Socialist, Socialist, or wanna be

[Yurt]

The way i see it, we have no good choices this election. my friends on this site keep talking libertarian, but, where is that choice and what does that choice get me?

so, i have questions:

if i don't vote for mcclame, how does that help hillary or obama?

if i vote for mcclame, how does that hurt hillary or obama?

if i vote libertarian, will that help or hurt -- hillary, obama, mccain?


if a dem gets into office, it could help repubs in 2012. many repubs are leaving for the libertarian party. i have always thought that this two party system is no good. that being, is this where we make the stand? or is this the election, like every other before it, where the TP stand merely helps the opposing party?

[DragonStryk72]

The way i see it, we have no good choices this election. my friends on this site keep talking libertarian, but, where is that choice and what does that choice get me?

so, i have questions:

if i don't vote for mcclame, how does that help hillary or obama?

if i vote for mcclame, how does that hurt hillary or obama?

if i vote libertarian, will that help or hurt -- hillary, obama, mccain?


if a dem gets into office, it could help repubs in 2012. many repubs are leaving for the libertarian party. i have always thought that this two party system is no good. that being, is this where we make the stand? or is this the election, like every other before it, where the TP stand merely helps the opposing party?

The pendulum had been swing right for several years after 9/11, and we saw what a fully Republican dominated government could do. Now, disillusioned to that, I believe the pendulum is swinging to the other extreme, so that we will now see what complete dem control ends up doing. I believe this to be a necessary step in snapping people out of the idea that one side or the other has the right idea.

[Yurt]

The pendulum had been swing right for several years after 9/11, and we saw what a fully Republican dominated government could do. Now, disillusioned to that, I believe the pendulum is swinging to the other extreme, so that we will now see what complete dem control ends up doing. I believe this to be a necessary step in snapping people out of the idea that one side or the other has the right idea.

so then, the tick tock must always swing....no side being right or wrong, simpy a matter of the pendulum?

[Sitarro]

The pendulum had been swing right for several years after 9/11, and we saw what a fully Republican dominated government could do. Now, disillusioned to that, I believe the pendulum is swinging to the other extreme, so that we will now see what complete dem control ends up doing. I believe this to be a necessary step in snapping people out of the idea that one side or the other has the right idea.

Because the Republicans had no control over an entity that is nearly as powerful as Congress ( the news media) and very visible anti-conservative whiner professionals ( Hollywood and activist like Sharpton, etc. ) we had many members that acted like there was no Republican majority. Those coupled with an opposition that would vote in a block against a cure for cancer if it was presented by a Republican and you have the reality of what was supposedly a Republican majority. Add to that mix an ignorant public (especially those that pretend to be "progressive) that is more malleable than Silly Putty and you have a climate where very little positive will be allowed to have happen because the left is not interested in what is correct or helpful to this country. They are only interested in getting and remaining in power........ so to say that the government was dominated by Republicans is a misnomer.:salute:

[Yurt]

Because the Republicans had no control over an entity that is nearly as powerful as Congress ( the news media) and very visible anti-conservative whiner professionals ( Hollywood and activist like Sharpton, etc. ) we had many members that acted like there was no Republican majority. Those coupled with an opposition that would vote in a block against a cure for cancer if it was presented by a Republican and you have the reality of what was supposedly a Republican majority. Add to that mix an ignorant public (especially those that pretend to be "progressive) that is more malleable than Silly Putty and you have a climate where very little positive will be allowed to have happen because the left is not interested in what is correct or helpful to this country. They are only interested in getting and remaining in power........ so to say that the government was dominated by Republicans is a misnomer.:salute:

you shouldn't use so many big words, it confuses them.....

[5stringJeff]

The way i see it, we have no good choices this election. my friends on this site keep talking libertarian, but, where is that choice and what does that choice get me?

so, i have questions:

if i don't vote for mcclame, how does that help hillary or obama?

if i vote for mcclame, how does that hurt hillary or obama?

if i vote libertarian, will that help or hurt -- hillary, obama, mccain?


if a dem gets into office, it could help repubs in 2012. many repubs are leaving for the libertarian party. i have always thought that this two party system is no good. that being, is this where we make the stand? or is this the election, like every other before it, where the TP stand merely helps the opposing party?

Here's your choice in 2008: http://www.rootforamerica.com/

[Sitarro]

Here's your choice in 2008: http://www.rootforamerica.com/

Isn't he too good looking to be taken seriously, like Mitt Romney?

[5stringJeff]

Isn't he too good looking to be taken seriously, like Mitt Romney?

Well, on the issues, he's right on.

[hjmick]

He looks like a televangelist.

[Yurt]

Here's your choice in 2008: http://www.rootforamerica.com/

the tired old question:

if i vote for him, will this not diminish my vote in the "general" election. my vote, gives a "vote" to the dems?

you have to start somewhere, true, so, is the time?

[5stringJeff]

the tired old question:

if i vote for him, will this not diminish my vote in the "general" election. my vote, gives a "vote" to the dems?

you have to start somewhere, true, so, is the time?

My philosophy is that I'm not going to vote for someone who doesn't represent my views. Or, as they say, "the lesser of two evils is still evil."

I'm not voting for McCain, Obama, or Clinton, as they are all anti-freedom.

[Yurt]

My philosophy is that I'm not going to vote for someone who doesn't represent my views. Or, as they say, "the lesser of two evils is still evil."

I'm not voting for McCain, Obama, or Clinton, as they are all anti-freedom.

i agree. where does this leave us then, when as you know, the "lesser evils" will get the vote.

or, do you have plan that will enable the third party to win?

[5stringJeff]

i agree. where does this leave us then, when as you know, the "lesser evils" will get the vote.

or, do you have plan that will enable the third party to win?

The only plan I have is to cast my vote for the Libertarian and convince everyone I can to do likewise. Everyone always complains about the lack of choices, but by voting only D or R, you are propagating the same two parties.

Will the Libertarians win in 2008? No. Can they get enough of the vote to start getting recognized as a 'legitimate' third party? Hopefully. The LP also runs candidates at the state and local level, which most other third parties don't, which builds the organization's political know-how and legitimacy.

[Juantew]

The problem is, (I need to check my stats), but I hear that people refusing to go to the polls just because there is nobody running is how we got Carter.

If you don't vote, you don't have the right to bitch about the outcome.

I WISH poeple from both sides would go libertarian, the only solution I see is to have three viable parties. But even then, there could be great divisiveness; "Small L libertaarians" seem to be for self sufficiency and personal responsiblity, large L libertarians have a beent that sounds more like socialism (small l= classical liberal? Large l= neo-liberal/socialist?)

I'm voting for Mccain, now that there's no conservative running, at least he's not fascist.

[DragonStryk72]

Because the Republicans had no control over an entity that is nearly as powerful as Congress ( the news media) and very visible anti-conservative whiner professionals ( Hollywood and activist like Sharpton, etc. ) we had many members that acted like there was no Republican majority. Those coupled with an opposition that would vote in a block against a cure for cancer if it was presented by a Republican and you have the reality of what was supposedly a Republican majority. Add to that mix an ignorant public (especially those that pretend to be "progressive) that is more malleable than Silly Putty and you have a climate where very little positive will be allowed to have happen because the left is not interested in what is correct or helpful to this country. They are only interested in getting and remaining in power........ so to say that the government was dominated by Republicans is a misnomer.:salute:

Yeah, the dems rolled over, we know, it's been discussed, I'm not saying your wrong. This is what I'm saying: In order to see the folly in the party system, america is going to need to screw up in the other direction now. Now, at first, people embraced the republican majority, including democrats ("I voted for the war, before I voted against the war").

I am not speaking about which side is right, or which side is wrong, I am talking about the perception of our system that most americans have right now, which is that putting a Dem in the top seat would be a good thing, with a Dem majority in power. I do not believe it will be good, it will be another colossal cluster fuck, only going the opposite direction of the last one. But a CF, regardless of direction, is still a CF.

[Sitarro]

Yeah, the dems rolled over, we know, it's been discussed, I'm not saying your wrong. This is what I'm saying: In order to see the folly in the party system, america is going to need to screw up in the other direction now. Now, at first, people embraced the republican majority, including democrats ("I voted for the war, before I voted against the war").

I am not speaking about which side is right, or which side is wrong, I am talking about the perception of our system that most americans have right now, which is that putting a Dem in the top seat would be a good thing, with a Dem majority in power. I do not believe it will be good, it will be another colossal cluster fuck, only going the opposite direction of the last one. But a CF, regardless of direction, is still a CF.

I understand, until we get a press that cares about our country, we will always be fighting against 2 enemies of the America I love.

[DragonStryk72]

The only plan I have is to cast my vote for the Libertarian and convince everyone I can to do likewise. Everyone always complains about the lack of choices, but by voting only D or R, you are propagating the same two parties.

Will the Libertarians win in 2008? No. Can they get enough of the vote to start getting recognized as a 'legitimate' third party? Hopefully. The LP also runs candidates at the state and local level, which most other third parties don't, which builds the organization's political know-how and legitimacy.

Alright, I like him, I admit it, he's got me. I kind of wish he'd get behind the Fair Tax instead of the flat tax, but still, I can always send an email with some information to him, since from what I'm reading he actually listens to the people that are potentially voting for him. This would be a big difference from what I've seen in other candidates.

[5stringJeff]

Alright, I like him, I admit it, he's got me. I kind of wish he'd get behind the Fair Tax instead of the flat tax, but still, I can always send an email with some information to him, since from what I'm reading he actually listens to the people that are potentially voting for him. This would be a big difference from what I've seen in other candidates.

The FairTax, as currently promoted, has its own problems (rebate checks = huge bureaucracy). But a flat income tax is certainly an improvement over the current system.

[DragonStryk72]

The FairTax, as currently promoted, has its own problems (rebate checks = huge bureaucracy). But a flat income tax is certainly an improvement over the current system.

It is the current tax system, or at least it was. The Fair Tax will require significantly less bureaucracy than the current one, including a removal of the IRS, and can be administered quickly and efficiently via direct deposit, or through several other options such as an EBT card, but not by checks, which, as you said, are a huge hassle.