Conflict escalates at polygamist retreat

[LiberalNation]

Hope they find the girl and she hasn't been harmed by these radicals.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080406/ap_on_re_us/polygamist_retreat

ELDORADO, Texas - Sect leaders at a polygamist compound in West Texas refused Saturday to let authorities search a temple for a teenage girl whose report of abuse led to the raid, and authorities said they were preparing "for the worst."

If no agreement is reached with sect leaders, authorities will forcibly remove the sect's followers "as peaceably as possible," Allison Palmer, a prosecutor in Tom Green County, told the San Angelo Standard-Times.

Medical workers are being sent "in case this were to a go in a way that no one wants," Palmer said. Law enforcers are "preparing for the worst," she said.

"Within the religion that we have encountered, their place of worship is very special to them," Palmer said. "It appears to be of great concern to them if a person from outside their congregation even attempts to step inside their place of worship."

A search warrant authorized troopers to enter the retreat, run by the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. They are looking for evidence of a marriage between the girl and a 50-year-old man.

Court documents the girl had a baby eight months ago, when she was 15.

State welfare officials on Friday removed 52 girls from the compound. Marleigh Meisner, a spokeswoman for Child Protective Services, said another 131 residents were removed overnight. By Saturday afternoon, 137 children and 46 women were being housed and interviewed at local community centers.

"They seem to be doing fine," Meisner told The Associated Press. Investigators remained inside the compound looking for additional children, she said.

The whereabouts of the 16-year-old mother who sparked the investigation are unknown, Meisner said. State troopers who raided the religious retreat were looking for the girl, her baby girl and 50-year-old Dale Barlow.

Under Texas law, girls younger than 16 cannot marry, even with parental approval.

[mundame]

Hope they find the girl and she hasn't been harmed by these radicals.


I hate this polygamy stuff so much. It's such a terrible harm to the brainwashed, maltreated, abused girls that polygamy ALWAYS involves. It has to involve forcing, because the polygamist men are trying to establish an unnatural sex ratio ------- given males and females are born 50/50, they have to get rid of a lot of boys, expel them from the community, and make sure none of the females ever leaves and that all are cruelly enslaved to their crazy ideas. And get more women and girls if they can, as if.

Incest is the norm in all polygamist systems: It has to be because of the acute shortage of females. Fundamentalist Mormons are well-known for incest, but Muslims also have a far higher degree of relatedness than we tolerate in America. First cousin marriages are the norm rather than the exception, for instance.

If homosexual marriage ever is legalized, polygamy will follow right along a few days later. It does, after all, have a better historical and religious case to make than two men marrying each other!!

[glockmail]

Good think Janet Reno's not in charge anymore.

[mundame]

Good think Janet Reno's not in charge anymore.

Glockmail, did you catch that thing in the news this morning that many medical workers were moved in "in case something happens that nobody wants to happen"?

Mass suicides or shootings or such, I suppose they were afraid of, when authorities tried to take out the women and children. It didn't happen, though. Hmmmmmmmmmmm.....................................c ould happen now that there are only the few men left, maybe.

[glockmail]

Glockmail, did you catch that thing in the news this morning that many medical workers were moved in "in case something happens that nobody wants to happen"?

Mass suicides or shootings or such, I suppose they were afraid of, when authorities tried to take out the women and children. It didn't happen, though. Hmmmmmmmmmmm.....................................c ould happen now that there are only the few men left, maybe.

Why didn't they bring in a tank and start knocking down walls like Janet did?

[Dilloduck]

Austin is preparing a plan to shelter those removed from the compound. Emergency officials are meeting as I type to finalize the plans.

[Little-Acorn]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080406/ap_on_re_us/polygamist_retreat

Medical workers are being sent "in case this were to a go in a way that no one wants," Palmer said. Law enforcers are "preparing for the worst," she said.


LN, the article your link points to, does not contain some of the quotes you cited in your copy of it. In particular, the quote above, is not in the article.

I recall an earlier thread where I had copy/pasted an article with some quotes in it (from Barack Obama's wife), and included the link to that article. Later, the news agency modified the article, and changed some of the quotes, without changing the link or giving any notice that any changes had been made.

Could this have just happened to you, too?

[avatar4321]

been seeing a number of articles on this. I am wondering if they really have any justification for these raids. From what I've seen they can't even confirm this person they are looking for exists.

I severely dislike this sect and if there were laws broken, then prosecute, but this could easily be persecution if the officials arent careful. And that concerns me. If they can persecute this sect because its unpopular what happens to other faiths that are unpopular. That's my main concern.

If they are doing this by the books, then okay, im just concerned they arent and no one will care because they are unpopular.

[Dilloduck]

Austin is preparing a plan to shelter those removed from the compound. Emergency officials are meeting as I type to finalize the plans.

Mineola TX is looking as the likely "sheltering" city. Could be interesting

[LiberalNation]

LN, the article your link points to, does not contain some of the quotes you cited in your copy of it. In particular, the quote above, is not in the article.

I recall an earlier thread where I had copy/pasted an article with some quotes in it (from Barack Obama's wife), and included the link to that article. Later, the news agency modified the article, and changed some of the quotes, without changing the link or giving any notice that any changes had been made.

Could this have just happened to you, too?

I don't know, either that or I messed it up when copying. Anyway, wasn't intentional even tho I do "cut" the articles sometimes to fit into the don't post the whole article rule.

[mundame]

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by Dilloduck http://www.debatepolicy.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showthread.php?p=227531#post227531)
Austin is preparing a plan to shelter those removed from the compound. Emergency officials are meeting as I type to finalize the plans.
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>Mineola TX is looking as the likely "sheltering" city. Could be interesting



They are breaking up that Eldorado compound!!

EXCELLENT! :clap:

[Gaffer]

They are breaking up that Eldorado compound!!

EXCELLENT! :clap:

Hopefully they will expand it to breaking up the other compounds in other states. This whole organization needs to be taken down and the leaders prosecuted.

[mundame]

Hopefully they will expand it to breaking up the other compounds in other states. This whole organization needs to be taken down and the leaders prosecuted.

Yes, indeed. The Eldorado compound was where Warren Jeffs was in command. It worried me a lot when I read these types were spreading from their old communities to new ones.

[Dilloduck]

Yes, indeed. The Eldorado compound was where Warren Jeffs was in command. It worried me a lot when I read these types were spreading from their old communities to new ones.

Bigot ! :laugh2:

[westcoast]

I see no reason why polygamy is outlawed. The state should stay the F out of personal relationships.

[manu1959]

I see no reason why polygamy is outlawed. The state should stay the F out of personal relationships.

except when it comes to gay marriage and abortions then they should pass a law.....

[Dilloduck]

I see no reason why polygamy is outlawed. The state should stay the F out of personal relationships.

Damn--- I have to agree with you on the polygamy thing--The state jumped into church business with both feet. Imprisonment----the whole 9 yards.

http://www.pbs.org/mormons/peopleevents/e_polygamy.html

[mundame]

The government has rescued over 400 children as of tonight! That was a BIG community, though the fundamentalist Mormon women typically have a lot of children. At five or so per woman, that's 80 women's worth of kids. At around seven wives per Mormon man (they do days of the week), that's only about 12 --20 men left in the compound, should be able to wrap them up pretty quickly.

This is a David Koresh deal. A really bad set of crazy males doing sick sex stuff with little girls they are related to, lots of forbiddings and controllings. America has always had a lot of these nutso Utopian societies, and they have always, always been about lots of sex for the leaders, especially with young girls. Why is that? Never mind, I don't want an answer.

The Mormons were one of the first of those groups, like Oneida and many others, and they are the only one that has lasted. It's definitely time to take down these Eldorado fundamentalist bad guys before we end up with another Koresh-type massacre.


And NONE of this is going to help Mormon Mitt Romney get the VP slot on McCain's ticket that he has decided he so much wants after all..........

[avatar4321]

how exactly does one report of abuse from a person who we still dont know exists justify removing 400 children from families without any proof of crimes?

[Dilloduck]

how exactly does one report of abuse from a person who we still dont know exists justify removing 400 children from families without any proof of crimes?

There was enough evidence to convince a judge--that's all it takes.

[avatar4321]

There was enough evidence to convince a judge--that's all it takes.

Having met some judges, that doesn't really comfort me.

And if someone abused his children in your neighborhood does it authorize the judge to allow the government to take all the children in the neighborhood, incuding your own?

[Dilloduck]

Having met some judges, that doesn't really comfort me.

And if someone abused his children in your neighborhood does it authorize the judge to allow the government to take all the children in the neighborhood, incuding your own?

I'd pay a judge $100 bucks to order all the ninos and ninas out of my neighborhood. :laugh2:

[avatar4321]

looks like the complaints have just been filed.

Group files complaint claiming consistutional rights have been violated (http://www.sltrib.com/ci_8844183)

[Sitarro]

Having met some judges, that doesn't really comfort me.

And if someone abused his children in your neighborhood does it authorize the judge to allow the government to take all the children in the neighborhood, incuding your own?

Hey av, have you ever seen "And Justice For All"? There were some nutty judges in that movie......."You're out of order!".... classic Pacino.

[glockmail]

The government has rescued over 400 children as of tonight! That was a BIG community, though the fundamentalist Mormon women typically have a lot of children. At five or so per woman, that's 80 women's worth of kids. At around seven wives per Mormon man (they do days of the week), that's only about 12 --20 men left in the compound, should be able to wrap them up pretty quickly.

This is a David Koresh deal. A really bad set of crazy males doing sick sex stuff with little girls they are related to, lots of forbiddings and controllings. America has always had a lot of these nutso Utopian societies, and they have always, always been about lots of sex for the leaders, especially with young girls. Why is that? Never mind, I don't want an answer.

The Mormons were one of the first of those groups, like Oneida and many others, and they are the only one that has lasted. It's definitely time to take down these Eldorado fundamentalist bad guys before we end up with another Koresh-type massacre.


And NONE of this is going to help Mormon Mitt Romney get the VP slot on McCain's ticket that he has decided he so much wants after all.......... How judgemental, bigoted and intolerant.

[red states rule]

How judgemental, bigoted and intolerant.

She is a typical white liberal

[Gaffer]

These nut cases need to be locked up. This is not a neighborhood. It's a commune with a few men in control. It's all about control and dominance. The women and children have all gone willingly into shelters. here are other such compounds scattered around the country and hopefully they will be raided and shut down too. For once the government is doing something right.

Anybody want to defend these scumbags, step up to the plate.

[red states rule]

These nut cases need to be locked up. This is not a neighborhood. It's a commune with a few men in control. It's all about control and dominance. The women and children have all gone willingly into shelters. here are other such compounds scattered around the country and hopefully they will be raided and shut down too. For once the government is doing something right.

Anybody want to defend these scumbags, step up to the plate.

Lock them up, and melt the key down as a charm bracelet

I heard one women was kept in a underground prison for 3 years - then she escaped.

[avatar4321]

These nut cases need to be locked up. This is not a neighborhood. It's a commune with a few men in control. It's all about control and dominance. The women and children have all gone willingly into shelters. here are other such compounds scattered around the country and hopefully they will be raided and shut down too. For once the government is doing something right.

Anybody want to defend these scumbags, step up to the plate.

Ill defend them. If they are guilty they are guilty. But if until they have been proven guilty they are entitled to the same defense everyone else is.

[red states rule]

Ill defend them. If they are guilty they are guilty. But if until they have been proven guilty they are entitled to the same defense everyone else is.

They wil have their day in court, and if they are found guilty, I hope the Judge gives them the maximum sentence under the law

[glockmail]

I'm still waiting for Janet Reno to come in and start shooting.

[red states rule]

I'm still waiting for Janet Reno to come in and start shooting.

and then she can ship them of to Cuba

[glockmail]

At Swat Team gunpoint.

[red states rule]

At Swat Team gunpoint.

With photographers on hand to capture the moment for campaign booklets

[glockmail]

That's the one that we saw. Think of all the ones that we didn't.