech to solely racism in america, else why would he talk about taking the message to the wider world? further, his speech was about african black men enduring racism....as such, it is fair game to show that it is NOT only white americans who are racist, but his dear black grandfather. if race is truly important to him, why did he spend so much time defending his reverend and no time defending his grandmother...oh wait, he did later..."typical white person"

fact remains clear that he expressly said his message was for the entire world

[red states rule]

after telling MFM no less than two times that obama crafted his speech for the world...telling them his story is to be shared with the world and is universal...while of course "tailoring" it to speak to americans, one cannot rationally say that obama limited his speech to solely america.

mfm just continues to be intellectually dishonest....he has no proof at all that obama intended to limit his speech to solely racism in america, else why would he talk about taking the message to the wider world? further, his speech was about african black men enduring racism....as such, it is fair game to show that it is NOT only white americans who are racist, but his dear black grandfather. if race is truly important to him, why did he spend so much time defending his reverend and no time defending his grandmother...oh wait, he did later..."typical white person"

fact remains clear that he expressly said his message was for the entire world

MFM is bought and paid for by the Obama campaign and the DNC

[glockmail]

because his black grandparent's attitudes have nothing to do with racist attitudes in America.

I would suggest that you have no reason NOT to take Obama's word on what his grandmother said.

You're spinning in circles now. I just gave yu a reason why grandpaps documented racism is applicable to the issue and you just repeat the same shit.

I would suggest that with all the changed stories and outright lies told by Barry, anything he says should be suspect. His grandmum may have been a real sweetie with nothing bad to say about anyone, but at the time it was to his advantage to call her a racist, since she is white.

[retiredman]

after telling MFM no less than two times that obama crafted his speech for the world...telling them his story is to be shared with the world and is universal...while of course "tailoring" it to speak to americans, one cannot rationally say that obama limited his speech to solely america.

mfm just continues to be intellectually dishonest....he has no proof at all that obama intended to limit his speech to solely racism in america, else why would he talk about taking the message to the wider world? further, his speech was about african black men enduring racism....as such, it is fair game to show that it is NOT only white americans who are racist, but his dear black grandfather. if race is truly important to him, why did he spend so much time defending his reverend and no time defending his grandmother...oh wait, he did later..."typical white person"

fact remains clear that he expressly said his message was for the entire world

Intellectually dishonest????? Is that your favorite epithet to for me because you know I am deeply offended when someone questions my honesty? Nice touch. But when I say something that I KNOW deeply offends you, you create THREADSD about it! :fu:

And no PROOF that he intended to limit his speech to America? What a ridiculous statement. He is in the middle of a political campaign to be the president of America, not king of the fucking world. And what you might think is FAIR for him to show does not mean that he needs to get all of his speeches pre-apporved by YOU for "fairness". And the reason he spent more time defending Wright than his grandmother is that Wright said a lot more than his grandmother did.

from his speech:

"These people are a part of me. And they are part of America, this country that I love."

"But race is an issue that I believe this nation cannot afford to ignore right now"

"The fact is that the comments that have been made and the issues that have surfaced over the last few weeks reflect the complexities of race in this country that we've never really worked through — a part of our union that we have not yet made perfect. And if we walk away now, if we simply retreat into our respective corners, we will never be able to come together and solve challenges like health care or education or the need to find good jobs for every For we have a choice in this country. We can accept a politics that breeds division and conflict and cynicism. We can tackle race only as spectacle — as we did in the O.J. trial — or in the wake of tragedy — as we did in the aftermath of Katrina — or as fodder for the nightly news. We can play Reverend Wright's sermons on every channel, every day and talk about them from now until the election, and make the only question in this campaign whether or not the American people think that I somehow believe or sympathize with his most offensive words. We can pounce on some gaffe by a Hillary supporter as evidence that she's playing the race card, or we can speculate on whether white men will all flock to John McCain in the general election regardless of his policies.

We can do that.

But if we do, I can tell you that in the next election, we'll be talking about some other distraction. And then another one. And then another one. And nothing will change. "

"But I have asserted a firm conviction — a conviction rooted in my faith in God and my faith in the American people — that, working together, we can move beyond some of our old racial wounds, and that in fact we have no choice if we are to continue on the path of a more perfect union. "

"For we have a choice in this country. We can accept a politics that breeds division and conflict and cynicism. We can tackle race only as spectacle — as we did in the O.J. trial — or in the wake of tragedy — as we did in the aftermath of Katrina — or as fodder for the nightly news. We can play Reverend Wright's sermons on every channel, every day and talk about them from now until the election, and make the only question in this campaign whether or not the American people think that I somehow believe or sympathize with his most offensive words. We can pounce on some gaffe by a Hillary supporter as evidence that she's playing the race card, or we can speculate on whether white men will all flock to John McCain in the general election regardless of his policies.

We can do that.

But if we do, I can tell you that in the next election, we'll be talking about some other distraction. And then another one. And then another one. And nothing will change"
Yeah...this is a speech that is all about Kenya and the rest of the world.... Hell, he hardly MENTIONS America....It sounds like he should be talking to the fucking United Nations he is so international in his scope! What bullshit.... to suggest that he "expressly said his message was for the entire world" is not just intellectually dishonest, it is just plain dishonest.

[Yurt]

do you deny he wants the message to be universal and brought to the whole world? simple yes or no.

you also lied about me creating threadS <-- notice the plural and you capped yours to place emphasis...you have insulted/offended me so many times i have lost count...yet i created only ONE thread and that is because you accused me of being a christ killer....such an insult is not only offensive, it is wrong, you being an alleged preacher had your theologoy wrong about who/what killed christ. that is why i opened a thread, so we could debate that point.

trust me, your childish insults don't bother, they make me laugh because i know when i receive them that i have struck a cord with you and you know i am right and you cover with insults.

keep on lying preacher man....

[red states rule]

do you deny he wants the message to be universal and brought to the whole world? simple yes or no.

you also lied about me creating threadS <-- notice the plural and you capped yours to place emphasis...you have insulted/offended me so many times i have lost count...yet i created only ONE thread and that is because you accused me of being a christ killer....such an insult is not only offensive, it is wrong, you being an alleged preacher had your theologoy wrong about who/what killed christ. that is why i opened a thread, so we could debate that point.

trust me, your childish insults don't bother, they make me laugh because i know when i receive them that i have struck a cord with you and you know i am right and you cover with insults.

keep on lying preacher man....

MFM does not discriminate Yurt. He treats everyone who dares to disagree with him, and call him on his lies; with equall contempt and hate

[retiredman]

do you deny he wants the message to be universal and brought to the whole world? simple yes or no.



I am calling YOU a liar, "shyster", for saying that he "expressly said his message was for the entire world".

The speech was clearly about America... for you to continue to rail about the fact that he did not mention his kenyan grandfather who he had never met and who had never been to America in a speech clearly about race relations IN AMERICA is total bullshit and for you to claim that he expressly said his speech was about anything greater than race relations in America is fucking lie. "counselor".

Oh yeah...and the other THREAD was one whining about a comment I made on your blog. pussy.:lol:

[Yurt]

I am calling YOU a liar, "shyster", for saying that he "expressly said his message was for the entire world".

The speech was clearly about America... for you to continue to rail about the fact that he did not mention his kenyan grandfather who he had never met and who had never been to America in a speech clearly about race relations IN AMERICA is total bullshit and for you to claim that he expressly said his speech was about anything greater than race relations in America is fucking lie. "counselor".

Oh yeah...and the other THREAD was one whining about a comment I made on your blog. pussy.:lol:


are you just plain stupid? or do you practice?


Those stories - of survival, and freedom, and hope - became our story, my story; the blood that had spilled was our blood, the tears our tears; until this black church, on this bright day, seemed once more a vessel carrying the story of a people into future generations and into a larger world. Our trials ....universal

you are an idiot for attempting to claim he wants to limit his message, his story solely to america. no surprise really, everybody knows you lie, so intellectual dishonesty is not a big leap for you.

calling me a pussy and a liar....ooooh, everybody run from the hell and brimstone "preacher" lets see who the real liar is:


But when I say something that I KNOW deeply offends you, you create THREADSD about it


the comments from the blog were not offensive and you know it. we disagreed over a point and instead of turning the comments into a debate (which i said in the thread) i opened a thread.

you are liar and have been caught....again. but keep up the personally repulsive insults, it only makes me look better...in fact keep calling me pussy...come on you can do it...

too bad you can't debate and that your strengths apparently lie in your "sailors mouth" :laugh2:

[red states rule]

Now Barry is whining that people are "obsessed" with what he says

Sounds like something MFM would say

Are we to ignore his racist and elitistist remarks?



Some too 'obsessed' with what we say
By ROGER SIMON | 4/16/08 11:02 PM EST

PHILADELPHIA – You know a candidate is really feeling the heat when he starts complaining about the kitchen.

You know a candidate is having problems when he starts complaining about the process.

Wednesday night, in a debate here, Barack Obama complained a number of times about the presidential campaign process and how some people spend way too much time “obsessing” about some of the things that he and others have actually said.

They obsess about remarks he admits he “mangled” about people in small towns who, he said, “get bitter” and “cling” to “guns or religion.” People also obsess about his pastor for 20 years, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, who once said the U.S. government brought on the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks “with its own terrorism.”

“I think what’s important is to make sure that we don’t get so obsessed with gaffes that we lose sight of the fact that this is a defining moment in our history,” Obama said.

He also said: “For us to be obsessed with this – these kinds of errors – I think is a mistake. And that’s not what our campaign has been about.”

for the complete article

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0408/9676.html

[mundame]

You know a candidate is having problems when he starts complaining about the process.

Wednesday night, in a debate here, Barack Obama complained a number of times about the presidential campaign process and how some people spend way too much time “obsessing” about some of the things that he and others have actually said.

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“I think what’s important is to make sure that we don’t get so obsessed with gaffes that we lose sight of the fact that this is a defining moment in our history,” Obama said.

Oh, boy. So electing this guy president is supposed define America? Sheeeeeesh.

[red states rule]

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Oh, boy. So electing this guy president is supposed define America? Sheeeeeesh.

The same can be said for the serial liar Hillary, Both want to tax the hell out of us, surrender and appease terrorists, and put handcuffs on companies on how the do business

[Abbey Marie]

“I think what’s important is to make sure that we don’t get so obsessed with gaffes that we lose sight of the fact that this is a defining moment in our history,” Obama said.

This really does sound like a man with a Messiah complex.

[red states rule]

This really does sound like a man with a Messiah complex.

If I was asking questions I would have replied "Duh, you are running for Presdient. Why should we not pay atemntion to what you say?"

This guy hates to have any hard questions asked about what he says and what he does

I have to give credit for a former Clintonista asking those questions

But it was funny to see Keith Overbites reaction to the questions asked


Stephanopoulos Quizzes Obama on Relationship to Member of Terrorist Group; Olbermann Enraged


snip

Prefacing the issue under the “general theme of patriotism,” and previous questions about why Obama has, at times, refused to wear an American flag lapel pin, Stephanopoulos noted, “[Ayers] never apologized for [the bombings]. And in fact, on 9/11, he was quoted in the New York Times, saying, ‘I don’t regret setting bombs. I feel we didn’t do enough.’” The ABC host pointedly observed that Obama’s campaign has described the relationship with Ayers as “friendly.” Stephanopoulos then asked, “Can you explain that relationship for the voters and explain to Democrats why it won’t be a problem?”

[UPDATE, from Brent Baker. The question enraged MSNBC's Keith Olbermann, who charged at the start of his 10 PM EDT live post-debate second edition of Countdown: "The campaign may have seemed dirty. It had nothing on one of the moderators of the debate tonight." He soon elaborated on his anger at Stephanopoulos:

The real story of his debate may not be found where they found the answers, but where one of the moderators found his questions: Sean Hannity of Fox News, and separately a local New York right wing radio host [presumably Steve Malzberg], each insisting during interviews this week with George Stephanopoulos of ABC that he ask Senator Obama about his tenuous past link to 60s and 70s terrorist radical William Ayers. Tonight, Stephanopoulos did that.

Obama’s response included stating that Ayers's actions happened when he was very young and asserted they weren’t relevant. Oddly, he went on to compare a man who was involved in bombings that killed people to his colleague, Republican Senator Tom Coburn from Oklahoma. Obama stated, “The fact is that I’m also friendly with Tom Coburn, one of the most conservative Republicans in the United States Senate, who during his campaign once said that it might be appropriate to apply the death penalty to those who carried out abortions.”

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/scott-whitlock/2008/04/16/stephanopoulos-quizzes-obama-relationship-member-terrorist-group

[retiredman]

This really does sound like a man with a Messiah complex.


it is defining regardless of what democrat runs against mccain....

we are at a scary crossroads... we could easily fall over the edge into Hell itself if we do not handle the threat of islamic extremism correctly.

[glockmail]

It looks like Obama "disowned" Reverend Wright last night on the ABC debate. I'm still looking for a link. This is a major flip flop from 3 or 4 weeks ago.

[red states rule]

It looks like Obama "disowned" Reverend Wright last night on the ABC debate. I'm still looking for a link. This is a major flip flop from 3 or 4 weeks ago.

This is what Barry said

“For Pastor Wright to have given his first sermon after Sept. 11 and to have blamed the United States for the attack, which happened in my city of New York, would have been just intolerable for me,” Clinton said. “And, therefore, I would have not been able to stay in the church.”

Obama once again tried discounting the potential for the controversy to derail his candidacy in the general election.

“You know, the notion that somehow that the American people are going to be distracted once again by comments not made by me, but somebody who is associated with me that I have disowned, I think doesn't give the American people enough credit,” said Obama, who quickly clarified that he disowned the comments, not Wright.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0408/9675_Page2.html

[red states rule]

It looks like Obama "disowned" Reverend Wright last night on the ABC debate. I'm still looking for a link. This is a major flip flop from 3 or 4 weeks ago.

Funny how Barry's racist white grandma said things that made him cringe. But Rev Wright did not make him cringe. Bil Ayers, his terrorist frind, did not do or say anything that made him cringe

[glockmail]

Here's the entire thing in context:

STEPHANOPOULOS: Senator, two questions. Number one, do you think
Reverend Wright loves America as much as you do? And, number two, if
you get the nomination, what will you do when those sermons are played
on television again and again and again?
OBAMA: You know, George, look, if it's not this, then it would be
something else. I promise you, if Senator Clinton got the nomination,
there will be a whole bunch of video clips about other things.
In a general election, we know that there are going to be all kinds
of attacks launched and leveled. There have been quite a few leveled in
this primary campaign.
And I have confidence in the American people that when you talk to
the American people honestly and directly about what I believe in, what
my plans are on health care, on energy, when they see my track record of
the work that I've done on behalf of people who really need help, I have
absolute confidence that they can rally behind my campaign.
And, you know, the notion that somehow that the American people are
going to be distracted once again by comments not made by me, but
somebody who is associated with me that I have disowned, I think
doesn't give the American people enough credit.
STEPHANOPOULOS: You've disowned him?
OBAMA: The comments, comments that I've disowned. Then that is not
something I... http://blogs.suntimes.com/sweet/2008/04/democratic_philadelphia_debate.html

As soon as I heard it I thought he was saying that he disowned the person, and so did Steffy. So I think that's what he meant to say, and then Steffy let mim backpeddle. Either that or he's an idiot with respect to the english language.

[red states rule]

Here's the entire thing in context:
http://blogs.suntimes.com/sweet/2008/04/democratic_philadelphia_debate.html

As soon as I heard it I thought he was saying that he disowned the person, and so did Steffy. So I think that's what he meant to say, and then Steffy let mim backpeddle. Either that or he's an idiot with respect to the english language.

He is an idiot

[Yurt]

Now Barry is whining that people are "obsessed" with what he says

Sounds like something MFM would say

Are we to ignore his racist and elitistist remarks?





how do we now mfm and obama are not one and the same?

[red states rule]

how do we now mfm and obama are not one and the same?

MFM may write Barry's talking points. They are identical to his posts