Fingerprint Scans Replace Clocking In

[Pale Rider]

Fingerprint Scans Replace Clocking In



2008-03-27 06:42:13
By DAVID B. CARUSO Associated Press Writer

NEW YORK (AP) — It's happening at Dunkin' Donuts, at Hilton hotels, even at Marine Corps bases: Employees are starting and ending their days by pressing a hand or finger to a scanner that logs the precise time of their arrival and departure, and the information is automatically reflected in payroll records.

Manufacturers say these biometric devices improve efficiency and streamline payroll operations. Employers big and small buy them with the dual goals of keeping workers honest and automating outdated record-keeping systems that rely on paper time sheets.

The new systems have raised complaints, however, from some workers who see the efforts to track their movements as excessive or creepy.

"They don't even have to hire someone to harass you anymore. The machine can do it for them," said Ed Ott, executive director of the New York City Central Labor Council of the AFL-CIO. "The palm print thing really grabs people as a step too far."

Story continues here... (http://www.charter.net/news/news_reader.php?storyid=14506684&feedid=248)

[hjmick]

Shit's getting a bit too Orwellian for me.

[Hagbard Celine]

:eek: OMG! OMG! OMG! IT'S A SIGN OF THE TIMES! IT'S THE MARK OF THE BEAST! OMG! :eek:








:lol:

[manu1959]

if people didn't cheat and punch people in that are late or not there.....you wouldn't need this.....i imagine that when time clocks were invented people freaked out....

[Pale Rider]

if people didn't cheat and punch people in that are late or not there.....you wouldn't need this.....i imagine that when time clocks were invented people freaked out....

I know people that have done that manu. Pissed me off when I made such an effort to show up on time.

So people won't be able to 'cheat' on when the get to work or leave. Is that why they're so pissed? To freagin' bad.

[Immanuel]

:eek: OMG! OMG! OMG! IT'S A SIGN OF THE TIMES! IT'S THE MARK OF THE BEAST! OMG! :eek:


:lol:

Well, at least YOU recognize the potential for such a device.

Hmm, I'm not sure that is a plus or a negative for you. :poke:

Pretty soon it will be that little chip they require you to put in your hand that allows you to buy and sell.



Immie

[Hagbard Celine]

Well, at least YOU recognize the potential for such a device.

Hmm, I'm not sure that is a plus or a negative for you. :poke:

Pretty soon it will be that little chip they require you to put in your hand that allows you to buy and sell.



Immie

Maybe, but that's only if you're not taken in...THE RAPTURE! :eek: OMG!

[hjmick]

Rapture? Isn't that a song by Blondie?

[Hagbard Celine]

Rapture? Isn't that a song by Blondie?

If you'd ever been dragged onto Tribulation Trail you'd know what I'm talking about.

[Mr. P]

A good thing IMO. If people were more honest, employees AND employers, this would have never come about.

For those employees who may oppose it....think of the employer that pays you for 40 hrs when you really worked 50...not anymore, if they have this baby. Works both ways.

[Classact]

A good thing IMO. If people were more honest, employees AND employers, this would have never come about.

For those employees who may oppose it....think of the employer that pays you for 40 hrs when you really worked 50...not anymore, if they have this baby. Works both ways.Cheating the time clock was a normal thing at my last employer. Sometimes I would have to wait behind the guy in front of me to punch in three cards before I could punch in. At lunch they required us to punch out and in and the crooks would time the supervisors lunch period and take triple lunch periods without the supervisor catching on.

[Pale Rider]

Cheating the time clock was a normal thing at my last employer. Sometimes I would have to wait behind the guy in front of me to punch in three cards before I could punch in. At lunch they required us to punch out and in and the crooks would time the supervisors lunch period and take triple lunch periods without the supervisor catching on.

Seen it done myself. Pissed me off. I never said anything though, I had to work with these people and wasn't going to rat on them.

If you're honest, you have nothing to worry about. Looks to me like the cheaters are the only ones it will piss off.

[Immanuel]

Maybe, but that's only if you're not taken in...THE RAPTURE! :eek: OMG!

You are assuming that the Rapture occurs before the tribulation. What if it doesn't? :eek: :eek:

Pre-Trib, Mid-Trib or Post-Trib rapture? Me I like the idea of a Pre-tribulation rapture, but it seems that is more wishful thinking that Biblically based. :D

Immie

[Pale Rider]

You are assuming that the Rapture occurs before the tribulation. What if it doesn't? :eek: :eek:

Pre-Trib, Mid-Trib or Post-Trib rapture? Me I like the idea of a Pre-tribulation rapture, but it seems that is more wishful thinking that Biblically based. :D

Immie

Funny how the topic of a palm scanner can spin off into something biblical... :uhoh:

[JohnDoe]

I don't like it ONE IOTA.

I don't think they should be able to have your fingerprints when it takes our own police to issue a warrent for such or you to commit a crime for them to even be able to get one fingerprint from you...because it is an infringement of the 4th... a right to your privacy and YES biometrics is your Personal effects imo!

and here it is that a company can hold this information on you...a business?

BULL SHIT

Why do INNOCENT, people have to be subjected to this kind of infringement of our privacy because SOME PEOPLE are cheats? Certainly there is another method to crack down on the PERPS, WITHOUT having to take away the privacy of INNOCENT employees that punch that clock honestly every day?

Again....I say bullshit! I am soooo sick of the innocent, honest citizen losing their privacy and other rights because of a FEW dishonest people....PUNISH the Dishonest damnit!

you know those files can be broken in to and your fingerprints are then out there in the open for anyone to plant... I know, I know....who is going to do that and yah dee dah crap....and tinfoil hat crap and so on and so forth.... I don't care, I don't think just because technology is available, gives companies the right to make it mandatory for their workers to give up their own constitutional rights....my biometrics is MY BIOMETRICS, not theirs to have, period! grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

jd

[Trinity]

I don't like it ONE IOTA.

I don't think they should be able to have your fingerprints when it takes our own police to issue a warrent for such or you to commit a crime for them to even be able to get one fingerprint from you...because it is an infringement of the 4th... a right to your privacy and YES biometrics is your Personal effects imo!

and here it is that a company can hold this information on you...a business?

BULL SHIT

Why do INNOCENT, people have to be subjected to this kind of infringement of our privacy because SOME PEOPLE are cheats? Certainly there is another method to crack down on the PERPS, WITHOUT having to take away the privacy of INNOCENT employees that punch that clock honestly every day?

Again....I say bullshit! I am soooo sick of the innocent, honest citizen losing their privacy and other rights because of a FEW dishonest people....PUNISH the Dishonest damnit!

you know those files can be broken in to and your fingerprints are then out there in the open for anyone to plant... I know, I know....who is going to do that and yah dee dah crap....and tinfoil hat crap and so on and so forth.... I don't care, I don't think just because technology is available, gives companies the right to make it mandatory for their workers to give up their own constitutional rights....my biometrics is MY BIOMETRICS, not theirs to have, period! grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

jd

That's funny I was just sitting here thinking the same thing. How long before someone figures out how to get a hold of someones prints through this computer system and place them at the scene of a crime? Go ahead and say that would never happen. Really? Are you sure? You might be surprised at some of the things that can be accomplished with technology now days.

[Mr. P]

I don't like it ONE IOTA.

I don't think they should be able to have your fingerprints when it takes our own police to issue a warrent for such or you to commit a crime for them to even be able to get one fingerprint from you...because it is an infringement of the 4th... a right to your privacy and YES biometrics is your Personal effects imo!

and here it is that a company can hold this information on you...a business?

BULL SHIT

Why do INNOCENT, people have to be subjected to this kind of infringement of our privacy because SOME PEOPLE are cheats? Certainly there is another method to crack down on the PERPS, WITHOUT having to take away the privacy of INNOCENT employees that punch that clock honestly every day?

Again....I say bullshit! I am soooo sick of the innocent, honest citizen losing their privacy and other rights because of a FEW dishonest people....PUNISH the Dishonest damnit!

you know those files can be broken in to and your fingerprints are then out there in the open for anyone to plant... I know, I know....who is going to do that and yah dee dah crap....and tinfoil hat crap and so on and so forth.... I don't care, I don't think just because technology is available, gives companies the right to make it mandatory for their workers to give up their own constitutional rights....my biometrics is MY BIOMETRICS, not theirs to have, period! grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr


jd

:laugh2: I'm guessing you are against preemployment drug screens and background checks too.

Hey, it's simple, JD...DON'T WORK THERE. :poke:

[JohnDoe]

That's funny I was just sitting here thinking the same thing. How long before someone figures out how to get a hold of someones prints through this computer system and place them at the scene of a crime? Go ahead and say that would never happen. Really? Are you sure? You might be surprised at some of the things that can be accomplished with technology now days.

I knowwwwwwwww trinity.... why do you think the cops can't take them from everyone without a warrant? It can lead to set ups and plants...and puts too much power in to the hands of our government...

well if it does that for our government, the same can be said with this business imo, especially since WE KNOW even our own CIA 's computer sytem has been cyber hacked?

[Yurt]

JD has the gist. Is taking your fingerprints an invasion of privacy? if a private party is doing the taking, it is not a 4th amendment violation, you need a state/government actor for that. assuming then, it might be a taking, is it? you leave your prints over everything at work and your employer could lift them at any time, so could your co-worker.

but is it a tort?

i personally think it is way to much private information for a company to have. of course i also believe that in employment (non-critical, e.g., you are not a bus driver, pilot) that requires drug testing is an invasion of privacy. i'm in the minority on that and thus "wrong."

my problem - it ultimately creates an easy database for the government. --yeah, we're uh, lookin, yeah, for uh, yeah, john doe ;), yaz know....oh yeah, he works here. oh, well, we want to see his prints.

argument against that is.....in reality it would probably have saved a lot of murders...zodiac killer comes to mind.

we could take it a step a further...into the orwellian world.....DNA testing....are you really as sick as you claim?

slippery slope argument for sure, but man, the slope looks awfully slick to me

[JohnDoe]

:laugh2: I'm guessing you are against preemployment drug screens and background checks too.

Hey, it's simple, JD...DON'T WORK THERE. :poke:

NO, it is NOT that simple. :)

jd

[Mr. P]

NO, it is NOT that simple. :)

jd

It sure is.

[Yurt]

NO, it is NOT that simple. :)

jd

unfortunately it is. it is fair? what the hell is "fair?" it is private employers that you want to work for. you are choosing them. in a sense, it is a greater argument than government, because we may just happen to be born under a certain "government."

you are free to work in the farming community, the long hours can provide good pay. they don't check your peepee.

i see a difference between drug test and fingerprints. as much as i disagree, i think employers have a right to make sure their employees aren't intoxicated on the job......well, i did it after work......that argument has lost because it is hard to say (with narcotics, unlike alcohol which is more easily detected - breath) whether someone is still intoxicated. the employer is liable for your acts, while you are acting within the scope of your job.

fingerprints, no reasonable need from the employer to invade that expectation of privacy. or is there? as i said, this is a slippery slope, but the slope exists and the slope has its point. what about high security jobs? you think those people complain about having their fingerprint scans taken when they enter a certain area?

these are the issues i struggle with. i favor privacy, however, it is hard to argue such a thing in our day and age. facebook firings....etc...

i think the question is: what is our expectation of privacy, and if we expect such a privacy, does, such a privacy exist?

[JohnDoe]

unfortunately it is. it is fair? what the hell is "fair?" it is private employers that you want to work for. you are choosing them. in a sense, it is a greater argument than government, because we may just happen to be born under a certain "government."

you are free to work in the farming community, the long hours can provide good pay. they don't check your peepee.

i see a difference between drug test and fingerprints. as much as i disagree, i think employers have a right to make sure their employees aren't intoxicated on the job......well, i did it after work......that argument has lost because it is hard to say (with narcotics, unlike alcohol which is more easily detected - breath) whether someone is still intoxicated. the employer is liable for your acts, while you are acting within the scope of your job.

fingerprints, no reasonable need from the employer to invade that expectation of privacy. or is there? as i said, this is a slippery slope, but the slope exists and the slope has its point. what about high security jobs? you think those people complain about having their fingerprint scans taken when they enter a certain area?

these are the issues i struggle with. i favor privacy, however, it is hard to argue such a thing in our day and age. facebook firings....etc...

i think the question is: what is our expectation of privacy, and if we expect such a privacy, does, such a privacy exist?

But my employer can not look under my dress just because he is paying me to do a another job....?

And this is what this feels like to me.

And yes, of course if you work at a place that involves security, one of these devices may need to be used....

BUT to use it on good employees because of a few cheaters on a time clock that they could catch by other means and fire them or punish them is ridiculous imo and a very slippery slope.

What next? Will employees be made to have a chip under the skin to gain access to employment and it is all ok because it is not the government asking us to do such, in order to put food on the table?

Where does this shit end, all in the guise of it being a private company?

Private companies that WE NOW KNOW cooperate with our government without warrants to spy on people?

BULL SHIT. This is such bullshit imo.

jd

[Mr. P]

But my employer can not look under my dress just because he is paying me to do a another job....

And this is what this feels like to me.

And yes, of course if you work at a place that involves security, one of these devices may need to be used....

BUT to use it on good employees because of a few cheaters on a time clock that they could catch by other means and fire them or punish them is ridiculous imo and a very slippery slope.

What next? Will employees be made to have a chip under the skin to gain access to employment and it is all ok because it is not the government asking us to do such, in order to put food on the table?

Where does this shit end, all in the guise of it being a private company?

Private companies that WE NOW KNOW cooperate with our government without warrants to spy on people?

BULL SHIT. This is such bullshit imo.

jd

Which would be....what?

[Yurt]

ohnDoe;223051]But my employer can not look under my dress just because he is paying me to do a another job....

And this is what this feels like to me.

???? last i checked, penis and vagina weren't ID checks.



And yes, of course if you work at a place that involves security, one of these devices may need to be used....

BUT to use it on good employees because of a few cheaters on a time clock that they could catch by other means and fire them or punish them is ridiculous imo and a very slippery slope.

go back and read what i said again. that is not the slippery slope argument i used. it is not about using on a majority of "good" employees vs the minority of "bad" employees, it has to do with ............privacy and choice......



What next? Will employees be made to have a chip under the skin to gain access to employment and it is all ok because it is not the government asking us to do such, in order to put food on the table?

putting something into someone's body is NOT what we are talking about here. however, following the slippery slope, no, this is where the slope ends, for you are actually invading their body. a pee test, arguably could be considered an "invasion." however, IMO, the courts view it as something that comes out and is something that, when weighing overall "rights/issues", favors society because of the dangers that intoxicated people present. Not a bad argument, given roadside sobriety checks. you have no right to be on that road, nor do you have a right to be at that particular job.

you have to understand the argument before you get to the intrusion. it is scary, i don't doubt it. what is the reason? something under the skin is definitely something that exists on the slippery slope. for what is the purpose?


Private companies that WE NOW KNOW cooperate with our government without warrants to spy on people?

BULL SHIT. This is such bullshit imo.


and..........i already told you how to proffer a 4th........if you want, but i don't now anything.........just a poster with his opinions.........thats it

[JohnDoe]

Which would be....what?

How do they KNOW that they have employees punching other employees in or out Mr. P? They obviously have caught them doing it no?

and to answer your question a couple of simple video cams on the time card slots and the time stamp machine could do it fairly cheaply.


jd

[JohnDoe]

???? last i checked, penis and vagina weren't ID checks.




go back and read what i said again. that is not the slippery slope argument i used. it is not about using on a majority of "good" employees vs the minority of "bad" employees, it has to do with ............privacy and choice......

ok i will reread



putting something into someone's body is NOT what we are talking about here. however, following the slippery slope, no, this is where the slope ends, for you are actually invading their body. a pee test, arguably could be considered an "invasion." however, IMO, the courts view it as something that comes out and is something that, when weighing overall "rights/issues", favors society because of the dangers that intoxicated people present. Not a bad argument, given roadside sobriety checks. you have no right to be on that road, nor do you have a right to be at that particular job.

you have to understand the argument before you get to the intrusion. it is scary, i don't doubt it. what is the reason? something under the skin is definitely something that exists on the slippery slope. for what is the purpose?

what is this, "for what is the purpose?" stuff..... I think that is where the slippery slope was made with all slippery slope issues.... :(


and..........i already told you how to proffer a 4th........if you want, but i don't now anything.........just a poster with his opinions.........thats it

I know Yurt, your trying to help me with this but man oh man, I just don't like it and what I can see it leading to, little by little by little, and all for a valid purpose, be certain. :(

ps. can't you refuse a breatholizer at a check point? Or is that against the law?

jd

[Mr. P]

How do they KNOW that they have employees punching other employees in or out Mr. P? They obviously have caught them doing it no?

and to answer your question a couple of simple video cams on the time card slots and the time stamp machine could do it fairly cheaply.


jd

VIDEO? YOU GOTTA BE KIDDING! THAT IS AN INVASION OF MY PRIVACY!

[JohnDoe]

VIDEO? YOU GOTTA BE KIDDING! THAT IS AN INVASION OF MY PRIVACY!

hahahahahahahahahahahaha! you're nuts! lmao!!!!:laugh2:

[Yurt]

I know Yurt, your trying to help me with this but man oh man, I just don't like it and what I can see it leading to, little by little by little, and all for a valid purpose, be certain. :(

ps. can't you refuse a breatholizer at a check point? Or is that against the law?

jd

I'm with you. but what and where do you expect your "privacy?" and do you expect it from a private party?

you can refuse to "blow" at a check point. you "will" be arrested and booked and your refusal to blow will only give credence to the officer who observed you in his/her "opinion."

true, either way you are screwed. but come on JD, what rights are we fighting for? the right to work? the right to drive?

what rights are expressed in the constitution? if not expressed, what rights are fundemental by case law?

[JohnDoe]

I'm with you. but what and where do you expect your "privacy?" and do you expect it from a private party?

you can refuse to "blow" at a check point. you "will" be arrested and booked and your refusal to blow will only give credence to the officer who observed you in his/her "opinion."

true, either way you are screwed. but come on JD, what rights are we fighting for? the right to work? the right to drive?

what rights are expressed in the constitution? if not expressed, what rights are fundemental by case law?
Non-enumerated rights.

we have the right to work, if qualified for the job, imo, it does not have to be spelled out...but we have the right to pursue happiness and working brings that....with putting food on the table.... :D

right- might be overly used, and their may be a better word for what I am trying to say, but my mind is blank on it...

jd

[JohnDoe]

I'm with you. but what and where do you expect your "privacy?" and do you expect it from a private party?

you can refuse to "blow" at a check point. you "will" be arrested and booked and your refusal to blow will only give credence to the officer who observed you in his/her "opinion."

true, either way you are screwed. but come on JD, what rights are we fighting for? the right to work? the right to drive?

what rights are expressed in the constitution? if not expressed, what rights are fundemental by case law?

And yes, i most certainly expect my right to privacy from a private party....it is NONE of a private party's business!!! hahahahahaha! It would not be okay to put up my name and social security number on the net...just because they got that info from me, and they are the private company that I work for....

[Mr. P]

hahahahahahahahahahahaha! you're nuts! lmao!!!!:laugh2:

Yeah but, I'm right and yer wrong. :poke:

I won't argue a right to work but I will point out you have NO right to be employed. :slap:

[Hagbard Celine]

You are assuming that the Rapture occurs before the tribulation. What if it doesn't? :eek: :eek:

Pre-Trib, Mid-Trib or Post-Trib rapture? Me I like the idea of a Pre-tribulation rapture, but it seems that is more wishful thinking that Biblically based. :D

Immie

I'm not assuming anything. I'm making fun of the hillbillies that actually believe in this stuff. No offense.

[JohnDoe]

Yeah but, I'm right and yer wrong. :poke:

I won't argue a right to work but I will point out you have NO right to be employed. :slap:
Well, we will have to agree to disagree, cuzzzzz I still think I am right on this issue!

I don't think that fingerprinting/scanning should be heald over any human beings head in order to get a job.

Finger printing and scanning and keeping the files on for time clock references is an abuse of power on the part of the private entity imo.

It is not even close to drug testing at some places, and I don't agree with that either... not close because at least there is a "purpose" that could save lives...whether because the worker will be operating machinery, or the worker will be privvy to top secret info, or be privvy to company secrets or be privvy to customer's private information and them being a drug user could make the employer culperable or held negligent in some manner.

Someone punching someone else's time card does not warrant the invasion of privacy and the private biometrics of all employees being taken and required...that's where I still stand.


jd

[Mr. P]

Well, we will have to agree to disagree, cuzzzzz I still think I am right on this issue!

I don't think that fingerprinting/scanning should be heald over any human beings head in order to get a job.

Finger printing and scanning and keeping the files on for time clock references is an abuse of power on the part of the private entity imo.

It is not even close to drug testing at some places, and I don't agree with that either... not close because at least there is a "purpose" that could save lives...whether because the worker will be operating machinery, or the worker will be privvy to top secret info, or be privvy to company secrets or be privvy to customer's private information and them being a drug user could make the employer culperable or held negligent in some manner.

Someone punching someone else's time card does not warrant the invasion of privacy and the private biometrics of all employees being taken and required...that's where I still stand.


jd

How is having something that identifies you as you an invasion of privacy? Don't you leave your finger prints everywhere every single day?

What about a digital photo of you taken and compared to a data base of criminals? Is that also an invasion? That technology IS being used in public now.

[JohnDoe]

How is having something that identifies you as you an invasion of privacy? Don't you leave your finger prints everywhere every single day?

What about a digital photo of you taken and compared to a data base of criminals? Is that also an invasion? That technology IS being used in public now.

YES! That too is an invasion of privacy in the guise of making us more secure when after the period it was used/tested in Tampa for a few years around their superbowl time, it was deemed useless and I believe they stopped using it...

Waste of time, doesn't prevent any crime from happening! You may think it is okay for us to turn in to the EU but I don't.

Businesses ARE in cahoots with our government now, giving our government private information that would have take a warrant just a few years ago.

There is NO WAY these businesses should be holding this type of information on us in a database...that also could be easily hacked.

PERIOD.

jd

[Classact]

I think if the company would put a camera on the punch clock a fingerprint wouldn't be necessary. Require supervisors to review photos keyed to worker on a random basis and problem solved.

[Mr. P]

Originally Posted by Mr. P
How is having something that identifies you as you an invasion of privacy? Don't you leave your finger prints everywhere every single day?


Well?

Oh yeah...you suggested video as a solution...but you oppose a digital photo? Gotto splain that one.:poke:

[JohnDoe]

Well?

Oh yeah...you suggested video as a solution...but you oppose a digital photo? Gotto splain that one.:poke:The digital eyescan of the crowds... that they used in Tampa was biometrics. If memory serves, I believe Tampa citizens threw a commotion regarding it....I think they were calmed by being told that the police were not going to keep a database on the random biometric eye scans for any period of time, or something to that manner?

Anyway, a video cam at your work, scanning the time clock area, seeing if one employee clocks in more than once with more than one time card IS an easy solution to their probelm....along with letting every employee know that the cameras are there....as a deterent.

Also, I might suggest, as a previous supervisor/manager in my old life, that there will be other tell tale signs of a cheating on the time clock employee that the supervisor would recognize as not being "right" regarding the person and should follow thru with their gut instinct on that... most any supervisor worth their pay can recognize the cream of the crop and remove the dead wood, with or without the time clock cheating....imo.

jd

[JohnDoe]

I might also suggest that businesses funding and putting in the investment in this kind of technology simply for something a video cam set up could solve fairly easily, MEANS that the companies instituting this technology HAVE OTHER ADDITION PLANS FOR IT....otherwise they would NOT have made the investment...

What are these other plans....?

jd

[Pale Rider]

When I was in the Air Force, I was sent to Area 51 twice to help with the recovery of one of our F-16's that IFE'd into there. When we got there, at the main gate, they took our palm prints, did a retinal scan, and then took a voice print of us reciting our name, rank and serial number. Granted this was for a temporary Krypto security clearance, but you want to talk about "invasion of privacy," there is no worse anywhere. And the icing on the cake was, you had to sign a contract that said if you talked about anything you saw there to anyone for the next twenty years, you could be fined up to $250,000.00 and imprisoned for up to 10 years. Nice people those military.

[Pale Rider]

I'm not assuming anything. I'm making fun of the hillbillies that actually believe in this stuff. No offense.

And us hillbillies that believe this stuff are laughing at you neanderthals that don't. No offense.

[avatar4321]

When I was in the Air Force, I was sent to Area 51 twice to help with the recovery of one of our F-16's that IFE'd into there. When we got there, at the main gate, they took our palm prints, did a retinal scan, and then took a voice print of us reciting our name, rank and serial number. Granted this was for a temporary Krypto security clearance, but you want to talk about "invasion of privacy," there is no worse anywhere. And the icing on the cake was, you had to sign a contract that said if you talked about anything you saw there to anyone for the next twenty years, you could be fined up to $250,000.00 and imprisoned for up to 10 years. Nice people those military.

has it been 20 years yet?

Seriously though, i understand the concerns. but honestly, i think privacy is very much an allusion. its nice when we can get it. but i dont think we really have it as much as we seem to think we do.

My problem isnt as much with fingerprints. they had to take mine for me to take the bar. but I know companies sell phone number lists etc. whats to stop them from selling fingerprints? That would be creepy for me.

Of course, this wouldnt be an issue if people were honest.

[Pale Rider]

has it been 20 years yet?

Seriously though, i understand the concerns. but honestly, i think privacy is very much an allusion. its nice when we can get it. but i dont think we really have it as much as we seem to think we do.

My problem isnt as much with fingerprints. they had to take mine for me to take the bar. but I know companies sell phone number lists etc. whats to stop them from selling fingerprints? That would be creepy for me.

Of course, this wouldnt be an issue if people were honest.

It's been over twenty years.

Yeah this issue definitely has the slippery slope faction in it. So if people feel they have a legitimate privacy concern, get together and file a class action law suit. See what the SC says about it.

[JohnDoe]

When I was in the Air Force, I was sent to Area 51 twice to help with the recovery of one of our F-16's that IFE'd into there. When we got there, at the main gate, they took our palm prints, did a retinal scan, and then took a voice print of us reciting our name, rank and serial number. Granted this was for a temporary Krypto security clearance, but you want to talk about "invasion of privacy," there is no worse anywhere. And the icing on the cake was, you had to sign a contract that said if you talked about anything you saw there to anyone for the next twenty years, you could be fined up to $250,000.00 and imprisoned for up to 10 years. Nice people those military.Sheesh...sure was...but almost understandable, because of the top secret situation...

They are talking about keeping a database of MOSTLY innocent, honest people's fingerprints, that could be cyberly broken in to more than likely and used in a devious manner....you just don't know, or yes, God forbid they could turn them over to our government if asked to do such, without a warrant, which under current law, would be illegal but permissable so far.... with the phone companies, though... not settled yet...so we will see on that...

And Avatar's point of selling this data...how is THAT protected....how can one prevent an employer from selling your own personal info? Is the answer to this also, they are your private employer, they can do whatever they want with your private and personal effects, whenever they want, to whoever they want, as long as they are the Employer?

I don't think so! I really don't!

jd

[Mr. P]

It's been over twenty years.

Yeah this issue definitely has the slippery slope faction in it. So if people feel they have a legitimate privacy concern, get together and file a class action law suit. See what the SC says about it.

Guessing th USSC would side with the companies. Since like I said you leave prints everywhere every day...it can't really be an invasion of privacy.

About military secret stuff...I haven't talked about secret stuff I learned of 33 years ago. Is it still secret? Probably not...but still...I ain't talkin.:laugh2:

[JohnDoe]

Guessing th USSC would side with the companies. Since like I said you leave prints everywhere every day...it can't really be an invasion of privacy.

About military secret stuff...I haven't talked about secret stuff I learned of 33 years ago. Is it still secret? Probably not...but still...I ain't talkin.:laugh2:

It's a database of your prints, there is a difference...

[hjmick]

About military secret stuff...I haven't talked about secret stuff I learned of 33 years ago. Is it still secret? Probably not...but still...I ain't talkin.:laugh2:

We know. We've been watching you...

[Yurt]

When I was in the Air Force, I was sent to Area 51 twice to help with the recovery of one of our F-16's that IFE'd into there. When we got there, at the main gate, they took our palm prints, did a retinal scan, and then took a voice print of us reciting our name, rank and serial number. Granted this was for a temporary Krypto security clearance, but you want to talk about "invasion of privacy," there is no worse anywhere. And the icing on the cake was, you had to sign a contract that said if you talked about anything you saw there to anyone for the next twenty years, you could be fined up to $250,000.00 and imprisoned for up to 10 years. Nice people those military.

so is it true, MFM is a real space alien?

[Mr. P]

It's a database of your prints, there is a difference...
What would that be exactly, the difference? Does your print change if an employer has it for ID? What about yer SSI number?


We know. We've been watching you...

I know! I can still see the black copters at night! They're HERE!!!

[Immanuel]

Funny how the topic of a palm scanner can spin off into something biblical... :uhoh:

Hehe, well, I would assume that people like Tim LaHaye (Left Behind) are the ones to blame for that. Their speculation that micro-chips would be used to track people and as the Mark of the Beast has gotten wide spread attention. I for one am not certain that it will be micro-chips rather than something more futuristic, but when they come knocking on my door demanding I take that chip, I'm not playing their game! :D

Of course before micro-chips they were saying it was the Social Security Number... hmmm, there is one of those in my wallet! What will I ever do now? :D


I'm not assuming anything. I'm making fun of the hillbillies that actually believe in this stuff. No offense.

None taken.


And us hillbillies that believe this stuff are laughing at you neanderthals that don't. No offense.

Laughing? I'm not laughing. I'm praying for their souls! :)

Immie

[Pale Rider]

Sheesh...sure was...but almost understandable, because of the top secret situation...

jd
Actually 'Krypto' is the top security clearance there is, even above Top Secret.


Guessing th USSC would side with the companies. Since like I said you leave prints everywhere every day...it can't really be an invasion of privacy.

About military secret stuff...I haven't talked about secret stuff I learned of 33 years ago. Is it still secret? Probably not...but still...I ain't talkin.:laugh2:
I don't know Mr. P. You do purport an argument, but not the only one for sure. JD does have a point also.

And I have told a couple stories, but not everything. Never will either... :D


so is it true, MFM is a real space alien?
Right off the saucer Yurt... :laugh: