Leaving the GOP

[5stringJeff]

I originally posted this here (http://www.debatepolicy.com/showpost.php?p=196393) but I thought it deserved its own thread. I'm such a post whore!! :)


-------------

I think we are seeing the GOP move to the left and leave the conservative base. Much like the Democrat Party moved left, creating "Reagan Democrats," the GOP is now moving left, creating voters like you who are disenchanted with the party.

So what are conservatives to do? Either a) vote with the party (and for McCain), thereby supporting the GOP's shift to the left, or b) don't vote for McCain, thereby abandoning the GOP and handing the election to the Democrats. Neither option sounds great, but I'd rather have four years of bad governance (with a Dem president) than a permanent shift in the political parties (with conservative support for McCain).

I didn't leave the GOP. The GOP left me.

[retiredman]

good luck...and thanks!

[avatar4321]

i would consider rethinking it. The choice is up to you. But within the party we can reform things. outside, we cannot do much. We can still vote for conservatives in congress and local positions.

[Dilloduck]

Who is the real power within the GOP anyway ?

[5stringJeff]

Who is the real power within the GOP anyway ?

Who has the real power? Fundraisers and voters. Withhold money and votes, and the party apparatus withers.

[gabosaurus]

Does this mean you are becoming a liberal?
If you are, there are plenty of trees in my neighborhood that need hugging.

[Dilloduck]

Who has the real power? Fundraisers and voters. Withhold money and votes, and the party apparatus withers.

There is no leadership ?

[Mr. P]

I wish I could remember the details but I can't so I'll just pull from memory, hazy as it is.

Just prior to the 2000 election I saw this guy being interviewed about the GOP, it's future etc. He was an old time GOP member who worked behind the scenes for 30 years. He said there was a battle going on between the "old guard" and the "New" regarding the direction the party should move. This interview was
just days before the election, the Saturday prior. The interviewer asked him when the war (within the party) would begin, his answer was "Wednesday morning".

It seems to me the old guard lost the war. So yeah, it's true, the party left us. IMO

[Dilloduck]

I wish I could remember the details but I can't so I'll just pull from memory, hazy as it is.

Just prior to the 2000 election I saw this guy being interviewed about the GOP, it's future etc. He was an old time GOP member who worked behind the scenes for 30 years. He said there was a battle going on between the "old guard" and the "New" regarding the direction the party should move. This interview was
just days before the election, the Saturday prior. The interviewer asked him when the war (within the party) would begin, his answer was "Wednesday morning".

It seems to me the old guard lost the war. So yeah, it's true, the party left us. IMO

ie. no leadership---it shows.

[PostmodernProphet]

than a permanent shift in the political parties

there is no such thing as a "permanent shift" in a political party...but considering four or eight years with Hillary leading a Democratically controlled congress, there IS such a thing as permanent damage to our country......I urge you to reconsider......

[Mr. P]

ie. no leadership---it shows.

A ship without sails...floundering and taking on water for years now. A McCain nomination well sink er for years to come, IMO.

[manu1959]

A ship without sails...floundering and taking on water for years now. A McCain nomination well sink er for years to come, IMO.

i disagree....bush cheney sank the ship....mccain just gets to go down with it.....just a clinton sank the ship and gore kerry got to go down with it....8 year cycles.....8 year cycles.....

[Mr. P]

i disagree....bush cheney sank the ship....mccain just gets to go down with it.....just a clinton sank the ship and gore kerry got to go down with it....8 year cycles.....8 year cycles.....

Nahhhhhh...they just hacked holes in the ship to let the water in. Now someone needs to patch the holes. It ain't McCain, he's part of the water flooding the ship.

[avatar4321]

ie. no leadership---it shows.

Then we need to be leaders. we need to stand up and live conservatism. The strength of conservatives is the strength of the people. We need to look to ourselves, rise up out of any of the ashes that will fall and be the leaders for the next generation. We can start it now. In our own lives. in the lives of our children. We can train them. We can fight for whats right no matter how disheartening it gets!

[MtnBiker]

Zell Miller - "I did not leave the Democrat Party, the Democrat Party left me".

[Mr. P]

Zell Miller - "I did not leave the Democrat Party, the Democrat Party left me".

I like Zig-zag Zell...even met the guy once. But his statement indicates that both party's have become something different than what they once were. The GOP becoming what the DNC used to be, and the DNC becoming much more socialist.

[MtnBiker]

Exactly

[remie]

I like Zig-zag Zell...even met the guy once. But his statement indicates that both party's have become something different than what they once were. The GOP becoming what the DNC used to be, and the DNC becoming much more socialist.

I believe the book he wrote was called "A Democrat Party No More" and it is a good read. The similarities between what he described in the democrat party and what is going on in the republican party are very similar.

[Yurt]

there is no such thing as a "permanent shift" in a political party...but considering four or eight years with Hillary leading a Democratically controlled congress, there IS such a thing as permanent damage to our country......I urge you to reconsider......

didn't the repubs used to be the liberals in the 1800s....

[PostmodernProphet]

didn't the repubs used to be the liberals in the 1800s....

nah, they were just normal....and the Dems were the ones with their heads stuck up their *****.....just like now, nothings changed.....

[TheSage]

I like Zig-zag Zell...even met the guy once. But his statement indicates that both party's have become something different than what they once were. The GOP becoming what the DNC used to be, and the DNC becoming much more socialist.


Does the government ever lie, P? Remember when you wouldn't answer that a long time ago? Those were the days.

[Mr. P]

Does the government ever lie, P? Remember when you wouldn't answer that a long time ago? Those were the days.

I remember answering..remember? Where ya been?

[Kathianne]

Something to think about. I really don't like McCain and Hugh Hewitt has definately been behind Romney for a long time, for him to write this, well it will be something I'll think about:

http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/blog


....
There are seven reasons for anyone to support the eventual nominee no matter who it is: The war and six Supreme Court justices over the age of 68.

Folks who want to take their ball and go home have to realize that even three SCOTUS appointments could revolutionize the way elections are handled in this country in a stroke, mandating the submission of redistricting lines to court scrutiny for "fairness."

"It is undeniable that political sophisticates understand such fairness and how to go about destroying it," Justice Souter announced in his diseent in Veith v. Jubilerer, the Pennsylvania redistricting case in which the Court declined by a vote of 5 to 4 to immerse itself in the details of the partisan redistricting of Pennsylvania.

If Democrats control the White House and gain even one of the five seats held by the center-right majority of current justices, this and many other crucial issues are up for legal grabs. When activist judges are more than willing to rewrite rules of long-standing, periods of exile should never be self-imposed "for the good of the party." Exiles can go on a very long time indeed. Ask the Whigs.

They can go on indefinitely when enforced by courts.

The GOP as well is the party committed to victory in Iraq and the wider war. A four year time-out would be a disaster, a period of time in which al Qaeda and its jihadist off-shoots would regroup in some places and continue to spread in others. Iran, even if punished in the months before November, would certainly continue and accelerate its plans under the soft pleadings of a President Obama or Clinton 2.0.

These aren't the years to wish a pox on your primary opponents' heads beyond June.

I don't expect the principals to let up on each other in the two months ahead, and I am especially looking forward to the Ohio and Texas votes.

But it is very possible to play full contact politics without the threat of going home if your team loses. The stakes in the fall are far too high for that.

[Immanuel]

Something to think about. I really don't like McCain and Hugh Hewitt has definately been behind Romney for a long time, for him to write this, well it will be something I'll think about:

http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/blog

BAH! That's what they told us both times GWB ran and look where it got us! Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice... but I'll be damned if I am going to let them fool me a third time!

Immie

[Kathianne]

BAH! That's what they told us both times GWB ran and look where it got us! Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice... but I'll be damned if I am going to let them fool me a third time!

Immie

I've yet to make up my mind, November is a long way off. One thing I do know, I'll vote.

[Immanuel]

I've yet to make up my mind, November is a long way off. One thing I do know, I'll vote.

I will as well, but I am going to be doggone vocal about my disapproval of the status quo in Washington between now and then.

What the heck does my vote mean anyway? Not a doggone thing! Hell, I can't even be sure that they will count my vote let alone count it as I voted.

Right now, I'm thinking write in Senator DeMint's name.

Immie

[Kathianne]

I will as well, but I am going to be doggone vocal about my disapproval of the status quo in Washington between now and then.

What the heck does my vote mean anyway? Not a doggone thing! Hell, I can't even be sure that they will count my vote let alone count it as I voted.

Right now, I'm thinking write in Senator DeMint's name.

Immie

And writing in a vote is a good thing. I know that if I vote Republican, no matter for whom, it won't count. I'm in Illinois. :laugh2:

[5stringJeff]

I think this about sums it up for me...

http://photos-b.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sf2p/v198/165/93/211200274/n211200274_31169189_9666.jpg

[pegwinn]

The GOP lost me when the pols started dicking, again, with the rules of engagement in the war on terror. When the mission was revised, I started looking elsewhere.

Third parties in this country are often single issue parties. A single issue party cannot gather the support needed to win the WH.

I will be hammering my elected reps and whoever the nominee is from now till November. I will be shooting for at least one letter a week starting next week when we see the fallout from yesterday. Then I will post em on my blogspace and pimp the hell out of it hoping someone will read it and go for blood.

So far I am still writing in Ron Paul both in the Texas Primary and in November.

BTW, I officially changed my party affiliation to GOP (from Independent) to be sure I wasn't excluded from the primary in March. I will switch back the next day.

[manu1959]

And writing in a vote is a good thing. I know that if I vote Republican, no matter for whom, it won't count. I'm in Illinois. :laugh2:

i live in california i have decided to write myself in....

[PostmodernProphet]

my vote won't count

my vote won't count

my vote won't count

well, that would make a difference.....living in Michigan there is actually a chance that my vote will count...../e feels the weight of the world on his shoulders......

[Kathianne]

well, that would make a difference.....living in Michigan there is actually a chance that my vote will count...../e feels the weight of the world on his shoulders......

But my local votes do count, which is why I'll vote.

[Immanuel]

i live in california i have decided to write myself in....

I have always said, anyone who wants to be President is not qualified. Guess that leaves you out. :p

Immie