States may free inmates to save millions

[LiberalNation]

yeah my states been talkin a lot about this. kentucky has one of the fastest growing prison pops.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080403/ap_on_re_us/prisoners_early_release;_ylt=AnSFKIETScv9.lvDDe3XI kZvzwcF


Gov. Steve Beshear has said Kentucky must review its policies after the state's inmate population jumped 12 percent last year — the largest increase in the nation.

Kentucky spends more than $18,600 to house one inmate for a year, or roughly $51 a day.



PROVIDENCE, R.I. - Lawmakers from California to Kentucky are trying to save money with a drastic and potentially dangerous budget-cutting proposal: releasing tens of thousands of convicts from prison, including drug addicts, thieves and even violent criminals.

Officials acknowledge that the idea carries risks, but they say they have no choice because of huge budget gaps brought on by the slumping economy.

"If we don't find a way to better manage the population at the state prison, we will be forced to spend money to expand the state's prison system — money we don't have," said Jeff Neal, a spokesman for Rhode Island Gov. Don Carcieri.

At least eight states are considering freeing inmates or sending some convicts to rehabilitation programs instead of prison, according to an Associated Press analysis of legislative proposals. If adopted, the early release programs could save an estimated $450 million in California and Kentucky alone.

[DragonStryk72]

um, they couldn't they just maybe cut some of the extra programs, and cut salaries as opposed to letting violent criminals out?

[Dilloduck]

yeah my states been talkin a lot about this. kentucky has one of the fastest growing prison pops.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080403/ap_on_re_us/prisoners_early_release;_ylt=AnSFKIETScv9.lvDDe3XI kZvzwcF

Enforcing the law is expensive--lets not have any.:rolleyes:

[avatar4321]

I could see paroling some of the minor criminals. The ones who have potential for being reformed.. Maybe to some work release programs or something. It's not totally bad.

[Yurt]

I could see paroling some of the minor criminals. The ones who have potential for being reformed.. Maybe to some work release programs or something. It's not totally bad.

precisely. if an inmate has exhibited reformation and is a minor convict, then it actually hurts soceity by keeping them caged. it costs way too much money, when these guys/gals could be out on supervised parole working and continuing reformation. prisons sorely lack in the rehabilitation department.

i won an appeal in a case where the state claimed a guy, convicted of second degree murder/plea, based on a fight that escalated where the inmate (who btw did not start the fight) ultimately drew a pocket knife and stabbed the guy in the gut, he died. 10 years into prison, the prison doctors make a mistake and oooops, he loses his right leg. he is wheelchair bound and somehow, 25 years later, bound to a wheelchair and 50 years old the state believes his is an unreasonable risk of danger, despite all prison counselors saying this guy poses no threat.

[Dilloduck]

I could see paroling some of the minor criminals. The ones who have potential for being reformed.. Maybe to some work release programs or something. It's not totally bad.

It shows how weak our laws have become--I don't think that's good. Violent criminals aren't the only ones who need to be kept out of society. Maybe if they didn't live in luxury the would make an atttempt to stay out of prison.

[avatar4321]

Enforcing the law is expensive--lets not have any.:rolleyes:

It actually can be. The trial process takes an incredible amount of time. Alot of the time its tough just to get witnesses to cooperate and show up on the dates in time. Some cops like to play games and overcharge them (not all just some). Some DAs are corrupt. Some defense lawyers waste time. Then there is the actual prisons.

I was talking to one of my partners about this the other day. Some criminals actually want to speed through the system and get sent up state because they have a crappy life and upstate they can get three meals a day, opportunities to work with security or earn degrees that the could never have on the outside because their life is nothing but drama. They like the security of it.

Honestly, our criminal system sucks. I havent seen much of it yet, but what I have seen does suck. Most of these people are just guys that do stupid things because they don't know better. Yes there are some real evil people, thankfully i havent met many of them yet, just one or two. For them, i think we need the death penalty optional. on more than just murder cases. Sexually based cases, pedophiles especially should be eligible for the death penalty as well (obviously that's a Supreme Court issue) but i still think they should be eligible for DP if the crime is that henious.

If we want to see justice, we need to start by making sure our lives our honest. we need to have honest cops. we need to have honest lawyers (Yes i know it's an oxymoron to alot of you but it does happen). We need better ways to rehabilitate people.

I also think we should get Churches much more involved. Let them preach in the prison. I don't care what the religion is. Give the prisoners something higher to live for then themselves. So them how good life can be.

[avatar4321]

It shows how weak our laws have become--I don't think that's good. Violent criminals aren't the only ones who need to be kept out of society. Maybe if they didn't live in luxury the would make an atttempt to stay out of prison.

not all of them do, but then it is still probably luxary compared to the life they live now.

Laws are there to protect everyone. the victims and the accused. And some of these criminals arent really guilty of anything but being at the wrong place at the wrong time.

[LiberalNation]

We have a lot of laws, a lot of ways to go to jail. Are laws aren't light, we have more people in prison then almost any other country in the world.

[Dilloduck]

not all of them do, but then it is still probably luxary compared to the life they live now.

Laws are there to protect everyone. the victims and the accused. And some of these criminals arent really guilty of anything but being at the wrong place at the wrong time.

and there are those walking free because of some silly loophole OR because the prisons are too crowded to put them anywhere.

[avatar4321]

and there are those walking free because of some silly loophole OR because the prisons are too crowded to put them anywhere.

Trust me, having been doing this for a little while, there arent very many silly loopholes.

[Yurt]

It actually can be. The trial process takes an incredible amount of time. Alot of the time its tough just to get witnesses to cooperate and show up on the dates in time. Some cops like to play games and overcharge them (not all just some). Some DAs are corrupt. Some defense lawyers waste time. Then there is the actual prisons.

I was talking to one of my partners about this the other day. Some criminals actually want to speed through the system and get sent up state because they have a crappy life and upstate they can get three meals a day, opportunities to work with security or earn degrees that the could never have on the outside because their life is nothing but drama. They like the security of it.

Honestly, our criminal system sucks. I havent seen much of it yet, but what I have seen does suck. Most of these people are just guys that do stupid things because they don't know better. Yes there are some real evil people, thankfully i havent met many of them yet, just one or two. For them, i think we need the death penalty optional. on more than just murder cases. Sexually based cases, pedophiles especially should be eligible for the death penalty as well (obviously that's a Supreme Court issue) but i still think they should be eligible for DP if the crime is that henious.

If we want to see justice, we need to start by making sure our lives our honest. we need to have honest cops. we need to have honest lawyers (Yes i know it's an oxymoron to alot of you but it does happen). We need better ways to rehabilitate people.

I also think we should get Churches much more involved. Let them preach in the prison. I don't care what the religion is. Give the prisoners something higher to live for then themselves. So them how good life can be.

excellent post. unfortunately, IMO, it takes most to realize such an idealogue only after experiencing criminal law. why law? because criminal justice (police focus) is about one goal, stop the perps. there are those who do want to make a change on the "beat", the mentality mentioned is in the majority. not passing judgment, merely stating an observation.

Not sure what i think about the churches....churches, at least in CA/WA/OR are fairly involved in prisons, don't know about jails, probably too transient. my misgivings stem from: what is does this country stand for, e.g., seperation of church and state. if we are going to separate the two in governing, then what is governments answer? in my experience, secular government fails miserably at rehabilitation and motivation. in prison, the most successful rehabilitation groups are religious. as i mentioned in the gay marriage thread, the state created this mess, they need to fix it. adding to that, if they can't, they need to get out of it. i think the state can fix it, and it will be a blend of church and state.

[5stringJeff]

I can see letting nonviolent criminals out... say, people convicted of drug possession. Misdemeanors only.

[Dilloduck]

precisely. if an inmate has exhibited reformation and is a minor convict, then it actually hurts soceity by keeping them caged. it costs way too much money, when these guys/gals could be out on supervised parole working and continuing reformation. prisons sorely lack in the rehabilitation department.

i won an appeal in a case where the state claimed a guy, convicted of second degree murder/plea, based on a fight that escalated where the inmate (who btw did not start the fight) ultimately drew a pocket knife and stabbed the guy in the gut, he died. 10 years into prison, the prison doctors make a mistake and oooops, he loses his right leg. he is wheelchair bound and somehow, 25 years later, bound to a wheelchair and 50 years old the state believes his is an unreasonable risk of danger, despite all prison counselors saying this guy poses no threat.

If you want rehabilitation you better get ready to dig REAL deep in your pocketbook and be prepared for a high recidivism rate anyway. Parole officers are swamped with cases and just barely have time to even check on thier case load as it is. Innocent people in prison are by far the exception. A vast majority deserve to be there--jusk ask the jurors who sent them there.

[Monkeybone]

We have a lot of laws, a lot of ways to go to jail. Are laws aren't light, we have more people in prison then almost any other country in the world.

that's because in other countries around the world they have better ways of dealing. be it cutting off hand for stealing, or capping you. that is why.

[Dilloduck]

Trust me, having been doing this for a little while, there arent very many silly loopholes.

how about the one you can drive a truck through ? Miranda "rights".

[Immanuel]

I have no problem letting non-violent prisoner out to house arrest. Why should the states have to foot the bill for incarcerating a thief, or even the dreaded drug addict, who hasn't physically hurt anyone? They should not go free, but placing them under house arrest and requiring others to take care of them seems better to me than making the taxpayer foot the bill.

I am opposed to the release of violent offenders though.

Immie

[Dilloduck]

I have no problem letting non-violent prisoner out to house arrest. Why should the states have to foot the bill for incarcerating a thief, or even the dreaded drug addict, who hasn't physically hurt anyone? They should not go free, but placing them under house arrest and requiring others to take care of them seems better to me than making the taxpayer foot the bill.

I am opposed to the release of violent offenders though.

Immie

We have two main punishments for breaking the law. If you are broke, there is only one deterrent to breaking the law. If you don't think the laws are fair then change them however ignoring law breakers is nothing less than stupid. Wait until you, a family member or friend are victimized by a repeat offender. Obeying the law isn't rocket science.

[Immanuel]

We have two main punishments for breaking the law. If you are broke, there is only one deterrent to breaking the law. If you don't think the laws are fair then change them however ignoring law breakers is nothing less than stupid. Wait until you, a family member or friend are victimized by a repeat offender. Obeying the law isn't rocket science.

Did I say anything about ignoring the law?

However, to incarcerate at taxpayer expense individuals who commit non-violent crimes is foolish in my opinion. Take the drug addict, for instance, who was caught with enough pot to make it a felony and not distributing, but simply using. Should this person be locked up in prison at my expense or have an ankle bracelet placed on his leg and forced to stay in his own "prison"?

Personally, when it is non-violent, I don't think sticking them in a violent environment serves the rest of the country well. The non-violent criminal goes into those places non-violent and comes out later violent... not rehabilitated.

There has to be a better solution.

Immie

[avatar4321]

how about the one you can drive a truck through ? Miranda "rights".

You mean remaining silent and having an attorney? How are they loopholes?