View Full Version : President Bush Veto's Bill Banning Waterboarding
nevadamedic
03-08-2008, 03:54 PM
Story Highlights
Bush: Wrong to ban "practices that have a proven ... record of keeping America safe"
Bill would also ban beating, electrocuting, burning, using dogs
Also would ban stripping detainees, forcing them to perform or mimic sexual acts
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/....ap/index.html
Thank god. Don't get me wrong I don't think Waterboarding is appropriate in all circumstances, just a select few. It is also rarely used. It has only been used about six times since the War On Terror began and the last time was in 2003. What people don't understand is that the CIA can't just Waterboard anyone they want. It is a lengthy process to get it approved.
First the CIA has to bring the evidence they have and the reasons that they feel needs to be done to the President and Vice President. Then the President and Vice President has to get the support of the Attorney General and the heads of the intelligence community and even if he gets that he can deny the CIA's request, which hes has done a lot more then he has approved.
The only form of torture on this bill that I disagree with is the sexual humiliation. There is no positive benefit to this at all and it is disgusting. We can achieve the same results or better results by Waterboarding or some of the other measures we have.
The President is right, we have to have the ability to use (Not Abuse) all of the tools we can to prevent another disaster like 9/11.
Gaffer
03-08-2008, 05:10 PM
Most of those additional "practices" are already banned. It was another silly bill presented by the dumbocrats.
bullypulpit
03-08-2008, 05:16 PM
Story Highlights
Bush: Wrong to ban "practices that have a proven ... record of keeping America safe"
Bill would also ban beating, electrocuting, burning, using dogs
Also would ban stripping detainees, forcing them to perform or mimic sexual acts
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/....ap/index.html
Thank god. Don't get me wrong I don't think Waterboarding is appropriate in all circumstances, just a select few. It is also rarely used. It has only been used about six times since the War On Terror began and the last time was in 2003. What people don't understand is that the CIA can't just Waterboard anyone they want. It is a lengthy process to get it approved.
First the CIA has to bring the evidence they have and the reasons that they feel needs to be done to the President and Vice President. Then the President and Vice President has to get the support of the Attorney General and the heads of the intelligence community and even if he gets that he can deny the CIA's request, which hes has done a lot more then he has approved.
The only form of torture on this bill that I disagree with is the sexual humiliation. There is no positive benefit to this at all and it is disgusting. We can achieve the same results or better results by Waterboarding or some of the other measures we have.
The President is right, we have to have the ability to use (Not Abuse) all of the tools we can to prevent another disaster like 9/11.
Under international law, US treaty and US law, until the Bush administration came to power, water-boarding was defined as torture. Through rhetorical chicanery, the Bush administration tried to change that definition. His veto of the bill banning water-boarding is just further proof of his disconnect from reality and his disregard for the rule of law.
nevadamedic
03-08-2008, 05:26 PM
Under international law, US treaty and US law, until the Bush administration came to power, water-boarding was defined as torture. Through rhetorical chicanery, the Bush administration tried to change that definition. His veto of the bill banning water-boarding is just further proof of his disconnect from reality and his disregard for the rule of law.
Presdient Bush didn't change the rules, the terrorists behind 9/11 and the other terrorist attacks against our country changed the rules and showed that there was a need for this.
Gaffer
03-08-2008, 07:06 PM
Under international law, US treaty and US law, until the Bush administration came to power, water-boarding was defined as torture. Through rhetorical chicanery, the Bush administration tried to change that definition. His veto of the bill banning water-boarding is just further proof of his disconnect from reality and his disregard for the rule of law.
Until the NYT got hold of a story about waterboarding no one had ever heard of it. And no one cared. It became popular for use in Bush bashing. Now far left wackos like you use it as a rallying cry.
Mr. P
03-08-2008, 07:17 PM
Waterboarding is 100% effective without death or physical injury.
Having EXPERIENCED IT I AM 100% for using it.
I believe that waterboarding should be permitted, upon those terrorists that have vital info. However, these terrorists, should be terrorists, and not some innocent arab guy picked up due to faulty intelligence.
retiredman
03-08-2008, 07:47 PM
I believe that waterboarding should be permitted, upon those terrorists that have vital info. However, these terrorists, should be terrorists, and not some innocent arab guy picked up due to faulty intelligence.
ah, but there is the rub...how does one KNOW that the arab detainee is some terrorists who has vital information or just some arab picked up for being in the wrong place at the wrong time? Some would say, "torture them all" I would tend to disagree with that. So would Jesus, I think.
ah, but there is the rub...how does one KNOW that the arab detainee is some terrorists who has vital information or just some arab picked up for being in the wrong place at the wrong time? Some would say, "torture them all" I would tend to disagree with that. So would Jesus, I think.
I agree, i guess the key- is to make certain that the guy in custody- is the genuine terrorist. Unfortunately, we live in a world of secret prisons and rendition- no one knows who has been picked up and what is happening to them.
retiredman
03-08-2008, 08:01 PM
I agree, i guess the key- is to make certain that the guy in custody- is the genuine terrorist. Unfortunately, we live in a world of secret prisons and rendition- no one knows who has been picked up and what is happening to them.
and again...how do we make certain someone is a terrorist or that someone has important knowledge without torturing them to find out?
Gaffer
03-08-2008, 08:02 PM
The only time it is used is when they know they have the right guy. The US is not running around in arab countries grabbing mo citizen off the street and torturing him. That's iran's thing. The ones that get the special treatment have been captured either through intelligence work and positively identified or on the battlefield, caught in the act. Pictures, passports, various id's are used to identify them along with DNA samples. When these guys are taken in for the big interrogations they are known. The average mo has more to worry about from the local police than from US intelligence.
Kathianne
03-08-2008, 08:03 PM
The only time it is used is when they know they have the right guy. The US is not running around in arab countries grabbing mo citizen off the street and torturing him. That's iran's thing. The ones that get the special treatment have been captured either through intelligence work and positively identified or on the battlefield, caught in the act. Pictures, passports, various id's are used to identify them along with DNA samples. When these guys are taken in for the big interrogations they are known. The average mo has more to worry about from the local police than from US intelligence.
3 times since 9/11. Nuff said.
and again...how do we make certain someone is a terrorist or that someone has important knowledge without torturing them to find out?
Well they should me picked up on the basis of credible intelligence, corrobarated intelligence. The US is meant to promote human rights and freedoms- therefore they must ''torture'' those that merit such action.
retiredman
03-08-2008, 08:16 PM
Well they should me picked up on the basis of credible intelligence, corrobarated intelligence. The US is meant to promote human rights and freedoms- therefore they must ''torture'' those that merit such action.
we promote human rights and freedoms and therefore must torture people?
kind of like fucking for virginity?
Mr. P
03-08-2008, 08:17 PM
and again...how do we make certain someone is a terrorist or that someone has important knowledge without torturing them to find out?
I guess we can READ their mind. Hey, that makes as much sense as "Being 100% sure" in a combat situation. 100% is rarely going to be a reality and every situation will be different.
retiredman
03-08-2008, 08:19 PM
I guess we can READ their mind. Hey, that makes as much sense as "Being 100% sure" in a combat situation. 100% is rarely going to be a reality and every situation will be different.
you're right...we should probably just torture them all just to be safe.:laugh2:
we promote human rights and freedoms and therefore must torture people?
kind of like fucking for virginity?
No, i mean that if their is an actual high level terrorist, and there is real evidence that he is a terrorist- then i feel the ''enhanced' interrogation is justified.
Lets get real, the CIA chief admitted to using waterboarding- in in my view that is torture. It happens, it is going on, and im sure it will always continue.
Ps- i did not say the US DOES promote freedoms and human rights. I think i said they want or try to.
Mr. P
03-08-2008, 08:22 PM
you're right...we should probably just torture them all just to be safe.:laugh2:
That's not what I mean and you know it. :slap:
5stringJeff
03-08-2008, 08:59 PM
So Bush will weild his veto pen to allow the CIA the ability to retain a torture technique, but not to stem runaway spending or protect free speech (see: campaign finance reform)? WTF??
nevadamedic
03-08-2008, 10:00 PM
ah, but there is the rub...how does one KNOW that the arab detainee is some terrorists who has vital information or just some arab picked up for being in the wrong place at the wrong time? Some would say, "torture them all" I would tend to disagree with that. So would Jesus, I think.
Torture them all? Ummmmmm how does 3 equal them all? Obviously you are a dip shit if you think that. It takes a lot to get waterboarding approved and thats why it has only happened to 3 people. President Bush could have ordered it done a lot more but he rejected quite a few requests.
nevadamedic
03-08-2008, 10:01 PM
The only time it is used is when they know they have the right guy. The US is not running around in arab countries grabbing mo citizen off the street and torturing him. That's iran's thing. The ones that get the special treatment have been captured either through intelligence work and positively identified or on the battlefield, caught in the act. Pictures, passports, various id's are used to identify them along with DNA samples. When these guys are taken in for the big interrogations they are known. The average mo has more to worry about from the local police than from US intelligence.
My main question is when are we going to Waterboard Obama so we can get Bin Laden's location after all these years?
My main question is when are we going to Waterboard Obama so we can get Bin Laden's location after all these years?
well, if you discriminate against a guy because of his middle name- then why dont you ask the same of the US ambassador to the UN?
nevadamedic
03-08-2008, 10:21 PM
well, if you discriminate against a guy because of his middle name- then why dont you ask the same of the US ambassador to the UN?
What about his ties to the Muslim Religion or his ties to known terrorists? Or not wanting to defend America against these diaper heads? This guy is pulling off the con of the century and his AQ buddies are laughing their asses off and licking their chops at the prospect of controling America.
bullypulpit
03-08-2008, 10:23 PM
Presdient Bush didn't change the rules, the terrorists behind 9/11 and the other terrorist attacks against our country changed the rules and showed that there was a need for this.
On August 6, 2001, Bush had a PDB entitled <a href=http://news.findlaw.com/hdocs/docs/terrorism/80601pdb.html>Bin Ladin Determined to Strike in US</a>. It was ignored. The Bush administration had the information, but failed to act on it. The 9/11 plotters didn't change the rules, they widened the game. Which begs the question of, "Just why hasn't the Bush administration captured or killed Bin Ladin?" It's been nearly seven years.
The Bush administration's decision to resort to torture in the interrogation of detainees; the rendition of others, including those innocent of ANY wrong doing to countries which then tortured them; the establishment of extralegal prisons and courts...these are the changes wrought by the Bush administration. Such actions have no place in a free, open or civilized society. They are the actions of a despot. Such actions only serve to fan the flames of hatred towards this country. And, ultimately,they are acts of moral cowardice, perpetrated by those too fearful to pay the price their freedom demands.
bullypulpit
03-08-2008, 10:30 PM
Waterboarding is 100% effective without death or physical injury.
Having EXPERIENCED IT I AM 100% for using it.
And you know this how? Did you perhaps go to SERE school? If that's the case, lat me refer you here, <a href=http://smallwarsjournal.com/blog/2007/10/waterboarding-is-torture-perio/>Waterboarding is Torture… Period</a>. An article by a former Master Instructor and Chief of Training at the US Navy Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape School in San Diego, Malcolm Nance.
To support the Bush administration's use of waterboarding, and other forms of torture, is implicit support for the terrorists.
What about his ties to the Muslim Religion or his ties to known terrorists? Or not wanting to defend America against these diaper heads? This guy is pulling off the con of the century and his AQ buddies are laughing their asses off and licking their chops at the prospect of controling America.
HAHAHAHAHAHHAAHA.- typical republican- doesnt know what it is happening inside nor outside your country. How the f**** is he pulling off a con? He is a christian.
You are so ridiculous,:lame2:. Who said he has ties to known terrorists? show the evidence. HE IS A SENATOR, HE HAS NOT JUST ARRIVED FROM OVERSEAS 2 DAYS AGO TO SUDDENLY RUN OF PRESIDENT.
DONT U THINK HOMELAND SECURITY/CIA WOULD HAVE GOT HIM IF HE WAS A F****** TERRORIST. HE IS RUNNING TO BE THE PRESIDENT.
nevadamedic
03-08-2008, 11:22 PM
On August 6, 2001, Bush had a PDB entitled <a href=http://news.findlaw.com/hdocs/docs/terrorism/80601pdb.html>Bin Ladin Determined to Strike in US</a>. It was ignored. The Bush administration had the information, but failed to act on it. The 9/11 plotters didn't change the rules, they widened the game. Which begs the question of, "Just why hasn't the Bush administration captured or killed Bin Ladin?" It's been nearly seven years.
The Bush administration's decision to resort to torture in the interrogation of detainees; the rendition of others, including those innocent of ANY wrong doing to countries which then tortured them; the establishment of extralegal prisons and courts...these are the changes wrought by the Bush administration. Such actions have no place in a free, open or civilized society. They are the actions of a despot. Such actions only serve to fan the flames of hatred towards this country. And, ultimately,they are acts of moral cowardice, perpetrated by those too fearful to pay the price their freedom demands.
They couldn't capture Bin Laden or kill him without creating an international incident as he was being protected by the Taliban. Invading another country at that time was a bad idea. Then he struck us and that was considered an act of war and we had the reason to go into any country that harbored him and the other people behind 9/11. Also President Bush issued an Executive Order to capture or kill Bin Laden before 9/11.
Also you should talk about your savior Bill Clinton AKA Slick Willy. He had several chances to get Bin Laden on several occasions,\ but he was to big of a pussy. You guys never mention that as it doesn't go along with your President Bush hating rants.
gabosaurus
03-08-2008, 11:26 PM
Torture of all kinds has always been approved and practiced by the Bushies. They just don't want the terrorists to torture anyone.
Mr. P
03-08-2008, 11:26 PM
And you know this how? Did you perhaps go to SERE school? If that's the case, lat me refer you here, <a href=http://smallwarsjournal.com/blog/2007/10/waterboarding-is-torture-perio/>Waterboarding is Torture… Period</a>. An article by a former Master Instructor and Chief of Training at the US Navy Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape School in San Diego, Malcolm Nance.
To support the Bush administration's use of waterboarding, and other forms of torture, is implicit support for the terrorists.
I know it from the experience. If it matters. yes it was SERE training. I've read the Instructors opinion before. Let me refer you to the actual experience, after you have that under your belt, we have something to discuss. Until then you know nothing more than what you read, same for everyone else. The technique is effective. Call it whatever...results without harm are a plus IMO. I will remain a supporter of waterboarding. Notice I didn't say a supporter of Bush?
nevadamedic
03-08-2008, 11:27 PM
HAHAHAHAHAHHAAHA.- typical republican- doesnt know what it is happening inside nor outside your country. How the f**** is he pulling off a con? He is a christian.
You are so ridiculous,:lame2:. Who said he has ties to known terrorists? show the evidence. HE IS A SENATOR, HE HAS NOT JUST ARRIVED FROM OVERSEAS 2 DAYS AGO TO SUDDENLY RUN OF PRESIDENT.
DONT U THINK HOMELAND SECURITY/CIA WOULD HAVE GOT HIM IF HE WAS A F****** TERRORIST. HE IS RUNNING TO BE THE PRESIDENT.
How about the civil rights leaders who he speaks highly of and are his supporters who blew up building during the movement? That is terrorism. What about the founder of the Nation Of Islam, that is a terror group. Obama attended a radical Muslim School while growing up. The so called church he belongs to is extremly racist against White People. Also he wont wear an American Flag pin and has no faith in the American people, so why should we have faith in him? He is also for letting Bin Laden and his butt buddies run free and not going after them. This guy is a disaster and a terrorist supporter and a racist and we don't need him in office.
nevadamedic
03-08-2008, 11:31 PM
I know it from the experience. If it matters. yes it was SERE training. I've read the Instructors opinion before. Let me refer you to the actual experience, after you have that under your belt, we have something to discuss. Until then you know nothing more than what you read, same for everyone else. The technique is effective. Call it whatever...results without harm are a plus IMO. I will remain a supporter of waterboarding. Notice I didn't say a supporter of Bush?
You should order that shirt that says I'd rather be waterbording. :salute:
nevadamedic
03-08-2008, 11:32 PM
Torture of all kinds has always been approved and practiced by the Bushies. They just don't want the terrorists to torture anyone.
Your right, the Bushies are all for standing up for and protecting their country and other countries that need help and are not cowards like the Looney Left.
How about the civil rights leaders who he speaks highly of and are his supporters who blew up building during the movement? That is terrorism. What about the founder of the Nation Of Islam, that is a terror group. Obama attended a radical Muslim School while growing up. The so called church he belongs to is extremly racist against White People. Also he wont wear an American Flag pin and has no faith in the American people, so why should we have faith in him? He is also for letting Bin Laden and his butt buddies run free and not going after them. This guy is a disaster and a terrorist supporter and a racist and we don't need him in office.
1.He denounced the support of nation of islam.
2. Why should he wear the flag pin? its flag pin- it doesnt mean he is not patriotic- do US soldiers fighting in iraq wear a flag pin?.
3. oh im sorry- so he said he would let osama run free- he bloody wants to attack al qaeda in pakistan and go after them without paks govt support- he is serious abt beating osama.
4. He did not attend a radical school, it was a madrassa in kenya- not a f*** madrrassa run by radicals such as some in pakistan.
5. You need to stop watching those conservative news outlets- typical.
Mr. P
03-08-2008, 11:39 PM
Torture of all kinds has always been approved and practiced by the Bushies. They just don't want the terrorists to torture anyone.
You're showing yer age.
Mr. P
03-08-2008, 11:43 PM
You should order that shirt that says I'd rather be waterbording. :salute:
Never saw it...I'd like one that says "Waterboarding, Ask me if it works".
I should add that it's something I NEVER want to experience again.
nevadamedic
03-08-2008, 11:44 PM
1.He denounced the support of nation of islam.
2. Why should he wear the flag pin? its flag pin- it doesnt mean he is not patriotic- do US soldiers fighting in iraq wear a flag pin?.
3. oh im sorry- so he said he would let osama run free- he bloody wants to attack al qaeda in pakistan and go after them without paks govt support- he is serious abt beating osama.
4. He did not attend a radical school, it was a madrassa in kenya- not a f*** madrrassa run by radicals such as some in pakistan.
5. You need to stop watching those conservative news outlets- typical.
1. he flip flopped on that and would not denounce them at all, even when called on it.
2. He is not patriotic, his wife has even admitted that. The flag pin is a sign of respect for our flag, country and the men and women who have faught and died for our country.
3. No he doesn't. He wants to cut back the Military and new military equipment and wants to be diplomatic instead of going to war with anyone.
4. It was a radical school.
5. Actually I watch CNN which is mostly Liberal, thank you very much.
1. he flip flopped on that and would not denounce them at all, even when called on it.
2. He is not patriotic, his wife has even admitted that. The flag pin is a sign of respect for our flag, country and the men and women who have faught and died for our country.
3. No he doesn't. He wants to cut back the Military and new military equipment and wants to be diplomatic instead of going to war with anyone.
4. It was a radical school.
5. Actually I watch CNN which is mostly Liberal, thank you very much.
1.Look up the dictionary the word ''denounced'' obama used that word.
2.Are you wearing the flag pin as we speak now?.So you are suggesting that every us citizen wears a flag pin? i dont see your freind McCain wearing a flag pin?
3.So you would rather use war as the first option?? Well, if you call in invasion of Iraq as the correct option- then God help us.
4.Cnn's John vause even said it was not a radical school. It also taught christianity, etc etc.
1.Look up the dictionary the word ''denounced'' obama used that word.
2.Are you wearing the flag pin as we speak now?.So you are suggesting that every us citizen wears a flag pin? i dont see your freind McCain wearing a flag pin?
3.So you would rather use war as the first option?? Well, if you call in invasion of Iraq as the correct option- then God help us.
4.Cnn's John vause even said it was not a radical school. It also taught christianity, etc etc.
wrong, he specifically thought denounce and reject were the same thing, go back and see exactly what he said, he only said denounce because shrill cornered his stupidness and he wanted to end the beating.
DragonStryk72
03-09-2008, 12:11 AM
So Bush will weild his veto pen to allow the CIA the ability to retain a torture technique, but not to stem runaway spending or protect free speech (see: campaign finance reform)? WTF??
I know, but water-boarding is so much more visible, and simple. It also encounters being responsible, and we can't have our politician start doing that now can we?
DragonStryk72
03-09-2008, 12:16 AM
wrong, he specifically thought denounce and reject were the same thing, go back and see exactly what he said, he only said denounce because shrill cornered his stupidness and he wanted to end the beating.
Wrong, he was denoucing it, and the only way to shut people up about was to use both terms, denounce and reject, because when he said reject, they got into the Clinton debating the meaning of is. Listen to the WHOLE answer, not just the part you want to hear.
Mr. P
03-09-2008, 12:16 AM
wrong, he specifically thought denounce and reject were the same thing, go back and see exactly what he said, he only said denounce because shrill cornered his stupidness and he wanted to end the beating.
With his education I really doubt that's true.
With his education I really doubt that's true.
it is exactly what he said though. did you see the exchange? i did. and a piece of sheepskin doesn't necessarily mean you are "smart", just means you managed to make it through the program.
nevadamedic
03-09-2008, 08:34 AM
Never saw it...I'd like one that says "Waterboarding, Ask me if it works".
I should add that it's something I NEVER want to experience again.
Here it is............. http://www.thoseshirts.com/wtr.html
I actually bought it among several others. You can make a shirt that says that at www.cafepress.com
nevadamedic
03-09-2008, 08:37 AM
1.Look up the dictionary the word ''denounced'' obama used that word.
2.Are you wearing the flag pin as we speak now?.So you are suggesting that every us citizen wears a flag pin? i dont see your freind McCain wearing a flag pin?
3.So you would rather use war as the first option?? Well, if you call in invasion of Iraq as the correct option- then God help us.
4.Cnn's John vause even said it was not a radical school. It also taught christianity, etc etc.
1. Your an idiot.
2. I wear a flag pin everyday. Senator McCain does in fact wear a flag pin.
3.Yes, since diplomacy never works, 9/11 and Saddam are perfect examples of that.
4. Wow, a CNN person siding with Obama Bin Laden, who would have thought?
bullypulpit
03-09-2008, 10:58 AM
1. Your an idiot.
Ad hominem attack...You're out of intellectual ammunition.
2. I wear a flag pin everyday. Senator McCain does in fact wear a flag pin.
Empty shows of patriotism, accomplish nothing but make the person wearing a flag pin made in China feel better.
3.Yes, since diplomacy never works, 9/11 and Saddam are perfect examples of that.
Still conflating 9/11 an Saddam Hussein I see. Saddam had no more to do with 9/11 than I do with setting the price of oil.
4. Wow, a CNN person siding with Obama Bin Laden, who would have thought?
The story of Barak Obama attending a madrasa have been so thoroughly debunked that it, and its advocates, have no credibility.
5stringJeff
03-09-2008, 11:12 AM
1. Your an idiot.
It's "you're an idiot." As in, you are an idiot (http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/youare).
nevadamedic
03-09-2008, 01:10 PM
I know, but water-boarding is so much more visible, and simple. It also encounters being responsible, and we can't have our politician start doing that now can we?
Also not everyone can preform it. Only select agents and people with the training to take it to the edge but not over can use this technique. These people are fighting an unthinkable evil and we must give them the tools they need to win this fight.
If I were to ask the Liberal's of this board that if there was a guarantee that if we Waterboarded a certain person we could get Bin Laden's location, the scary answer they would give would be no we would rather Bin Laden run loose then you Waterboard a poor innocent terrorist.
nevadamedic
03-09-2008, 01:15 PM
Ad hominem attack...You're out of intellectual ammunition.
Empty shows of patriotism, accomplish nothing but make the person wearing a flag pin made in China feel better.
Empty? You are living in the wrong country and it is made in the USA.
Still conflating 9/11 an Saddam Hussein I see. Saddam had no more to do with 9/11 than I do with setting the price of oil.
Well then you must be setting the price of Oil because Saddam was involved with 9/11 in one way or another.
The story of Barak Obama attending a madrasa have been so thoroughly debunked that it, and its advocates, have no credibility.
It was debunked by Obama's spin machine. Real journalist's have gone to that country and Muslim school and have discovered the truth. Obama's people have enough money do debunk anything, he could even debunk the story that he is not black if he really wanted to.
nevadamedic
03-09-2008, 01:15 PM
It's "you're an idiot." As in, you are an idiot (http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/youare).
See that's not fair, I can't every reply to your 5th grade remarks because you will abuse your power and ban me.
5stringJeff
03-09-2008, 01:21 PM
See that's not fair, I can't every reply to your 5th grade remarks because you will abuse your power and ban me.
Are you kidding me? I have yet to ban anyone on this board, save for one-post spammers. You'll notice that I have conversations and debates with plenty of people, who all post without fear of banning.
If you'd like to lodge an official complaint of my 'abuse of power,' please feel free to PM Jim or MtnBiker.
nevadamedic
03-09-2008, 02:33 PM
Are you kidding me? I have yet to ban anyone on this board, save for one-post spammers. You'll notice that I have conversations and debates with plenty of people, who all post without fear of banning.
If you'd like to lodge an official complaint of my 'abuse of power,' please feel free to PM Jim or MtnBiker.
I'm not stupid, if I said exactly what I thought about you I would get a permaban from you.
bullypulpit
03-09-2008, 05:46 PM
It was debunked by Obama's spin machine. Real journalist's have gone to that country and Muslim school and have discovered the truth. Obama's people have enough money do debunk anything, he could even debunk the story that he is not black if he really wanted to.
And which "real" journalists might that be? Links please.
<a href=http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/01/22/obama.madrassa/>HERE'S</a> what a real journalist found. But don't let the facts stand in the way of your willful ignorance and, perhaps, racism.
Kathianne
03-09-2008, 06:09 PM
Are you kidding me? I have yet to ban anyone on this board, save for one-post spammers. You'll notice that I have conversations and debates with plenty of people, who all post without fear of banning.
If you'd like to lodge an official complaint of my 'abuse of power,' please feel free to PM Jim or MtnBiker.
It's true! I've argued with you plenty of times, not once have I feared being banned. As far as I'm concerned, I've never seen you post anything that wasn't valid, if upon rare occasion a bit to the point, like that one with NM, but he brought that upon himself. Go ahead NM, neg me, like I care.
nevadamedic
03-09-2008, 06:19 PM
And which "real" journalists might that be? Links please.
<a href=http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/01/22/obama.madrassa/>HERE'S</a> what a real journalist found. But don't let the facts stand in the way of your willful ignorance and, perhaps, racism.
I created a thread called The Real Barack Obama with a story with research by credible journalists, but here is more...............
http://www.newsmax.com/insider_report/Was_Obama_Muslim/2008/01/13/64043.html
http://www.newsmax.com/insidecover/Islamic_Links_on_Obama_We/2008/02/25/75322.html
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=57363
http://illinoisreview.typepad.com/obamawatch/2007/01/obama_muslim_co.html
I've got a shitload more.
DragonStryk72
03-09-2008, 09:21 PM
Are you kidding me? I have yet to ban anyone on this board, save for one-post spammers. You'll notice that I have conversations and debates with plenty of people, who all post without fear of banning.
If you'd like to lodge an official complaint of my 'abuse of power,' please feel free to PM Jim or MtnBiker.
Dude, until this post, I didn't realize you were a mod.
jimnyc
03-09-2008, 09:37 PM
See that's not fair, I can't every reply to your 5th grade remarks because you will abuse your power and ban me.
I'm not stupid, if I said exactly what I thought about you I would get a permaban from you.
Why the baseless accusations? Can you show a pattern from Jeff's moderating where he has banned people or abused his power? Or do you claim such to stray away from debating someone who is head and shoulders above you in intelligence?
I created a thread called The Real Barack Obama with a story with research by credible journalists, but here is more...............
I've got a shitload more.
we don't doubt it
nevadamedic
03-09-2008, 11:12 PM
Why the baseless accusations? Can you show a pattern from Jeff's moderating where he has banned people or abused his power? Or do you claim such to stray away from debating someone who is head and shoulders above you in intelligence?
Look at the series of threads he kept banning me from when certain other members were being far worse.
glockmail
03-10-2008, 05:51 AM
and again...how do we make certain someone is a terrorist or that someone has important knowledge without torturing them to find out?
Duh. They're the ones that our CIA has been looking for. :pee:
nevadamedic
03-10-2008, 07:32 AM
Duh. They're the ones that our CIA has been looking for. :pee:
If it were up to Maineman and his idol the Muslim Barack Hussein Obama we would give the terrorists the Congressional Medal of Honor.
bullypulpit
03-10-2008, 07:39 AM
I created a thread called The Real Barack Obama with a story with research by credible journalists, but here is more...............
http://www.newsmax.com/insider_report/Was_Obama_Muslim/2008/01/13/64043.html
http://www.newsmax.com/insidecover/Islamic_Links_on_Obama_We/2008/02/25/75322.html
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=57363
http://illinoisreview.typepad.com/obamawatch/2007/01/obama_muslim_co.html
I've got a shitload more.
NewsMaxx is a right wing-nut tool, as is World Net Daily. BTW, the photo posted in the WND piece was of Obama in native Kenyan garb...His father IS Kenyan. No religious affiliation is attached to the garb. The Illinois review piece is an op-ed blog, long on assertion and innuendo...SHort on facts, as are the rest of the links you presented.
Admit it...The thought of a black man as POTUS just sends you scurrying for your Klan robes.
diuretic
03-10-2008, 08:06 AM
I'm not stupid, if I said exactly what I thought about you I would get a permaban from you.
Bull bloody shit you would.
jimnyc
03-10-2008, 09:18 AM
Look at the series of threads he kept banning me from when certain other members were being far worse.
If someone is disruptive to a thread they may get removed from further participation in said thread.
But what does that have to do with giving you a "permaban" as you stated?
Roadrunner
03-10-2008, 02:47 PM
ah, but there is the rub...how does one KNOW that the arab detainee is some terrorists who has vital information or just some arab picked up for being in the wrong place at the wrong time? .
They knew that the three who were waterboarded had the information they needed to prevent further attacks. No guessing at all was involved in those particular instances.
Some would say, "torture them all" I would tend to disagree with that.
Who is the "some" who say to torture them all? As has already been pointed out in this post, waterboarding is selected for use only on a very few which are of a very high intelligence caliber.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.